Twin Turbo Gallardo & An Ams Gtr

[Cowboy1600]

Its not attention seeking, its simply putting fan boys in their place.

As for the superbikes.....how is it fair to have a 1000cc twin up against 1000cc 4's?...simple common sense tells you a 4 potter is going to make more power than a twin, so bloody oath the twins should have a capacity advantage.

Same reason turbo cars have capacity multipliers

Yeah, but you wouldn't walk into a Hells Angels clubhouse and start shouting at the inhabitants about what shit bikes Harley make, would you? It's a question of respect.

And of course it's fair. If twins cannot make the power, than stop making twins. Simple. But no, they stick with twins because it's tradition and even sabotage their V4 MotoGP bikes by having the firing order of a twin for traditions sake.

Look at what Honda did back in the 90s. Having 250cc more was such a rort, they made a twin, flogged the shit out of Ducati. It wasn't long after that that the 4's were allowed 1000ccs, so Honda when back to their roots.

If you cannot compete on level pegging, the it's not really fair, is it? Again, in SBK there is a single factory team with a 200cc advantage competing against a bunch of privateers. It isn't called the "Ducati Cup" for no reason.

[star32]

If you are reffering to star32 Marko, plan is to take it to the next Motive GTR challenge and see how it goes.

Cheers.

Rob.

david - how is your drag r32 coming along?

u can only imagine how much the guy pumped into the lambo to convert to twin turbo + other engines mods etc...i bet he has spent more on his engine than the purchase of a gtr

heck - lets race a mild worked gtr with an 'off its guts' porsche, that would be another fair race too!

besides that, the r35 smashes the lambo up to 230kmh?

quick story:

the guy that i bought my adm gtr from is a very good driver, he used to pull 1:07 around wakefield in my adm gtr on slicks, factory power (so now we all know he is more than capable). he recently bought the BSM gtr to add to his awesome collection of cars. he flew to philip island to track test the r35 & his words "i simply couldnt come to terms with the sheer acceleration, braking & cornering ability of the r35". i think i could giveway the gear shifter & clutch for a much better car.

r13nismoid - comparing factory cars is a great test, they were engineered to run this level of power & not everyone modifies their vehicles (other than us donkeys on sau haha)

[Roy]

This is true but the zr1 has 700hp, the gtr is true engineering with much less hp we all want an r35, just admit it

Ahh, that is funny. So having power is cheating, but having two pedals, two clutches, AWD, turbos and all the stability computers in the world is "engineering" and fair play.

Personally all "sports/super cars" should be balls to the wall challenging cars to drive. Think GT2RS, R500 Caterham, ZR1, VIper ACR etc. Grand Tourers can have all the tech they want to make them mega safe and allow the wife to drive as fast as the husband

And before people jump down my throat saying that a fast R35 is challenging to drive...sure. Any car is challenging to a degree to get speed out of. But I can tell you that last year when I was at Silverstone in a Caterham and there was an R35, I was working waaay harder to be that little bit quicker than him.

I love cars so have all the respect for R35s because of what they can do. I can promise you I dont want one.

[Marko R1]

Hey rob - your gtr was a beast when I saw it at crd, have u run it yet?

Roy - chev invested more r&d in power whereas nissan invested more in technology...imagine the gtr with 700hp? Horses for courses really, depends on what tickles your fancy, I appreciate both cars! Is the zr1 priced the same as the gtr?

[Roy]

this. had the red flag been waved a minute or 2 later then Dick Johnson would've won that year and Jim Richards and Mark Skaife would've had DNF next to their name.

That's not even true. The Olofsson/Crompton GTR was already on wets and not far behind the Shell Sierra. If the thing had gone on for another 2 minutes the Winfield team car would have most likely won

[Roy]

Hey rob - your gtr was a beast when I saw it at crd, have u run it yet?

Roy - chev invested more r&d in power whereas nissan invested more in technology...imagine the gtr with 700hp? Horses for courses really, depends on what tickles your fancy, I appreciate both cars! Is the zr1 priced the same as the gtr?

I have no idea what they cost. I think the ZR1 may be a little more expensive in the US, but then again I have read that the GTR is sold at a loss so...who knows the facts with fanbois all fighting for their corners.

I agree that what makes all these cars interesting is that they achieve their speeds differently. And funny enough because of that you end up with different natured cars which will appeal to different owners You say imagine a GTR with 700hp. I say imagine a ZR1 with AWD and DSG!

I hope car manufacturers dont all run down that same road getting carried away with numbers rather then what their car's owners have typically wanted. My pet hate was when I bought my R32 that Nissan had the DNA of the original GTR and the previous GTS-R model and instead of producing an alloy guarded, multi-throttled twin turbo RB23 that would have weighed 1250kgs, they created the BNR32 GTR. I love it for what it is but if all car manufacturers built knock offs of other cars it would be very boring

What I would guess is that Chev spent very little developing the Z06 -> ZR1 compared to what Nissan would have spent developing the GTR. Chev spent a fair bit of money designing the fist LS1 from memory because they knew that they couldn't afford too many different engine lines so their truck engine had to be able to double as their performance engine. To me, that is what engineering is about. A tight budget, a broad functional requirement which challenges all facets of the project (ie engineering is always about compromise). Credit to Nissan too, but they had a blank sheet of paper so the GTR was never really going to be much of a compromise...evidences by the fact that they are relying on technology transfer and flow on to other models to help justify the loss they are taking on the actual car

[Marko R1]

I am definitely not 1 of of those "fanbois"...for me its simple, the most appeal lies on what sets the quickest laptime and obviously needs to be affordable.

When I was riding bikes, I went from an r1 in 99 to a zx10r in 05 then a gixxer thou in 06 - reason is that these bikes were the benchmark for those relevant years. I am not brand loyal whatsoever, so much so if the new wrx or evo was quicker than the gtr, I'd more than likely sell my gtr for 1 of those. I know its shallow but this is me.

[Marko R1]

Then again, I wouldn't let go of my adm gtr - the thing is starting to appreciate and its been in the family since 95

[Roy]

I am definitely not 1 of of those "fanbois"...

To be clear I wasnt calling you a fanboi. Just those that argue until their blue in the face that one is better then the other....rather then just accept they are different. When the ZR1 first came out I was reading US forums and the ZR1 has some pretty ignorant fanbois...just like many of the GTR fans.

[Marko R1]

No offence taken at all roy but at the end of the day, u gotta support your own colours and more so when they have such a dominating history of wins

[zebra]

Proof R35 is a boat???

LOL

[ctjet]

if it had a better looking front end it would probably be a lot more popular

but it doesnt, so it not

[mad082]

I am definitely not 1 of of those "fanbois"...for me its simple, the most appeal lies on what sets the quickest laptime and obviously needs to be affordable.

When I was riding bikes, I went from an r1 in 99 to a zx10r in 05 then a gixxer thou in 06 - reason is that these bikes were the benchmark for those relevant years. I am not brand loyal whatsoever, so much so if the new wrx or evo was quicker than the gtr, I'd more than likely sell my gtr for 1 of those. I know its shallow but this is me.

for me that means bugger all. why? many reasons. 1: it wasn't me that set the lap. 2: while a car might be faster on 1 track, on another it may be slower than the competition. 3: it says very little about how the car drives in the real world. it could be the worst car to actually drive on the road in everyday situations.

regarding my first point, how fast some random professional driver did a lap on some random track is pointless. there would be cars out there that might do slower laps than others in the hands of a racing driver, but when put in the hands of a regular punter they may do faster laps because they are easier to drive near the limit. i see it a little bit like some P plater with some powerful car that when you see them drive off they bunny hop and grind gears.

[Marko R1]

point proven - the car is soooo well built that it is water tight

maybe i am a bit of a gtr fan, todays shirt for Marko as per pic!

Proof R35 is a boat???

LOL

[zebra]

You guys can keep your fancy lambo's and GTRs

I'll go for the old bigger is better thing

[R31Nismoid]

I doesn't do fast lap times though ...

[ctjet]

yeah ok, half the horses and ill take the SS over a gallardo and GTR

[zebra]

I doesn't do fast lap times though ...

Lol

I was talking to a couple of the nsw guys about a 67 mustang that was lapping QR 1 sec faster than 700 alleged hp supras and 500hp gtrs

The mustang had about 450 crank hp a 4 speed box leaf springs and small brakes

[R31Nismoid]

I was being sarcastic

Take a SS anyday

[zebra]

I know...hence the LOL part....geeez Ash...dont you know anything?!?!?!