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R33Gts-T With Kkr430

Raven33

By Raven33,
in Engines & Forced Induction

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Raven33 Enthusiast

Raven33

Posted
Posted

Howdy people,

As the title says, I have an R33gts-t with a KKR430 turbo, which for those who don't know - uses a v-band clamp to secure the dump pipe to the turbo - aside from the KKR dump pipe the exhaust is stock.

The first time this started happening, I was still getting to know the car, so took it to a dyno/mechanic place, where they quickly explained what was happening and fixed it for no cost (what a champ eh?)

He also started telling me about some options to prevent this from ever happening again, but they were very permanent solutions that involved wielding and would be better suited to me after I had the exhaust upgraded. (yet to happen)

I've lost count of how many times I've taken the v-band off, cleaned the joining surface of the turbo/dump pipe, I've used 2 different types of silicone on different occasions, all seem to have the same short term fix, by the end of the week it's leaking again, it's not always from the same point, (using a piece of hose) I can hear it leaking from the under-side right now, the time before that it was leaking out the side facing the strut tower.

I can't help thinking that it's something I'm doing wrong, I've searched around for tips on fitting v-bands, I've tried loosening the front pipe at the cat while fitting the v-band (best tip so far), tapping the v-band clamp with a rubber mallet as I tighten it, I've used Permatex Ultra Copper (sensor-safe high temp RTV silicone) and Permatex High-Temp RED RTV silicone - I've noticed the ultra copper seems to work a little better.

My method:

*only ever taken the dump pipe off when the car had been sitting over night*

1. Crawl under the car, loosen (not remove) the nuts that hold the front pipe to the cat

2. Place jack under the front pipe to support the exhaust while undoing the v-band, then undo the v-band.

3. using every ounce of my patience, I clean the joining surfaces using P600 grit sand paper, frequently getting the vacuum in to suck up any excess powered silicone (takes about an hour, any cleaning tips would be awesome)

4. I follow the directions on the silicone tube - apply an even continuous 2-6mm bead of silicone to 1 surface, join the dump pipe to the turbo, then hand tighten (ok maybe a 1/2 turn over hand tight)

5. allow the silicone to set for about an hour or so, then go back in and tighten it up. (this is where I would be tapping with the mallet as I tighten)

6. tighten up the nuts on the cat/remove jack.

Sometimes I've tried taking it for a drive right after finishing step 6, other times I've left it over night, doesn't seem to make much of a difference.

I think that's any and all relevant details I can offer, if I think of something else I'll post it up. If anyone reading this could tell me if it's something I'm doing wrong, maybe you know of a better silicone option, or maybe something I can do to support the weight of the front/dump pipe.

Love tinkering with my car, but this is starting to getting really annoying and time consuming.... not to mention repetitive.

Thanks for reading, and sorry for the wall of text

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https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/373584-r33gts-t-with-kkr430/
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MrStabby Grand Master

MrStabby

Posted
Posted

The problem is probably that the exhaust is levering on the joint. Nothing you can do with the joint will fix that - it cant be strong enough to hold such a long lever (and silicon wont stand the heat ). You need to have the exhaust hung correctly as bubba says, and when its hung correctly the joint should meet cleanly, so there's no force on it. If you have to pull and push to get the joint to meet up you still have a problem. Does your front pipe have a flexible section?

EDIT: didnt see the bit about high temp silicon - what temp will it stand?

Raven33 Enthusiast

Raven33

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Would you believe it, the tubes don't say what temp they're able to handle - I remember it being on the packaging, but can't remember what temps, only that the ultra copper was higher.

I don't think my front pipe has a flexible section, it's got heat shielding around it till just before the cat - so it's hard for me to tell, on my first attempt i couldn't hold the dump pipe to the turbo while trying to get the v-band on, that's why I loosened the nuts on the cat while fitting the v-band.

Sounds like my best option is go to an exhaust place, find out if they know what I'm talking about and go from there.

bubba Grand Master

bubba

Posted
Posted

Thanks for the speedy reply bubba.

I'm fairly certain that I don't have that hanger, how/where does it attach to the exhaust?

I can't remember if it bolts to the front or the rear of the cat (GTR workshop manual has an exploded exhaust diagram that shows it) but it basically bolts to the gearbox Xmember (or mount) and to flange of the cat.

I'm currently trying to chase one down before I bolt my exhaust up >_<

MrStabby is on the money with the levering of the exhaust :thumbsup:

boostn0199 Grand Master

boostn0199

Posted
Posted

I had tgat sort of v band design on my hypergear turbo no matter what i did it eventually leaked so what i did was weld it up where tge v band is and you can just unbolt the rear turbo flange if you need to remove turbo or dump its luke a normal dump pipe now had it for few years no problem.

tridentt150v Grand Master

tridentt150v

Posted
Posted

x3 for exhaust hanger

x1 for while you are at it replace the turbo with something better

+1 for a better turbo

I wouldn't over capitalise on this setup, it'd be dead money. Make do with what you have and when you get a good turbo then you can spend $$$ on the changes that you need to make.

toffy Veteran

toffy

Posted
Posted

a nice free flowing exhaust will help along with proper hangers to make sure the v-band isn't taking the weight of the exhaust . No silicone will be good enough to handle the heat of the hot side of a turbo , get both surfaces planed . p.s kkr430 aren't thaaaat bad :ph34r:

Raven33 Enthusiast

Raven33

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Yeh this isn't one of the dodgy e-bay fake KKR's, it's not as bad as you guys are harping on - it had seen 4 years of use before I had it(some of those years it was running boost too high, massive missing), and it had been with me for about a year before I had to get the core replaced...

Because it's KKR and has cost me a total of $360.... you think it's a good idea to replace a turbo that's working perfectly well for what is needed? when the exhaust is failing like shit, has a R34 SMIC, stock ecu, a very stock setup..... soooo many other places where the money would be better spent.

Spending $1000+ on a turbo for this would be dead money.... and probably just give me the boost to do some REAL damage to the engine....

Crazy thought, but how about you guys get all the info needed before you start directing someone to blow a fair amount of money on a new turbo. Some of you guys have quiet the rep here, spouting shit like that isn't gonna help anyone.

I can picture you guys on the side of the road shouting "booost it up bru - do a fully sick skid"

Now back on topic for those who actually had useful suggestions/questions

Scotty: there hasn't been any wielding done near the turbo/dump pipe, so I don't think it would be warped, also the leak being in a different place every time doesn't fit with that.

boostn0199: That's what the mechanic I took it too in the first place suggested, but he said it would be wise to get the exhaust up grade first - just save a lil bit of trouble.

As I said earlier "Sounds like my best option is go to an exhaust place, find out if they know what I'm talking about and go from there."

Thanks for the input....

Raven33 Enthusiast

Raven33

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

I think he was more talking about 2 birds with 1 stone kinda scenario, get the dump pipe wielded on, turbo back exhaust, hi-flow cat etc etc.

but if I can get away with just a hanger on the dump or front pipe without it costing upwards of $500 then that would be what I'm aiming for.

There are a few other things that I need to fix before I start seeking bigger power. It's got idle and mid-range problems, it would be nice to be able to rule out the exhaust leak as the cause before I start looking else where.

Edit: he might have also been talking about wielding a flange onto the turbo and dump pipe so they could be bolted on - was quite a while ago.

Edited by Raven33
tridentt150v Grand Master

tridentt150v

Posted
Posted

Yeh this isn't one of the dodgy e-bay fake KKR's, it's not as bad as you guys are harping on - it had seen 4 years of use before I had it(some of those years it was running boost too high, massive missing), and it had been with me for about a year before I had to get the core replaced...

Because it's KKR and has cost me a total of $360.... you think it's a good idea to replace a turbo that's working perfectly well for what is needed? when the exhaust is failing like shit, has a R34 SMIC, stock ecu, a very stock setup..... soooo many other places where the money would be better spent.

Spending $1000+ on a turbo for this would be dead money.... and probably just give me the boost to do some REAL damage to the engine....

Crazy thought, but how about you guys get all the info needed before you start directing someone to blow a fair amount of money on a new turbo. Some of you guys have quiet the rep here, spouting shit like that isn't gonna help anyone. I can picture you guys on the side of the road shouting "booost it up bru - do a fully sick skid"

Now back on topic for those who actually had useful suggestions/questions

Scotty: there hasn't been any wielding done near the turbo/dump pipe, so I don't think it would be warped, also the leak being in a different place every time doesn't fit with that.

boostn0199: That's what the mechanic I took it too in the first place suggested, but he said it would be wise to get the exhaust up grade first - just save a lil bit of trouble.

As I said earlier "Sounds like my best option is go to an exhaust place, find out if they know what I'm talking about and go from there."

Thanks for the input....

I actually said not to over capitalise on that turbo.......its a cheap turbo built to a price to do a job.......but its not a long term keeper. So spout all you like, I told you not to waste your money>>>theres an old saying "you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear" and it applies here!

bubba Grand Master

bubba

Posted
Posted

Hate to be contrary but there is another old saying "you can't polish a turd" but Mythbusters proved you can.

I'm a big one for budget racing and bang-for-buck. The turbo you have might not be the best option out there but if it does the job without too many cons then cool bananas. :banana:

tridentt150v Grand Master

tridentt150v

Posted
Posted

What I'm trying to say is spend only what you have to, don't go all out on that turbo, enjoy it for what it is...a cost effective solution, but not long term.

If you over capitalise then you are wasting $$$$ that you will never get back - but then again thats cars anyway...lol

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