Lewis Engine 2.2 Stroker Rb20

[n8ive.2.oz]

Not yet, the car has now gone in for paint so the waiting game starts again. They have promised 4-6 weeks, so I guess I can double that.

been back for final tune yet?

[CeJay]

who's doing the paint? Something I need to do eventually.

[dahandfull]

$5k for 200cc.

It will make stuff all difference

i spent 15k on 200cc difference.... complete different motor to drive with!

was it personal preference doing an rb22 over an rb25 tho?

[Harey]

Didn't read all the replys but for the price of the engine, i would just go and get a RB30E and chuck in the spool RB34 stroker kit. would make way more power and tourqe then what the RB22 would. and in total you would probly pay slightly more unless you did all the work.

Bit different, then you have all the conversion issues and legal issues where as the RB22 bolts straight back in.

[Rolls]

Bit different, then you have all the conversion issues and legal issues where as the RB22 bolts straight back in.

Converting an r32 to an rb25 is nothing compared to the cost of building a 22/25/30/34 motor with forged parts. All you need is R33 brakes and a 'stock' ecu.

If it is an r33 then no one is the wiser, just stamp the block with your old number if you are worried. It isn't like it is going to be 'legal' when you are running 20+ psi emissions wise anyway.

There are a few more issues with 25/30/34 but imo the issues are nothing compared to how much better all that extra torque is going to be.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Rolls

[bubba]

There are a few more issues with 25/30/34 but imo the issues are nothing compared to how much better all that extra torque is going to be.

Quoted for truth.

[Roy]

Not being argumentative, its a genuine question. Can you give me the name of an engineer that is going to sign off on the conversion if i have a std ECU and R33 or better brakes?

Reason I ask, is in Vic and NSW the legaility side of things is in my experience a lot harder. In Vic I tried to get my car regod as a 2 seater adn the engineer wanted to go over the whole car in order to approve the VIC Roads/FIA/Cams compliant cage. This meant my gear nob, steering wheel, wheel sizes, seats, intercooler and airfilter, injectors, AFM, , turbo setup, exhaust, ECU all needed to be changed or tweaked to the engineers liking.

Esentially the two engineers I spoke with wanted to go over the whole car and look at every single non std mod. One guy was far more stringent then the other, but IMO if you are going to do an RB25 conversion either buy a car already engineered... buy a compelte stocker, get the RB25 engineered then mod it...or get a far more workable solution going with your engineer.

I think most people recognise the reality of mods being legal yet they still mess with emmissions etc...the question is what will get you a roadworthy or through a defect station?

[Rolls]

Not being argumentative, its a genuine question. Can you give me the name of an engineer that is going to sign off on the conversion if i have a std ECU and R33 or better brakes?

You don't need an engineer, at least not in SA. All I had to do was apply to 'modify a vehicle' and state what I was changing eg conversion to a 25det, I also stated I was putting in a plumbed in catch can, intercooler, 3" exhaust with high flow cat, they replied with for it to be legal I needed an idle emissions test that met the emissions of the r33 gtst, no modifications to the engine, std R33 brakes or larger, below legal exhaust db limit, standard computer (didn't specify R32 or R33) I personally used R32 and nistuned it.

I then had to have a full defect inspection at regency park to verify this, they also check everything else is up to standard.

Reason I ask, is in Vic and NSW the legaility side of things is in my experience a lot harder. In Vic I tried to get my car regod as a 2 seater adn the engineer wanted to go over the whole car in order to approve the VIC Roads/FIA/Cams compliant cage. This meant my gear nob, steering wheel, wheel sizes, seats, intercooler and airfilter, injectors, AFM, , turbo setup, exhaust, ECU all needed to be changed or tweaked to the engineers liking.

Esentially the two engineers I spoke with wanted to go over the whole car and look at every single non std mod. One guy was far more stringent then the other, but IMO if you are going to do an RB25 conversion either buy a car already engineered... buy a compelte stocker, get the RB25 engineered then mod it...or get a far more workable solution going with your engineer.

I think most people recognise the reality of mods being legal yet they still mess with emmissions etc...the question is what will get you a roadworthy or through a defect station?

As soon as you change computer, injectors, turbo etc you need a full spectrum emissions test, also if you change the engine output power above a certain percentage you need a whole bunch of other things done, this almost always requires an engineers certificate.

The way I see it no one is going to put an rb25det in and keep it stock, they are going to up the boost etc etc. As soon as you do this you are essentially lying and the car is not legal, however it will pass an inspection due to you having passed the cert, it is however not legal just because they didn't pick up on it.

So if you do this you might as well just grind the engine number off and stamp your old rb20 one on, or if building a 30det just put the 25 engine number on. Illegal is illegal so what is the difference in doing this? You are dodgying the process either way so if you are willing to be dodgy and not follow the law 100% why not just make it easier for yourself.

Same goes with putting a 2.2L rb20 in, just because they can't see the insides of the motor and pass the inspection doesn't mean you have done it legally. Grinding off an engine number and stamping a new one on is easy as pie.

Do you guys see what I am saying? If you aren't going to follow the law 100% with getting the car certified then why bother doing any of it, just stamp a new engine number on. No more illegal than applying to convert the engine and then putting all your highflow turbo, injectors etc of the day after you passed the inspection.

[bubba]

All I did was take mine over the pits, the inspector got his little extendy mirror out to look at the engine number and said "changed engines hey?" I replied with "yeah snapped the old one" *inspector notes down new engine number*

"got your keys?"

*hand over keys and watch inspector drive off in my baby*

when he handed me my keys back he literally said "thanks for that, I love skylines!"

*drove home now registered with an RB30DET*

Sometimes I really feel for you guys over east

[Rolls]

Yeah I've heard of people getting a change of engine form and putting the new number but saying it is the same capacity, issue is if you go interstate and need a numbers check most the guys will look at the old rb20xiegfh49 and then the new rb25dlfj and go 'hold on, the capacity has changed'.

[Roy]

Rolls, i hear what you are saying and understand. But get caught with an RB20 with forged pistons, nistune and a GT-RS running 22psi and you will be epa'd...and you will have to do what you can to pass an emmissions test.

Get caught in a car with engine numbers that have been ground off and re-stamped then IF questions are asked you would want to prove you arent caught up in re-birthing with re-stamped engine numbers. Worlds apart between doing that and running more boost to make power as if the question is asked by Police or registration body...i would rather not be accused of rebirthing a stolen engine

I understand engines are stamped all the time and some people are not fussed. I understand my car has things on it that make it illegal...but changing rego papers with new RB25 engine number opens up a can of worms. I know from experiences of a friend who got dragged over the coals for a smiliar thing and I happen to know some NSW police who were on a task force hunting doewn stolen and re-birthed cars

Didnt your car come from Vic with an RB25? Was it regoed properly by previous owner?

[Rolls]

Rolls, i hear what you are saying and understand. But get caught with an RB20 with forged pistons, nistune and a GT-RS running 22psi and you will be epa'd...and you will have to do what you can to pass an emmissions test.

Get caught in a car with engine numbers that have been ground off and re-stamped then IF questions are asked you would want to prove you arent caught up in re-birthing with re-stamped engine numbers. Worlds apart between doing that and running more boost to make power as if the question is asked by Police or registration body...i would rather not be accused of rebirthing a stolen engine

I understand engines are stamped all the time and some people are not fussed. I understand my car has things on it that make it illegal...but changing rego papers with new RB25 engine number opens up a can of worms.

How do you get caught with engine numbers being ground off? If you grind them off and restamp them then there is nothing to get caught with, grind it smooth and there is no evidence.

Didnt your car come from Vic with an RB25? Was it regoed properly by previous owner?

It was registered in VIC with the rb20 motor, hence I had to do it properly which I was prepared to do when I bought it. The advantage of doing it properly in SA is you get a piece of paper saying 'exemption, modified vehicle' which doesn't state what has been exempted, most cops read this and assume you've had everything inspected and checked off so I get away with fat rims, exhaust, blah blah blah some how every time I get pulled over, not sure how long my luck will last though.

[Harey]

Converting an r32 to an rb25 is nothing compared to the cost of building a 22/25/30/34 motor with forged parts. All you need is R33 brakes and a 'stock' ecu.

If it is an r33 then no one is the wiser, just stamp the block with your old number if you are worried. It isn't like it is going to be 'legal' when you are running 20+ psi emissions wise anyway.

There are a few more issues with 25/30/34 but imo the issues are nothing compared to how much better all that extra torque is going to be.

My point was that doing an engine conversion involves install hassles and in some states legality hassles.

Restamping a block is a serious offence and to me not an option.

If you are running 20+psi and you get caught you either attempt to pass emissions with the mods or you change back to stock parts. No biggy and your not in that much trouble.

I didnt say the extra torque would not be nice, my point was that there are reasons for the rb22. If not your cup of tea thats fine. I for one have been through quite a few engine changeover issues with my brother and mates cars and its always a hassle even years later depending how you do it (in VIC anyway). Having the only mods completely internal to the engine and undetectable is pretty attractive to me.

[Harey]

How do you get caught with engine numbers being ground off? If you grind them off and restamp them then there is nothing to get caught with, grind it smooth and there is no evidence.

How do you get caught with murder? Just make sure noone sees you and you dispose of the body and there is no evidence.

[Rolls]

How do you get caught with murder? Just make sure noone sees you and you dispose of the body and there is no evidence.

Seriously though I really don't know how you would get caught restamping an engine. My mate has to do it all the time at work when they get new ones from the factory and if you do it properly looks identical to the factory.

You grind it smooth and restamp, unless you do the dodgiest grinding job and don't smooth it off you could never tell, even then it is going to be covered in grease etc and not noticeable.

[Roy]

I am going on what I have been told, I think they do mag particle test or something. You need to machine a fair bit off to get to a level where you can stamp the new number without any metallurgical evidence that there was an original number there. The give away is the hieght of the casting where the stamp is.

Its one of those things, if everything looks std under the bonnet you will be ok. If you have high mount, catch cans, detailed engine bay and you may have been doing something silly when pulled over...the car may get a good once over and if impounded or you need to get it engineered to cover your mods...its just another one of those things to worry about. (Yes I am paranoid, you only get that way when you see a friend get dicked in the situation I just explained, 200SX doing 180km/h...headaches for speeding and more headaches with car legality)

My 2c, when the 20 dies I will be doing the new engine and getting the whole car engineered...just for peace of mind

[Rolls]

If they suspected rebirthing and had someone specifically look and see if it had been then they would probably figure it out, but you'd have to do something pretty sus for them to suspect this.

[Roy]

Or be unlucky with getting busted for doing a bit of a 3am squirt one morning and you and your car be on a watch list because of where it was parked from time to time (person of interest to police)

[Rolls]

Or be unlucky with getting busted for doing a bit of a 3am squirt one morning and you and your car be on a watch list because of where it was parked from time to time (person of interest to police)

I can't imagine a cop cleaning all the grease off you engine block, jacking it up and getting under there with a magnifying glass.

[Roy]

I dont think the Police would ever check by the road. Hell, I dont drive with my rego papers so not sure they would bother calling up the powers to be to get the number they should be checkign for?!?! But if the car is seized and searched...for whatever reason and there are a few, then I suppose it only becomes an issue then. Even then if you can get a letter from your mechanic I am sure that would explain things

I will be going through this in 2 weeks as my new car doesnt have matching numbers so will see how far a nice smile gets me at Vic Roads