Attn: Freebaggin or others

[WLD747]

AVO in melbourne got the turbo for $2,780. But you got to make your own lines and stuff.

[R31Nismoid]

2,700 :confused: They are ripping you for all your worth at that price.

Especially considering they are buying the bits at a total cost of well under $2000.

[4door_Sleeper]

The hybrid turbo built by Matt and others cost around $400 I thought (mainly for machining - use an standard R33 Turbo; the exhaust housing of a VG30BB turbo, and a T04 compressor wheel).

This is a budget upgrade as good or better than some of the $2000 hyflow options.

[EnricoPalazzo]

yeh i would agree guy, the turbo has lasted longer then his engine, and its almost been a year that hes had the turbo without any major dramas.

Freebaggin: Can u elaborate more on this whole injectors and smashing ring lands theory?

cheers

[Cubes]

Enrico,

I've also noticed stocker RB25's holding together with bigger injectors at higher power levels.

When an injector is pushed to its limits the spray pattern is affected. Not all injectors may be affected it may only be one that starts stuffing up and may not stuff up straight away either.

This will hardly show up on AFR's as the AFR's are averaged out over the 6 pots.

Without good fuel atomisation you get a crappy burn/lean out hence why possibly detonation occurs which sends combustion temperatures through the roof eventually smashing ring lands. This is also why sequential injecton makes more power over batch injection, better fuel atomosation = better fuel economy & power.

I think..

[gobiz]

4-door sleeper: I've sent an email to Tim, will update you.

Still haven't heard Sydneykid's, Steve's and others opinions re:this turbo.

What do you guys think?

[Freebaggin]

Enrico,

 

I've also noticed stocker RB25's holding together with bigger injectors at higher power levels.

 

When an injector is pushed to its limits the spray pattern is affected. Not all injectors may be affected it may only be one that starts stuffing up and may not stuff up straight away either.

This will hardly show up on AFR's as the AFR's are averaged out over the 6 pots.

 

Without good fuel atomisation you get a crappy burn/lean out hence why possibly detonation occurs which sends combustion temperatures through the roof eventually smashing ring lands. This is also why sequential injecton makes more power over batch injection, better fuel atomosation = better fuel economy & power.

 

I think..

I'm with you Joel.

Some other ideas:

Maybe the pulsing of the injector starts to get chaotic at say greater than 90% duty cycle, or at even lower duty cycle but when it has high fuel pressures and you get insufficient fuel when under high load for longish periods like when winding up to 180km/h in fourth.

Maybe by raising fuel pressure (via Malpassi reg for eg) you also reduce flow to injectors as higher pressure for the same given fuel supply = less flow according to flow dynamics I think. But some people say that with big fuel pump like Bosch 044, the fuel supply presssure and flow is so huge it should be OK.

Maybe by using a reg to give you high pressure you also cause differential pressure drop across rail from one side to the other or within the rail and say cyl 1 or 6 gets less fuel than others but as Joel said it won't show up in average A/F ratio out the tail pipe.

With big injectors, you get high flow at low pressure which I think is better and it gives the right spray pattern and even fuel supply across rail.

BTW RBVS, Joel also might know more about rebuild options as he's doing one now for RB30.

[Cubes]

I think of it as an injector having an efficiency range + or -.

When you get out of the efficiency range it simply starts dumping the fuel in not spraying it.

Hence why SK states the RB injectors don't have trouble with was it +15% extra fuel pressure?!?! I can't rememeber. He's said or typed it a few times now.

+ the fact of if the injector is running a high duty cycle it is obviously going to valve bounce if you like (Tims words).

[gobiz]

freebaggin, what turbo is the JMS R33 using?

I'm sure he's got manifold etc done.

[Freebaggin]

freebaggin, what turbo is the JMS R33 using?  

I'm sure he's got manifold etc done.

They don't own car anymore, but started off with T67 Turst then went to AX6 Apexi I think. Not 100% sure.

[EnricoPalazzo]

thanks guys. i will be upgrading the turbo soon, and was hoping to be able to get by with only a good fpr and bosch 044, then eventually get some decent injectors.

will the injectors be able to deliver enough fuel? for say 270rwkws?

[RBVS]

yea i was thinking about what you said with cars with stock injectors dont seem to last. Also i think it is the spray pattern not covering evenly , hence other spots on the pistons not being cooled.

freebaggin: i have been looking into the rb30 bottom, just have to check iv got room to move 30mm up.

yea if anyone can give a price or advice for building a 25 or 30 bottom end would be help full, just the build as im going to try slapping the head back on and dropping it back in to keep cost down.

[whatsisname]

Dean, might I suggest saving for upgraded injectors and not trying to push the stockies to mid/high 200rwkw levels! Take it from me mate, an extra 1k or so (for 550's) now is better than replacing a piston or two down the track.

Do a search and see how many RB25DET rebuilds have occured with stock injector, bigger turbo, GTS25t's. I got away with it for a while. I "may" have got away with it for longer with a very conservative tune? I use to post on here supporting the 044, reg and higher f/press combo. Not anymore!

Of course if you'd like to go the whole hog, do forgies, lower the comp ratio and go for big boost... then go for it mate! It's heaps of fun

[EnricoPalazzo]

yeh matty, ive had a big think about it, and everytime a rb25 ringland goes, everyone blames it on the tune. only recently did u guys think it could have somethin to do with pushin the stockie injectors too far. this could definately have adverse effects on spray pattern.

u had stock inj when engine went

boostd was the same.

there are probably many more cases.

needless to say, i think once my car is retuned, ill keep it like that for a while then think about a bigger turbo.

cyas

[gobiz]

Whatsisname,

What turbo have you got on your car? What's your setup?

(admire your 291rwkws!)

[whatsisname]

G'day gobiz, my turbo is a bit of a bitza. Sorry I can't give you any hard and fast data on it

Here's what I do know:

It's a plain bearing Garrett based T3/T4 with a T04E 0.60 comp housing and a 0.64 exhaust housing. The exh wheel is quite large and it's been backcut. The exh housing has been machined out to fit. It has what those in the know stated as a very big comp wheel squeezed into the T04E housing.

On my engine the turbo has damn near the same response as a HKS GT2835ProS. With a touch more power and a quite a bit more peak torque (similar boost). Same dyno same day.

[RBVS]

freebaggin: what injectors are you using?

how much did they cost?

[rbs13]

whatsisname, this turbo wouldnt be suitable for rb20 would it? i dont care if boost doesnt come on till 3500-4000 at the moment. mite be swapping till rb25 in the future. is the exhaust housing similar to vl turbo? or just a .64 sized t3 off the shelf item? what boost are your running?

[4door_Sleeper]

Matty, is your turbo the same as Boostd's (Mat's). If I recall the specs on his were as follows:

used an standard R33 Turbo; the exhaust housing of a VG30 BB, and a T04 compressor wheel. Vtrim Comp with groove in comp cover snout. Exhaust bored out to flange.

machined at Russel Engineering.

If not, bo you have any info on how your turbo compared with Mats

[gobiz]

4door, what sort of power has boostd got?

At what psi?