Track Battle Australian Time Attack Series

[JET200]

:thumbsup:

Yep, good contingent from SAU VIC competing in this event for sure. I'm entered with others filling in forms this and next week.

[JET200]

Sorry, but all you need for a televised series is a willingness to pay whatever they ask for the coverage. Plenty of categories have gone that way over the years, and in 90% of cases they can afford a season or 2, and then if it is successful the tv cost goes too high as the production companies get greedy. Think Porsche cup, mini cup, utes, fford, targa, production cars alone in the last few years.

Long term, seriously large sponsor committments of the sort required to build a $300k $uperlap car require multi year TV committments, and a track record of delivery.

Time attack has a long way to go before it shows it is anything other than the next big fad after hula hoops, yo-yos, and drifting.

There are seriously flawed fundamentals around cost and control competing at the top level, and if only 2-3 cars have a shot at winning a class, the other 10-12 cars spending 50-100k are going to disappear very quickly. Also there is no attempt to link state based feeder series like the existing supersprint/time attack champs, and national travel costs are a killer for most self funded competitors.

A valid point, but when the production company is owned by one of the organisers, who is actually a car enthusiast, its not quite the same situation.

Name one other event where entry fees of $380 or $580 bought you TV coverage?? Exactly. Try $3800 or $5800

All of the points you are brining up are completely valid and things we have looked at to overcome. We're not jumping into this trying to cash in, we've been wokring in this scene for a long time anmd treaded very carefully into it to help do it right. Cant please everyone though I guess.

[evil_weevil]

So can I ask...

what will the difference be in this time attack series than the CAMS state supersprint? that has what..8 or so rounds a year?

that has been going for years, a fair few of the WTA cars do that series. never been televised, I think this is the first year its been sponsored (happy to corrected as always!) but each year the entry list just gets bigger and bigger.

so if you want to appeal to people to enter, how would you sell this new series to the regular supersprinters?

[The Bogan]

My thinking is Time Attack is Super Springs by another name, its like the State of origin of Sprints but with more hype and stickers.

I love WTA, big dollar, highly developed, monsters on steroids, even with the controversies, I will be a big fan boy.

Other wise its a Super Sprint which can be had every month at a local track near you.

On that note, bring it to NSW, I'm always willing to have a go if my cars going, and the price is right, I mean I can do EC for around $200ish and Wakie tor $150ish.

[Russman]

I own a drift and time attack car, so you can do both you know. in fact, drifting has helped me drive a RWD time attack car much better

I agree with this. I've dont the same. Still love my drifting and it only helps you steer a car straight. Too may people out there with RWD circuit cars that can't drive or correct a sideways car.

[Russman]

My thinking is Time Attack is Super Springs by another name, its like the State of origin of Sprints but with more hype and stickers.

I love WTA, big dollar, highly developed, monsters on steroids, even with the controversies, I will be a big fan boy.

My thoughts exactly It's just a local track day on roids. It's awesome.

[Snowman]

I agree - these types of events mean that cars you don't normally see at your usual club sprint meets (because they might run with different clubs - or come from different states) all come together in the one place.

Although I still do think its a shame that Porka's/Lambo's etc can't come though. They would add another cool dimension I reckon.

[The Dan]

Still not quite right

Toyo pulled out when the economic crisis hit in 2008 under dirtect orders from Japan HQ, not becuase they wanted to in Australia. The new owners weren't able to secure any major sponsorship, but we will be announcing very shortly ourt naming right sponsor and they ARE getting behind ADGP. Beleive it or not, not every drifter is a jobless bum ( although won't deny they exist). look at motorcross riders. before the go pro they usually look like broke bums as well.

Your also wrong about combining them to make buck. combining them to ensure the future of both series. Once either one can sustain themselves we are looking at running them separately. If enough poeple supoprt it we will, if they complain on the internet and dont enter, we wont be able to. I don't really like when people presume other people's motives for helping do something. Australia needs a national drift series to grow the sport and time attack drivers were crying out for more than one event to drive their car at, and we're giving TV coverage for both. Its not about cash, its about helping the scene Ive been a part of for a long time, but you do need to make the money back you invest, which is a LOT.

I own a drift and time attack car, so you can do both you know. in fact, drifting has helped me drive a RWD time attack car much better

Your negativity isn't going to help either sport

Fineline here on Elite Racing computer

you are the one who is wrong. Time attack is doing very nicely thank you. Call it sprints, call it what you like its the same thing.

And yes, i am aware that every drifter isnt a spastic flat capper but unfortunately that element is largely the only group it appeals to as a spectator event.

If you're referring to me in your comment re complaining and not entering you may well be right. We already have time attack/sprint/hillclimb events out the wazoo up here. I will by all means enter your event when it is in my part of the world but like many others I certainly wouldnt try and pursue a national series around the country.

As for my negativity. Hell no! I am positive that combining drifting and t/a can only be detrimental to t/a in the long run. Nothing negative there at all. Just a factual observation from someone who has been around a while. As a t/a participant I resent the fact that you see the need to combine the 2. Colour it any way you like but to my mind money can be the only motivation for such a decision.

As for drifting teaching you to drive, what a load of horseshit. did you ever think that if you spent your drifting time doing circuit work you would have imporved that much any way. Finding the limit of traction is a far more important feature of circuit work than drifting. Their goal is to lose it as quickly as possible.

anyhoos, fire away, its your event and you can run it any way you see fit. Just dont post it on a public forum and not expect to hear opinions.

[DCIEVE]

Sounds like your the only one getting your knickers in a twist over drifters being involved. I'll qualify by saying I'm not a big fan of drifting but once you get over the wow factor of the latest time attack cars or the suspense of finding out just how fast they can go, there isn't a lot to keep spectators interested. Of the super sprints I've been to you would be luckly if there was anyone in the crowd that wasn't a family member or close friend of the guys on the track! DA attracted an order of magnitude larger crowd.

Edited August 18, 2011 by DCIEVE

[phunky_monkey]

As for drifting teaching you to drive, what a load of horseshit. did you ever think that if you spent your drifting time doing circuit work you would have imporved that much any way. Finding the limit of traction is a far more important feature of circuit work than drifting. Their goal is to lose it as quickly as possible.

I'm not going to get involved in the other aspect, but this is simply untrue.

Drifting teaches a level of car control that is very beneficial to circuit work. Look at guys like Adam Newton who began as a drifter, and is now at the top of his game in Tarmac Rallying and circuit work. Top drifters are finding traction to enable speed and accuracy, not just losing it, so unless you've tried it then perhaps best not to comment on it.

[The Bogan]

Top drifters are finding traction because there are events they can attend, what tracks hold regular drift events ?

[hrd-hr30]

there's no doubt that anything that teaches car control skills helps you drive right on the limit, because you're comfortable with the car moving around and confident you can control it. The more time you spend doing that, the more instinctive it becomes.

The breeding ground for car control skills always used to be motorkhanas, and to lesser extents dirt autocrosses and khanacrosses. They still are, but so is drifting. I have no doubt they help people become more skilled drivers.

[FineLine]

The old sports adage is forever true, The only way to get good at something is by doing it. You want to go sideways, practice it. You want to keep a car straight, practice it.

Even doing the latter you'll see all the sideways action you can handle as you explore the limits.

Throwing someones name out there as an example means jack shit. He may well have been a good circuit driver regardlss of wether he went kiddy skidding or not.

Yes at least they do learn car control whilst drifting motor khana, skidpan or whatever. What that has to do with kiddyskidding and time attack being lumped in the one event buggers me.

[djr81]

Marrying two different types of motorsport is always a problem. But at the end of the day if the promotor does not make a return the events wont continue. Having drifters & time attack together may well help to get enough entries and spectators to make the thing pay.

For what it is worth Sprints events were going along quite nicely before someone decided to call some of them time attack. And before the fitted hat brigade tore up all the sand traps.

[Marlin]

I'm staying well out of this, but am enjoying the reading immensley

[JET200]

This is turning into quite an interesting read I must say

In regards to TA being a glorified Super Sprint, I dont agree. I have attended enough Super Sprints in NSW and they were mostly old people in open wheelers and MX-5s. THe cars that weren't, were on slicks and not one single category suited my car. Also, every person there was a family member or friend. No crowd what so ever.

Time Attack is for tuner style cars running street tyres . Yes, I realise the top cars are far beyond that but they are built with almost no rules to become fantasy machines that are awesome to watch!

And in regards to drifting making you a better circuit driver, everyone who has tried drifting (properly that is) seems to agree with me, while those who havn't done it mostly don't. I've seen many circuit guys get sideways and dont know what to do. They either crash or drive real sloppy. Getting sideways for me is not out of the ordinary so you tend to push harder, look for the limit and do it with confidence.

Back on topic.

Event is going to be awesome. Finally Time Attack will see TV air time!

....... and Ash will blow a diff or hit the wall or both

[The Dan]

I always thought the issue with having two different events at the one place at the same time was due to the fact that drifting is prone to more car breakages and therefore more track down time for the racers.

Is this not the case? It has been every time I have seen it

[Duncan]

This is turning into quite an interesting read I must sayIn regards to TA being a glorified Super Sprint, I dont agree. I have attended enough Super Sprints in NSW and they were mostly old people in open wheelers and MX-5s. THe cars that weren't, were on slicks and not one single category suited my car. Also, every person there was a family member or friend. No crowd what so ever.Time Attack is for tuner style cars running street tyres .

The format of sprinting and time attack is identical. And look how hard F1 work to make qualifying interesting....I genuinely wish you all the best getting audiences interested in the difference between a 1.28s and a 1.29s lap of Eastern Creek. I love it....but I don't kid myself that is a mainstream interest.

Also, I strongly agree about the anti-modern issues in CAMS supersprinting and racing, and I put my effort/time/work where my opinions are there, eg trying to get skylines covered under sports car rules, and trying to work with IPRA to make turbo friendly rules (and trying with sports sedans too....not that I got far!). The sooner grids are full of 20yo skylines instead of 40yo geminis the better.

I always thought the issue with having two different events at the one place at the same time was due to the fact that drifting is prone to more car breakages and therefore more track down time for the racers.Is this not the case? It has been every time I have seen it

Mostly the issue for tracks is the damage drifters do to the edges from what I've seen. Very few tracks welcome drift events which makes it damn hard for those guys to practice.

BTW....if drifting makes a better circuit racer, why don't 50m freestyle swimmers train as synchronised swimmers?

[Risking]

It is just a super sprint at the end of the day.

I also believe and have it on good information that the nsw state super sprint panel are in the process of trying to add a "time attack" category to their championship line up.

Just to give all those cars at WTAC somewhere else to compete.

Anything unreg will require a cams logbook of any category an the cars will need to fit into the new "time attack" regulations they will potentially put in place.

Same sort of thing they did with SVD.

[evil_weevil]

whats wrong with open wheelers and MX5's? scared of them?

seriously - those events sell out for entrants. isnt that what u want as well? ever sprint I have done for the last 4 years has been sold out.

anyhoo, get this to NSW, I'll check it out, cant say I'll enter yet as I dont see anything wrong with the current sprints.