Ve Commodore Wheel Arches On A R33

[sinistaGTR]

But the 400r works so well as it has the fat GTR guards to start with. So putting flares on a gtst just looks like crap as it doesnt have the massive guards and tough stance to start with.

[The Bogan]

You will pay a fortune for the fitting of custom metal flares if you cannot do it yourself, huge amount of metal work involved to have a good job so it doesnt have 20kg of putty filling in the seams.

And on the note of wide body kits, what out were you take it if you go this way, last panel shop I went to had a S15 with the rear quarters cut out with a grinder and the rear guards mounted directely over the gap, giving the rear end the structural integrity of a wet paper bag.

What size tyres are yo trying to get under the arches ??

[Raysboostin]

You will pay a fortune for the fitting of custom metal flares if you cannot do it yourself, huge amount of metal work involved to have a good job so it doesnt have 20kg of putty filling in the seams.

This guys right. If u wanna do it in steel u better find a kick ass custom hot rod builder to do the panel work. If u can do the work yourself its prob the only way to make it cost effective. Otherwise i hope u've planned for a big $$$$$ build.

[mad082]

QFT.

Whats the point of this thread? In your mind you've already decided to do it, so just do it.

sounds like some threads in the past that may or may not have been made by female members planning outrageous builds and are more posting to brag than for actual advice..... lol

on topic though, it sounds like an extremely expensive build. for starters, if you can't do the metal work yourself then the cost of carving out the old guards and stitching in the new ones won't be cheap. plus painting costs. then there is the case of sourcing the guards. are you going to buy a written off car to cut the old ones out of, or buy new panels?

if you want to do it then by all means do it. if it was me than my first step would be a simple photoshop to see if it's going to look any good. sure it isn't going to be 100% true to life, but it'd be good enough to give you a rough idea of whether it's going to look like arse or not. you just need to be somewhat accurate with placement and size.

[Captain Natro]

I'm all for a bit of originality, get on it! pics would be a nice touch aswell

[luke gtr]

want more of a direct bolt up, but dont want the usual?

try and find a gt500 kit.

will cost a bit, but looks PHAT.....

[SMOK1106]

cant say ive ever seen many good 400R replica with the flares and everything done right.

lotsa peeps with 400R front bars or bits, but not the whole thing done well.

the Commo guards could be interesting, but your inner guards prob wont work with the 22+ inch swallowing arches that a VE has.

doit! and let us see!

Finally a constructive reply. Cheers. I have already considered the inner guard delima - read below.....

Edited February 2, 2012 by SMOK1106

[SMOK1106]

But the 400r works so well as it has the fat GTR guards to start with. So putting flares on a gtst just looks like crap as it doesnt have the massive guards and tough stance to start with.

People use those stick on over fenders as on the original 400R to try to give a false impression of wide perhaps... I think they look 'wrong' on the narrower gtst guards. The other good use for those over-fenders is to cover up the typical rust that's around that area.

Edited February 2, 2012 by SMOK1106

[SMOK1106]

There is a 33 gtst in Perth that has porsche wheel arches welded on, I don't no the guy but seen the car and ask who pumped his guarded and then told me they are weld ons off a porsche, they looked good and wide but subtle enough not to look rediculous, had massive GTR offset TE37s under them,

The look you're talking about wouldn't be too far off what I'm suggesting with the VE guards - it's all about the curves and lines, some wheel arch shapes gives you the width but simply doesn't go with the rest of the car. It's not just about being able to fit a pair of wide rims out back, it has to look good too.....

The sheet metal work isn't as hard as some people make out.....

Here's one for all those people that's wondering about the inner guard when grafting on a wider / bigger wheel arch, instead of cutting off the existing wheel arch and trying to join the new one on, the new wheel arch is simply welded directly onto the factory steel body, the original factory wheel arch is reshaped and flared outwards underneath - instead of lip being rolled inwards, it's flattened out and merged with the backside of the new wheel arch (done before welding would make the shaping easier), now effectively becoming the new inner guard / arch. This technique will also strengthen and reinforce that entire section if carried out correctly.

The most important thing is temperature control during welding so that the position of the new wheel arch doesn't get throw-out due to the expansions and contractions caused by the welding process.

Edited February 2, 2012 by SMOK1106

[ZILLR]

try to photoshop it abit, even afew sketches just for a final idea before you commit to doing it! if all looks good on paper go for it! - its good to be different, just need to be different good, not different bad

[RusH_]

Had a few minutes spare, thought i'd humour you,

Colour and reflections aren't the best, but i didnt have long

[defari]

^^ its the same pic?

[RusH_]

yes, i don't know why its there twice...

[The Bogan]

The sheet metal work isn't as hard as some people make out.....

Im a first class metal worker second class welder, trust me, its a HUGE job, you will need to modify both the doner and parent materials, the inner guards are not that big of a issue i.e.( (same as tubbing) (still a huge job in itself though)) its the exterior panels mating up on all axis and curves that will be the problem.

It would be a pity to do it when in the end it may turn out like a dogs breakfast.

Dont get me wrong, if you can do it go for it, other wise just be aware that it will take a top quality fabricator ages to do it, and ages will cost alot.

[Spunky Munky]

Question - are there any cons to doing this other than it turning out not as good as hoped, e.g. safety issues?

I suggest you do a lot of research and enjoy you do it right as I'm worry about the safety aspects.

[SMOK1106]

Im a first class metal worker second class welder, trust me, its a HUGE job, you will need to modify both the doner and parent materials, the inner guards are not that big of a issue i.e.( (same as tubbing) (still a huge job in itself though)) its the exterior panels mating up on all axis and curves that will be the problem.

It would be a pity to do it when in the end it may turn out like a dogs breakfast.

Dont get me wrong, if you can do it go for it, other wise just be aware that it will take a top quality fabricator ages to do it, and ages will cost alot.

Thanks for your advice. Yes, it's a huge job, but not a hard one.

We did a similar conversion back in the mid-late 90's with my old '75 Galant coupe, we took a 4G63 out of an early Evo, keep in mind that this twin cam turbo version of the 4G63 was only a couple of years old at this stage, swung it 90 degrees and grafted it into the 1.6 litre Saturn engine bay.....this exercise induced a fair bit of wheel spin and being a rear driver pushing right on 200 rwkw with a curb weight of sub - 900 kg, the only way to get decent traction was to use wider rims & tyres - enter wider metal wheel arches.

Rather than attempting to blend the wheel arch onto the existing fender, which requires shaping of both the new wheel arches and the fenders (as you have described), we found that it was much easier having the two surfaces simply cut and welded, meeting at an angle with the general overall shapes untouched, producing a distinctive clean line around the wheel arch. The trick was to mark out exactly where to cut so that the two parts meet up producing the clean line. I remember making some stensils out of cardboard for this purpose. An excess area of about an inch was left on the wheel arches along the welded edge so the two parts can be overlapped during welding.

During the Galant project, I made an attempt to keep the car all metal, so therefore no fibreglass or plastic filler was ever used. I went as far as lead wiping and file finishing the body before paint. Once again, I'd say the trickiest parts was marking out where to cut the metal and not messing up the welding in terms of alignment and temperature management. So, yes, it was a huge job taking about 6 weeks for the rear wheel arches, but not a hard one.

Now, back to the VE wheel arches, I have looked at it, done a bit more measuring and have decided that two pairs of VE front fenders are required to do all four corners as the factory rear arches on the VE isn't as complete in shape as the front ones and cant be used for what is required of them in this exercise.

Edited February 8, 2012 by SMOK1106

[SMOK1106]

In automotive forums, there are two types of people: One is people that have been 'there and done that', for example - people that have dropped 350 Chev V8s into 260 Z-cars (try drifting THAT !) and know how to set up the points in an old-school dizzy....And then there's the second type, these are the people that NOT only do not know how to set up points in a distributor, but have absolutely NO IDEA about anything automotive, but think they know cars because they have owned their mummy-paid-for Skyline for the last coupla months. These people in the latter group are also the very same idiots that go out and buy loudest BOV because the idiot next door has one.

Well, what's the point of this post ? This is where the first group of educated people discuss ideas to try to improve their techniques, so therefore the second group (the idiots) should STFU and watch and learn and not cry about how hard something is to do.

[SMOK1106]

Question - are there any cons to doing this other than it turning out not as good as hoped, e.g. safety issues?

I suggest you do a lot of research and enjoy you do it right as I'm worry about the safety aspects.

As with any structural modification, there shouldn't be any engineering issues as long as the structural integraty of the car isn't affected. ie, any sheet metal part of the vehicle removed has to be reinforced - as per RTA (NSW) light modifications legistrations. They have all kinds of rules regarding welding and positioning of various components.

By law, any structural modifications will have to be inspected by a RTA-approved engineer - even one of those wagons or SUVs converted for wheel chair lift access at the rear - they require the identical structural inspection as a roll cage installation. Once the modifications have been passed, the details are then uploaded onto the RTA computer. So if you were to get pulled up by the local highway patrol, they should have the details of all your mods in their system to begin with - it's no longer like the old days when you had to keep a copy of your engineering certificate in the glove box and then get told that the cop's gonna defect you anyways because he thinks your paper work is outdated.

[The Bogan]

LOL, I'm 46 and have been playing with motorbikes, car engines and bodys for 31 yrs,

but go for it, it will be easy, you can do it, welding is easy, safety isn't that important, if you wreck it just buy another car, enjoy.

[Spunky Munky]

As with any structural modification, there shouldn't be any engineering issues as long as the structural integraty of the car isn't affected. ie, any sheet metal part of the vehicle removed has to be reinforced - as per RTA (NSW) light modifications legistrations. They have all kinds of rules regarding welding and positioning of various components.

By law, any structural modifications will have to be inspected by a RTA-approved engineer - even one of those wagons or SUVs converted for wheel chair lift access at the rear - they require the identical structural inspection as a roll cage installation. Once the modifications have been passed, the details are then uploaded onto the RTA computer. So if you were to get pulled up by the local highway patrol, they should have the details of all your mods in their system to begin with - it's no longer like the old days when you had to keep a copy of your engineering certificate in the glove box and then get told that the cop's gonna defect you anyways because he thinks your paper work is outdated.

How are you planning to connect the aesthetics to the original body - are you going to blend it and sign it down or wield? Which is safer?