Anti-hoon laws - your opinion?

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Whilst I have no objection to trying to make the roads safer, I personally don't think this approach is the correct one. Even drug dealers have to be convicted in a court of law before there assets are seized, all we would need is cops that don't like our attitude.

"Hooning" is not a defineable behaviour, and leaving it up to someones discrection leads us to very dangerous territory. I know I'd be taking matters like this to court.

[bully]

Any law to save lives is a good law, BUT- the problem with this proposed one is that as Paul stated "Even drug dealers have to be convicted in a court of law before there assets are seized" also add to this illegal fishmen,people smugglers and various others. What happen to the presumption of innocence??? or the need for the Police to prove the case. Remember to be convicted of an offence the police have to PROVE an offence has been committed.

I feel this is another way to make the Police on the beat the proscutor jury and Judge all in one or either a means for the Goverment to be shown as doing something about the problem and to get the media of there backs (hmm more likely the latter)

Anyhow just my ramblings on the issue-

Strikes of George Orwell vision of the future

[caminperth]

Typical Perth lawmakers knee jerk reaction designed to put fear into all drivers - much like their crappy advertising campaigns about drink driving and fatigue and the rest of the nanny s-hite that we should know not to do anyway...

It'll never get off the ground - if they can't even confiscate property from drug dealers properly I find it hard to believe they'll be able to confiscate cars from people who break road rules...

Nanny state? Definitely..

I think I'll go find a nice place in the country away from these politically motivated idiots and build my own city... complete with a drift track of course! Who is with me?!?

[Nizmo]

The thing that scares me about this law is it is so general that it is open to police interpretation of it ..... and as we see with yellow stickers ..... police had different ideas on what is legal and what is not. There really needs to be strict guidelines as what constitutes "hooning"

Otherwise im not really worried .... im trying to participate in more legal forms of motorsport to get my "fix" while not putting my baby or my license at risk.

[MirKz]

i still rekon we need high patrol or something, a particular type of cop who patrols roads etc and are the ONLY ones elligable to give someone a ticket or infringement of anytype with anything to do with the road and its laws

[Lozzle]

Ive read both this thread, silwa's and antilags. Some believe the laws are for the best, others disagree. Some think some bits are good, and other bits should be changed. But it all comes down the the officers discretion doesn't it?

The main crunch really seems to be that theres little or no trust in the police. I wonder why....

[zanda]

one interesting way to look at it may be this:

currently, there are some things (though not so much laws) etc. which the police will not strictly uphold. these relate to their own legal liability etc.

for instance, I beleive that it is common practice for police not to resuscitate head injury cases because they run the risk of a lawsuit if the person survives but is brain damaged.

similarly, they will only approach violent self-harm people under certain circumstances because the law basically does not protect them enough - and later on it could be argued in a civil case that a person had harm influcted on them as a result of the police officer's actions.

the question then, is whether a policeman could reasonably apply this law in the field without concern over repurcussions when, if someone (wealthy enough) thought they had been unfairly singled out, they could be held to account - at their own financial/legal risk.

i.e., if someone was to be stipped of assets on the basis of predjudice against race/vehicle type etc, they may have grounds for appeal against the officer, as well as through the normal legal process.....

however, this still does not address the issue of equality and uniformity of application, since there would still be no impetus on any police-person to apply the law unless they felt it warranted.

so you still have the situation where the guy in the courier truck that nearly cleaned me and about 4 other cars up today on beaufort street (running an intersection) may receive a talking to but an import driver would (probably/likely/possibly - ?) have their car impounded.

[Driver]

Anyone see the 300zx that crashed into a building sight at high speeds on tonites news? he was ok which is good? But things like this dont help..

[caminperth]

I still wanna build my own city complete with a drift track..

[Boostzor]

Oooh sounds good there Cam, im with ya for sure.

Dont know what it is but i pretty much agree with their plan completely. As far as i know the difference between a fine and a dangerous driving charge is pretty big. Sure uve got the whole 'discretion' issue but i cant see that many cops being the ultimate pig from hell, ive never met one.

Plus getting done for dangerous drving 3 TIMES!!! u gotta be pretty darn stupid or insanely unlucky.

Another option is for your car to be auctioned off for you and fees and what not to be taken out and they give u the change. Not that this would be a good thing cause anyone who enjoys their car, as im sure most of us do, knows they will never get what the car is worth to them at an auction.

As for driver education, i think we pay enough taxes already, dont you. Its alot harder to get your license now then when i got mine and that was not all that long ago.

None the less i do agree with power ratings on cars. For example (i know im gonna get shot down for this) No person in their first year of driving should have a car with over 80kw/1000kg or there abouts.

Sounds a bit excessive but ure license is a privledge after all and not a right.

[Kaido_RR]

I am going for my driving test in the next few weeks and have taken a few lesson with a school (ken wife) and i can say the test isn't that hard, you just have to know your stuff and don't forget it.

I find that some of the stuff in the test is stuiped e.g

1. for hill starts u MUST use HANDBRAKE or else u will lose points, i dont understand the point of this i can balance the clutch and the gas so the car wont roll but that doesnt matter

2. have to look every 8seconds in the rear mirrow - i see the point but i have never seen a driver doing this

ect.

some of the stuff is pointless and will be never use by most drivers after they past the test, i think driver education should be taken up a lvl for the people how own HP cars, so do not ban the cars just make it that the driver MUST complete a set amount of adv course

[caminperth]

Boost - excellent! I've got one already!

Seriously though, the power/weight ratio thing sounds great in principle and I completely agree - BUT - how do you enforce it? The only way to check would be to do dyno runs on each car to see if they have been changed from standard... I think the easiest way would be to go on engine capacity and induction.. but again - unfortunately not as satisfying to the Today Tonight public as confiscating cars...

Damn I'm getting cynical.. product of a nanny law state perhaps?

[caminperth]

Devil.. not having a go - but you comments show that of an unexperienced driver...

1. You'll burn the clutch out in a week without the handbrake..

2. You wouldn't keep track of whats behind you, hence becoming a victim of "truck couldn't stop behind me and ran me over" syndrome sooner or later...

Most of it is relevant - it's just that people get lazy and complacent and get away with it... Which is what should really be targeted along with people driving flat out like an idiot in crowded places..

[Kaido_RR]

also, i think UNLESS young peoples attitudes change then there is no point in putting in any new rules becuase people are still going to brake them.

The attitudes of a driver should be look at; for an example i am 17 and own a turbo skyline many people have already told me how stupid i am and that i will kill myself, but it doesnt really bother me as i know what my limits are, also i have NOTHING 2 PROVE which i find that most younger driver seem 2 have something 2 prove that there car is better than yours or that they are cool or a bigger man cuz they can beat you in a drag. unless the attitued of drivers change nothing else will no matter what laws are inplace, i think the government and police have not addressed this problem yet.

[Kaido_RR]

Devil.. not having a go - but you comments show that of an unexperienced driver...

1. You'll burn the clutch out in a week without the handbrake..

2. You wouldn't keep track of whats behind you, hence becoming a victim of "truck couldn't stop behind me and ran me over" syndrome sooner or later...

Most of it is relevant - it's just that people get lazy and complacent and get away with it... Which is what should really be targeted along with people driving flat out like an idiot in crowded places..

cam i know about the clutch but when using the handbrake i do the same thing with balancing the clutch. so i do not see the differences. I pay attion of wat is behide but i do not look every 8second i would say depending on traffic i would say between maybe 10 to 15 (less if it is mod 2 heavy traffic)

Yes i am unexperienced i know that only being driving for a 1yr and only about 4months on man - so its ok know your not having a good

[Boostzor]

Basically the stock spec of the car is enuff i think. If you go to the trouble of modding ure not gonna drive into a wall. Then again if ure daddy buys u a brand new HSV the day u get ure license well....... (man i love sweeping generalisations)

Devil: It would be damn sweet if everyone looked in their mirror every 8 seconds, less right lane riders for sure. Theyd see me making lewd gestures at them and the world would slowly but surely become a better place

Also alot of peoples feet are too small or just too unco to push 3 pedals at the same time so its just to cut down on fools rolling into each other.

[Kaido_RR]

Boostzor, about the stock spec cars are enuff i agree, before i drove the skyline, i drove a vr holden (v6) and 1.8L astra, and they felt very powerful 2 me and i didnt really want anything more. I think untill u get into a fast car u dont really know the differences

[Boostzor]

Umm *scratches head*are you on ure Ps or Ls Devil?

I know when i was on my Ps i used to have my idiot drunken mates hanging out the window and hollering while the only thing that stopped me from doing the same thing was that the law said i couldnt. Sure maybe i was a moron but the law does change people opinion not the other way round.

Its basic human nature that young guys do have something to prove and the only thing thats gonna change that is a few thousand year of evolution. Cmon who hasnt been in their dads car when they first got their license and given some guy a drag at the lights, i wouldnt say many of us.

[caminperth]

Devil - the difference between using the handbrake to hold the car and the clutch is that the clutch is wearing the whole time you're balancing it.. I think thats what you meant to ask?

Boost - love the generalisations.. works well enough for law enforcement.. there I go again...

Back on topic - Silwa has a pretty good thread on this going with some input from a few cops on the list.. well worth the read for different opinions...

[Kaido_RR]

Boostzor, still on the Ls , for sure i have given a few people a drag but when i hit the 80/90km i back off really fast, i am really scaried that something bad will happen. I past the proving something stage. People always ask me why when my dad picks me up from school in the skyline i dont wait around and do a burnout or show of my car. 2 me it is pointless its just a nissan nothing specail, got nothing 2 prove

2 right cam my mistake but it seem 2 take me longer with the handbrake then just balacning it (ps do u balance or handbrake?)

p.s if it sound like i am acting 40, its cuz over the past few weeks i have work out that my life is more important then some streetrace