Is It A Legal Obligation To Provide Drivers Licence When Asked In An Accident?

[xntrq]

hey guys,

I've been involved in a minor accident recently and I was just wondering, is it a legal obligation to provide a drivers license when asked by the other party during an accident?

When he asked for mine, I gave it to him to record my details down but when I asked him for his details, he could not produce his license for me to inspect and record.

I'm currently writing a accident report and I'm including some extracts of the Road Rules 2008 within it. The driver claims to not have his license at the time of the accident but gave me his details in good faith.

I'm trying to build up my defence because if I don't, it would be my fault based on technicalities.

I want to find a legislative extract that covers both scenarios of the following:

IF the driver was telling the truth and did not have the license at the time of the accident, he should have not been driving as outlined in Road Rules 2008, Part 18, Division 1, 300-5.

IF the driver was not telling the truth and refused to produce his license at the time of accident, it would render that rule inapplicable and therefore leave me back in square one.

If anyone knows if it is a legal obligation and can find the extract in relevant legislation, please do link me or tell me where I can find it. The driver is blaming it on me as well based on technicalities so I need this to corner him.

[ARTZ]

man if they dont provide a license pull your camera out and take their photo...

A mate of mine is going through this crap lately where he was hit by an unlicensed driver....its a bit of a mess ,.but long story short, if the other driver is unlicensed they shouldn't of even been on the road which could mean its not his fault...meanwhile they are trying to say someone else was driving and pin the blame on him for it, I think he may have pulled an illegal u-turn or something..doesnt help that he has a record of drink driving and left the scene either.. ...

but anyway, when accidents happen these days pull your phone out and photograph EVERYTHING!!!!!

[xntrq]

  On 16/09/2012 at 8:45 AM, ARTZ said:

man if they dont provide a license pull your camera out and take their photo...

my mate is going through this crap lately where he was hit by an unlicensed driver....its a bit of a mess anyway atm..but long story short, if the other driver is unlicensed they shouldn't of even been on the road which could mean its not his fault...meanwhile they are trying to say someone else was driving and pin the blame on him for it..doesnt help that he was drinking and fled the scene either...lol...

but yeah, when accidents happen these days pull your phone out and photograph EVERYTHING!!!!!

yeah i was in shock at the time and the fact that it's my first accident, i didn't know how to handle it properly but common sense. the driver wrote his details down for me and everything checks out, police report already made but just need a legal extract regarding not providing a form of official ID.

[ARTZ]

Sorry having a rant, my post wasn't any help i know..

but I would think that if everything checks out on his details, the worse they could do is fine him for not having his license on him when driving...

I mean who hasn't gone for a drive and left their wallet at home...I doubt it is an enditable offence in this case..

are you sure the details he gave match the same person you saw or did they just match the car owner ?

[xntrq]

  On 16/09/2012 at 8:51 AM, ARTZ said:

Sorry having a rant, my post wasn't any help i know..

but I would think that if everything checks out on his details, the worse they could do is fine him for not having his license on him when driving...

I mean who hasn't gone for a drive and left their wallet at home...I doubt it is an enditable offence in this case..

are you sure the details he gave match the same person you saw or did they just match the car owner ?

Yeah the details match. a quick google map and streetview search revealed his car (a taxi) is parked in the driveway at address that he gave me (I was surprised ). His number checks out since ive contacted him a few times and he brought his car over today to discuss a few matters with me. Also lodged a police report and the operator from PAL said that his details had matched, but she could not read back to me due to privacy reasons.

He hasn't given me any reason to doubt the details he has provided and the guy is cooperating with me, but is still laying blame on me. Not going down without a fight! even if its a couple of points off his license, at least it will sting him for a good 3 years.

and once I did go for a drive and left my wallet at home when I was on my L's haha

Edited September 16, 2012 by xntrq

[xntrq]

Just found it in the same legislation, posting for future reference if anyone needs:

Road Rules 2008, Part 18, Division 1, Rule 287, Clause 4:

  Quote

(4) For this rule:

required particulars, for a driver involved in a crash, means:

(a) the driver’s name and address, and

(b) the name and address of the owner of the driver’s vehicle, and

© the vehicle’s registration number (if any), and

(d) any other information necessary to identify the vehicle,

and, for subrule (3), includes an explanation of the circumstances of the crash.

It does not state any license numbers or must produce license for detail verification purposes. I hope to be corrected but it looks like it's back to square one for me.

[Yo-Yo]

  On 16/09/2012 at 8:37 AM, xntrq said:

IF the driver was telling the truth and did not have the license at the time of the accident, he should have not been driving as outlined in Road Rules 2008, Part 18, Division 1, 300-5.

IF the driver was not telling the truth and refused to produce his license at the time of accident, it would render that rule inapplicable and therefore leave me back in square one.

If anyone knows if it is a legal obligation and can find the extract in relevant legislation, please do link me or tell me where I can find it. The driver is blaming it on me as well based on technicalities so I need this to corner him.

Sorry to hear about the accident

Regardless it would be your word against his about the no license at the time thing if it went to court i reckon...

Unless you have proof or an impartial third party witness

Check out the 'traffic lawyer list' thread in the NSW section & find someone to help you out if need be

good luck

[gdogzgtr]

The relevant section in regards to this would be section 61 of the Road Safety Act 1986. In short you need to provide name, address and registration. DO NOT require to provide Drivers Licence, insurance details, phone numbers etc. All of them help to make things easier but by law only those first 3 are a legal obligation.

Above info is in regards to Victoria so not sure how accurate it is for NSW

[Cowboy1600]

as an aside to the above, him not having a licence would not be a factor in determining fault.

If you were the at fault driver, youc're still at fault even if the other driver has no licence.

[xntrq]

  On 16/09/2012 at 11:27 AM, Yo-Yo said:

Sorry to hear about the accident

Regardless it would be your word against his about the no license at the time thing if it went to court i reckon...

Unless you have proof or an impartial third party witness

Check out the 'traffic lawyer list' thread in the NSW section & find someone to help you out if need be

good luck

My only proof would be when I requested his license, he was unable to produce but he wrote down on a piece of paper his details. But on the paper it does not have his license number. I called him afterwards and got his license number which was written down on the same piece of paper, but in a different colored pen to show that it was provided at a different time and recorded by myself. Apprentice wages forces me to do some Google and self taught law

Unless theres someone here that would do some charity work and help out a fellow SAU member?

  On 16/09/2012 at 11:30 AM, gdogzgtr said:

The relevant section in regards to this would be section 61 of the Road Safety Act 1986. In short you need to provide name, address and registration. DO NOT require to provide Drivers Licence, insurance details, phone numbers etc. All of them help to make things easier but by law only those first 3 are a legal obligation.

Above info is in regards to Victoria so not sure how accurate it is for NSW

That act covers VIC only. NSW is Road Rules 2008. But yes that's what it states as well, no mention of license. But since the car IS a taxi, I've read somewhere that they have an obligation to provide a copy of insurance in an accident.

  On 16/09/2012 at 11:51 AM, Cowboy1600 said:

as an aside to the above, him not having a licence would not be a factor in determining fault.

If you were the at fault driver, youc're still at fault even if the other driver has no licence.

I know it's not an arguable factor to determine that he is at fault. I'm trying to find out each and every little needle in a haystack where I could use against him. He has nothing against me but technicalities. Also I've been told by someone who's been in a messy situation before, that the driver of the car in front that his words are less reliable based on the fact that his eyes would be facing forward, whilst the accident is behind him and the fact that he could create a simple story and blame fault on the driver behind with technicalities backing up the driver in front.

[666DAN]

I've been in a similar situation on the other side, some 18yo princess trying to claim that I literally destroyed the back of her car with our 4WD. The only damage done was the corner of my number plate bent about 5 degrees. I took so many pictures of the whole thing without her knowing, when it came down to her "claim" the evidence from me quickly sorted it out. Pics, pics and more pics....even of the driver helps.

I was annoyed as it meant the little scrut actually smashed the back of her car within a close time frame and thought she could pin some cost on me! Obviously a failed reverse attempt.

[xntrq]

What did insurance say about you nicking the car?

[crashdown]

http://www.lawlink.nsw.gov.au/lawlink/LawAccess/ll_lawassist.nsf/pages/lawassist_what_to_do_after_an_accident_frequently_asked_questions

1st question is about if a driver doesn't give you there licence.

[Ph@t-G]

My gf and I were recently involved in an accident (not my liner thank god) and the driver at the time did not have her license on her. To make matters worse, she was an overseas student and was holding an international license!

I was literally waiting in the car for 2 hours while her friend went to find her license. In the meantime, I called the LAC and they said that technically you cannot leave without producing a license, as that can be considered leaving the scene of an accident that attracts a fine and demerit points. Unfortunately in my instance, that ruling goes both ways, so I was stuck playing the waiting game until the friend came back with the at fault driver's license.

In the meantime, I was taking more photos than a paparazzi and took even more photos of the license as it was in both Chinese and English. When it comes to insurance claims, you can never be too safe as insurance will try and find any excuse to low-ball you in not paying up.

[xntrq]

  On 18/09/2012 at 1:34 AM, crashdown said:

http://www.lawlink.nsw.gov.au/lawlink/LawAccess/ll_lawassist.nsf/pages/lawassist_what_to_do_after_an_accident_frequently_asked_questions

1st question is about if a driver doesn't give you there licence.

Yeah I saw that but it doesn't apply since he gave me his details.