Lets Talk Water Meth Injection

[t_revz]

That ain't gonna happen.

Firstly it doesn't hit positive pressure that often, never at all just before I park it up. Within 2 seconds of deactivating id imagine there is no traces left anywhere anyway

Even if there somehow was a trace of it left in the chamber the heat would surely evaporate it off very quickly

And by that theory then you could almost say that if you give any car a blast going up the street before parking then you could have unburnt fuel sitting in the chambers?

[fmlycar]

Who is running the snow performance stage 2 kit with the resiviour mounted in the boot?

I was reading the install instructions and it is recommended to run their solenoid if the reservoir is rear mounted to avoid syphoning in the line. How is it wired in? Is it a NC solenoid and you use the pump signal as a trigger for the solenoid?

Also, mafia said the lines and fittings aren't great in the snow kits, any recommendation as to what is the best replacement?

[Shoota_77]

I've ordered an Aquamist HFS-3.1 which has all of the fail safes built in as standard. It also operates differently to the other kits in that it runs at constant pressure and operates by opening a fast acting valve to release the pressure to the jet. 

Time will tell how well it works!

[tridentt150v]

On 29/07/2016 at 6:20 PM, fmlycar said:

Who is running the snow performance stage 2 kit with the resiviour mounted in the boot?

I was reading the install instructions and it is recommended to run their solenoid if the reservoir is rear mounted to avoid syphoning in the line. How is it wired in? Is it a NC solenoid and you use the pump signal as a trigger for the solenoid?

Also, mafia said the lines and fittings aren't great in the snow kits, any recommendation as to what is the best replacement?

No it comes of the control unit, when you turn the ignition off the power to the head unit cuts out, this triggers the solenoid.  The lines are ok, but not long enough.  I just made sure I got some more with my order.  The quick connectors they supply are the push in metal ones, you do the fitting up then push the hose into place and it stays there.  But they can fail if you are connecting/disconnecting a number of times.  I still have them on my cut out solenoid, but because I was experimenting with the pump and reservoir location and setup they failed there so I went to proper 'do 'em up' jobs.

Have a look at this: 

 

[fmlycar]

1 hour ago, tridentt150v said:

No it comes of the control unit, when you turn the ignition off the power to the head unit cuts out, this triggers the solenoid.  The lines are ok, but not long enough.  I just made sure I got some more with my order.  The quick connectors they supply are the push in metal ones, you do the fitting up then push the hose into place and it stays there.  But they can fail if you are connecting/disconnecting a number of times.  I still have them on my cut out solenoid, but because I was experimenting with the pump and reservoir location and setup they failed there so I went to proper 'do 'em up' jobs.

Have a look at this: 

 

Cheers. What sort of 'do em up' fitting did you end up using? I'm half considering using an4 fittings and getting their braided hose. I could probably mount all mine in the engine bay but it would be a tight fit. So I think I'll mount it in the boot and pop the pump under the false floor where the spare used to be.

Edited August 2, 2016 by fmlycar

[jet_r31]

the coolingmist trunk mount tank fits nicely in the back of a stagea on the right hand side, right behind the back seat...

cheers

darren

[tridentt150v]

I just used the supplied 1/4" plastic hose, ran it with the brake lines under the car.  Never went through the cab, but I did for the wiring.

Also the 'do 'em up' fittings were just threaded nickel plated brass with ogive stuff.  I got them off a hydraulic store here in town - no idea of the brand, generic stuff anyway.

I didn't use any fancy bling bling braided or vivid colour line.  If you look at the thread I posted you will see that my under bonnet set up is innocuous and to a casual inspection will not be seen as anything other than motor stuff.  We all know they zero in on the blow off valve anyway lol.

 

[JGB1600]

G'day gouys,

Here is the link to a thread I started last year on my testing and results from using water and water meth injection on my FJ20 turbo. 

Two weeks ago after a few more tweaks, I made 455hp with water meth injection. In the mid range, i saw gains of up to 125hp and 85hp at peak power.

Cheers.

 

[t_revz]

thread bump.

has anyone had experience with WMI on diesels? ive taken my AEM kit out of my skyline and fitted to my '92 Rodeo with 2.8TD. the engine is stock with only a catch can and bleed valve set to 14psi modified. ive yet to experiment much but have tested quite a bit. 

currently have the medium nozzle fitted which i believe is 500cc/min. with straight water i feel no power difference and no change at all in EGT. even switching it on up a hill with steady temp i see less than a 5C drop.

with a 50/50 mix its a complete animal. its like driving a new model diesel with an estimated 30-40% more torque with boost in 1000-1200rpm earlier. peak EGT before and with water is 515C. with 50/50 peak temp has been 565C although boost is higher so its not really comparing apples. hills i used to climb at 70km/h in 4th, i can now stay in 5th at 100km/h.  im going to drop back to the smallest nozzle which i believe is 250cc/min and compare again.

 

When i have time im going to fit another pyro in the intake somewhere to see temps as im not intercooled so i expect decent drops with meth injecting. anyone have clues why EGT's dont decrease when activated compared to not injecting?? i was expecting 50C at a guess but got nothing. i never monitored EGT in my skyline so nothing else to compare to

 

cheers 

 

[t_revz]

 

WMI @ 10psi 60-90 in 4th

 

 

WMI @ 3psi 60-90 in 4th

[t_revz]

 

60-90 in 4th. NO WMI

 

 

60-90 in 4th. WMI @ 3psi                        

[tridentt150v]

Definitely looks quicker, nice result.

[The Bogan]

Are people still utilising water injection.

I used the available information to work out injector sizing, as I will only be using water it worked out to be 175ml/min.

The total cost of purchasing the kit, instalation and tuning should be around $2000 (rough guesstimate).

Compared to E85, which I find logistically hard to get and 3 times the cost to install and tune, it seems like a viable option for some small gains and added insurance for a relatively small outlay.

Car is a 15 STI with basic bolt ons making around 200 kw on ECUTEK.

It will be set to start at around 5 psi and full at max (around 20).

The boxers don't play well with heat from my understanding and pumping in a small amount of water should be beneficial.

Any inrormation in relation to my points or theories are most welcome.

Finding a tuner who is "full bottle" (pun intended) is also required, a few places seem to only want to do flex and are attempting to steer me away from water injection, I like Pulse and will need to talk to them more, or maybe UNIGROUP, although it's been years since I've dealt with them and I am unsure on their opinions or experience with water injection.

Thanks.

[GTSBoy]

Of course people are still using it, for the same reason you would prefer it over e85.

[The Bogan]

8 minutes ago, GTSBoy said:

Of course people are still using it, for the same reason you would prefer it over e85.

Thanks mate, I've been a bit disconnected from the performance world, there's lots of talk on the interwebs about water injection but I feel with SAU I can rely on correct unbiased information.

[t_revz]

10 hours ago, mlr said:

Thanks mate, I've been a bit disconnected from the performance world, there's lots of talk on the interwebs about water injection but I feel with SAU I can rely on correct unbiased information.

on my skyline it had various issues last time at tuners preventing me from winding it up or tuning to WMI specifically. was making 350hp@wheels at 16psi then WMI was added on top as an added safety and 50/50 mix made another 12hp. (think it was a 500cc nozzle but possibly 1000cc) prob ran cooler but didnt have EGT gauge

 

ive just pulled it out of my ute as im upgrading but ill be fitting it to my next one again. i only noticed gains in my ute with methanol in the mix and no EGT drop with water only so ill continue to mix

 

[Die$eL]

I'm running WMI on my MR2 Spyder turbo. 

With an intake temp of around 58 degrees Celcius, if i switch on the WMI it drops to around 38 degrees Celcius within a few seconds. However once you come to a stop it increases again but thats ok. 

Thinking of getting a setup for the Skyline at some point but not just yet. Lots of other bits to sort first. 

[fullboost33]

Hopefully a bit of a thread revival!

About to purchase a WMI set up for my r33 gtst. Plan is to run 100% water rather than a mix. 

Was hoping to hear from guys running just a post intercooler nozzle and see if there was any feedback on distribution amongst cylinders?

Hoping to get away with a post cooler nozzle rather than the added complexity of direct port - however if that’s the way to go then so be it!

 

[Shoota_77]

On 21/09/2021 at 5:17 PM, fullboost33 said:

Hopefully a bit of a thread revival!

About to purchase a WMI set up for my r33 gtst. Plan is to run 100% water rather than a mix. 

Was hoping to hear from guys running just a post intercooler nozzle and see if there was any feedback on distribution amongst cylinders?

Hoping to get away with a post cooler nozzle rather than the added complexity of direct port - however if that’s the way to go then so be it!

 

I've got a water/meth kit for my car but not fully got around to fitting the kit yet (bit like the car really...).  I haven't been reading up on it for a while but from what I have seen is that people seem to be moving towards individual runner installs.  Obviously a lot more complexity involved with an individual setup.  There would still be sizeable gains to be had regardless of the setup.

My recollection was that there was minimal gains to be had with higher content of methanol.

I'd still love to see data on whether there are still gains to be had by going E85 AND Water/Meth as that was my plan to see if there were further benefits to be had over E85 on it's own.  Obviously water/meth lowers the intake charge temp which is something that is not as much of an issue with E85.

 

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

On 21/09/2021 at 5:52 PM, Shoota_77 said:

Obviously water/meth lowers the intake charge temp which is something that is not as much of an issue with E85.

but the colder the air, the denser it is, the more fuel you need to keep it at your target AFR and that means more power  

Still plenty of gains to run E85 to increase your knock threashold and water/meth to chemically further cool down your compressed air.

For any street car that is more than overkill - you would only see this kind of setup in a serious competition car for WTAC or big 1/2 or 1 mile drag races, etc.