Lets Talk Water Meth Injection

[abr33]

Aquamist are working on a kit the has a live map tracing failsafe, rather than the current under flow at start point and overflow at 100%. That would be totally foolproof. Aquamist kit has a turbine flow sensor with live flow gauge too

[Manuel Kasko]

I get that Ron but the fact you have 2 systems that you rely on to work seamlessly then does that not then increase the chance of something going wrong?

Water meth is great and I have nothing against how it works or why people use it.

But the fact is I am going to go E85 for the simplicity of the setup and not have to rely on a 2nd system.

So that's my answer to your question.

[jet_r31]

Aquamist are working on a kit the has a live map tracing failsafe, rather than the current under flow at start point and overflow at 100%. That would be totally foolproof. Aquamist kit has a turbine flow sensor with live flow gauge too

a few companies have a turbine flow sensor with live gauge.

i have a aem one, even the turbine flow sensors aren't perfect, they get stuck sometimes, so as maintenance you have to give it

a blow out or put it in warm water , same time you clean filter. However it does show its working, and earlier on before i had

the filter, it did show up the partially clogged nozzle.

Still a bit of a toy though, like most AEM shit

cheers

darren

[blk94r33]

Update on my car/WMI setup.

Recently added changed:

-Hypergear hi-flow, 12 psi actuator

-CES racing 3" exhaust

-Lots of other changes (5 stud, radiator etc etc) but the turbo and exhaust are the main tune related items.

Changed from a ~250 cc nozzle to a 180cc nozzle, pump at ~200 psi peak pressure, nozzle still located near the BOV, tank and pump have been moved to the boot.

Peaks of ~220 rwkw and ~340 nm on ~15 psi NO WMI at all

Peaks of ~240 rwkw and ~400 nm still ~15 psi and minor tune changes

Peak gains of up to 80nm and 30 kw

Car performed MUCH happier on the dyno with a more aggressive tune/power/torque than with no WMI at all. Ran ~5 degrees cooler coolant temp. Graphs speak for themselves. Very happy with the results for a $300 kit that has proven very reliable for near 18 months now.

[abr33]

You went down in nozzle size? Why?

[blk94r33]

You went down in nozzle size? Why?

Previously with ~180 rwkw I had to drop the pump pressure right down as it was simply flowing too much. With the 180cc nozzle at ~200 psi it's much happier. Plus it'll be atomizing better.

[abr33]

How did you work out too much flow? Do you have better coilpacks? I can spray 600cc/min at 8psi and it doesnt hesitate at all

[blk94r33]

With the stock turbo at ~10 psi, the 250cc nozzle at 200 psi was causing the car to miss, lose power and torque and run excessively rich. When we dropped the pump pressure down it behaved itself. Coils are 2 year old yellowjackets, with the 180cc nozzle i've had no problems. I'm happy with the way things are setup now as I got good results and it isn't heavily dependent on the WMI.

[abr33]

Cool, was just curious to know thanks

[Dale FZ1]

The sweet spot will vary between setups, in terms of nozzle sizing. It's about getting the ratio of air:fuel:water right, so sizing is largely governed by the turbo's characteristics

Josh's setup running 10psi was naturally going to need less water than at 14psi, and things would be different again with the HG turbo. Not hard to see that Mafia's old setup with the GT3076 would also have different requirements. From memory he used something like a 375cc nozzle and trialed a 250cc also.

Obviously too much water will drown the spark as you have found. Be interesting to see what would have resulted if your air/fuel ratio was leaned off a touch, instead of backing the water off.

Good atomisation and no dribbles is also pretty important to achieve.

Great result for you Josh, and you have tabled the results that quantifies how much improvement is obtainable from WI.

[blk94r33]

Cheers guys.

Down the track I would like to test the system further with a larger nozzle, better plugs and coils and more boost as there's definitely more power available, but as my system has no fail-safes (at this stage) I didn't want to rely on it too heavily.

The difference between the non-WMI and WMI tunes isn't just a power/torque gain though, it's a completely different car. Even with a 10-30% gain in power/torque, the car runs up to 5 degrees cooler, with the WMI off there was a sharp drop in power occasionally on runs, which Trent suspected was excessively high cylinder temps, with the WMI on it's gone. Plus all the obvious gains of lowering intake/oil/exhaust temps, cleaning everything. The WMI tune with more power and torque, is effectively safer than the lower power tune.

It's like some weird alternative medicine, anyone that is running WMI swears by it and won't stop using it, those who aren't just don't seem to understand. But for ~$300 (plus running costs) i'm more than happy with the results. If I had the money and was willing to risk the turbo, i'd like to try a small (~75cc) nozzle pre-turbo with a dedicated pump and on/off boost switch and see how it performs.

[5ky-lin3]

Hey guys,

Was just wondering whether anyone has run the methanol injection through their stock washer tank and had any problems with the methanol degrading the plastic container over time? I want to run mine through the stock container to keep everything fitting well in the bay but unsure if the methanol will chew it away over time or because it is distilled 50/50 whether that is enough to prevent it?

Any help would be great!

Cheers

[blk94r33]

Hey guys,

Was just wondering whether anyone has run the methanol injection through their stock washer tank and had any problems with the methanol degrading the plastic container over time? I want to run mine through the stock container to keep everything fitting well in the bay but unsure if the methanol will chew it away over time or because it is distilled 50/50 whether that is enough to prevent it?

Any help would be great!

Cheers

Ran mine like that for a good 12 months or so no problems, just be sure to disconnect your washer motors to prevent spraying methanol all over the windscreen.

I'm still using a stock washer bottle mounted in the boot for my WMI setup and had no problems with it, plastics held up fine.

You're using a proper WMI pump though not washer pumps?

[PSI086]

A number of people use that washer fluid with the methanol in it in their set ups so it should be pretty safe in your washer bottle I'd say

[5ky-lin3]

Sweet as. Yeah Ive got the full kit incuding pump and snow performance reservoir but just for conveniance wanted to use the washer bottle.

[discopotato03]

Going to start another thread on WI/WMI VS E70/85 because E70 consumption shits me up the wall .

A .

[Dale FZ1]

Adrian each system will have advantages/drawbacks IMO.

Eg. relative simplicity vs duplication of a fluid storage/delivery system, availability, decreased fuel range from a given tank size, WI nozzle service (declogging). And I'm sure there's more.

Something I haven't seen any discussion on relates to engine oil contamination and implications for the engine internals. Eg. I have seen a WTAC engine on E85 with lots of rusty bits evident, about a couple of weeks post-event. Nobody mentions stuff like that, and neither have I seen it discussed about WI/WMI equipped engines.

Ideas for discussion.

[jet_r31]

<div id="fb-root"></div> <script>(function(d, s, id) { var js, fjs = d.getElementsByTagName(s)[0]; if (d.getElementById(id)) return; js = d.createElement(s); js.id = id; js.src = "//connect.facebook.net/en_US/all.js#xfbml=1"; fjs.parentNode.insertBefore(js, fjs); }(document, 'script', 'facebook-jssdk'));</script>

<div class="fb-post" data-href="https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10201855551683967" data-width="550"><div class="fb-xfbml-parse-ignore"><a href="https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10201855551683967">Post</a> by <a href="https://www.facebook.com/pages/vl-turbo-nationals/221343589894">vl turbo nationals</a>.</div></div>

f**k knows what ive done, just press facebook link

29-30psi, 24 degrees of timing, around 450cc of water, bit less now,pump fuel , rb30 sohc..and dodgy laggy as f**k 1.06 internal gate 3540 with a

to4z wheel , with a gtx3540

or something it would go 140mph i would have thought. . Pre turbo WMI injection , pneumatic system, been on a yr with no trouble

think it did 10.55@130 ish on weekend, 60ft better on this pass and missed 2nd, would have been into the low 10.4's

wish he' d bang a T3 Precision 6466 .82 or Fp turbo on it

cheers

darren

Edited December 1, 2013 by jet_r31

[abr33]

Who here mixes their own water meth?

How are you doing it?

Iv been using boost juice, but apparently theres a shortage of it, plus iv roughly worked out I can make 3 times as much for the money should I buy the stuff myself.

What I understand is I need >99.5% pure methanol like VP fuels straight methanol? - http://www.vpracing.com.au/meth.htm

And I need demineralised water. Mix them at 50% each and presto. Just wont be pink. - http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Austech-Demineralised-Water-5-Litre.aspx?pid=102799#Combo

Is there any down sides to doing it like this?

[Ben C34]

I always assumed 99% of people mixed their own!

Depends if you want to do it by weight or volume, but I don't think you need to get that technical.

What you have suggested is fine, and the only downside is that people aren't ripping you off! (could add some food colouring if you really want it to look cool! )