GTR against Euro supercars?

[cul202]

this has been an interesting (read angry/defensive) thread.

as far as circuit cars go, a creaky old 89 r32 GTR with some boost/tuning, a set of tiens (or similar), brakes & tyres would probably give you a good level of bang for your buck that you wont get with a Euro supercar.

Or you could just build up a Clubman....

if i had a large disposable income i'd go TVR, because they are potentially very fast (though i'm guessing not that easy to get aroung the track) & no one else has one

for heading down the quarter i'd buy a old torana that already runs 11's or 12's rather than stuff around with my ol 32

in stock trim i'd have a turbo porsche over a R34 any day but with modified cars it is mostly arbitary anyway. it comes down to how much time/money you have on your hands....

[Jamezilla]

To also add fuel to the 'supercar' debate - the GTR is a sports car, not a supercar.

Sure it's fast and pretty darn swanky - but all GTRs (even the Mines R34) started their lives on a robotics equipped production line in Japan. The same sort of facility that makes Pulsars and Maximas. All Skylines (R's and T's) are mass-produced sports cars.

If they can be compared to anything European - it's German. BMWs, Benzes and Porsches are also mass-produced. To which end, I see all mass-market models from these and other marques as sports cars. Compare a stock R with a 4WD 911, or a GTSt with a Boxter - and you'll have yourself a better comparison.

$50k GTR vs. $500k McLaren? Please.

Have you ever been to the Ferrari factory? Seen how they hand-build a Lambo? Looked at the materials engineering behind the McLaren development? These cars share more in common with fighter aircraft and Formula 1 race cars than they do with their road-going bretheren. Yes - most of these cars utilise modern production techniques - but the amount of personal care received by even the most basic 355 is enough to set these cars apart.

Hell - look at the price tag!

There is no argument as to the sporting competency of a Skyline - R or T - and sure, stock for stock, an R is faster than many other cars out there. But - what the Skylines have up their sleeve is potential - this point being illustrated time and time again when we see modified examples exhibiting amazing behaviour. This potential is what makes the cars we drive great. It's what makes them envied and admired... but out of the box, the Skyline is just another well-engineered, showroom edition sportscar.

Performance bargain? Yes.

Massive potential? Yes.

World beating supercar? No.

[NickR33]

Compare a stock R with a 4WD 911, or a GTSt with a Boxter - and you'll have yourself a better comparison.

werd!... restecpa!

[lwells]

Perhaps best to compare with the boxster as its certainly a mass-market product. The 911 -- even base models -- still gets quite a lot of love from what I have read/heard.

LW.

[funkymonkey]

If I had a supercar I'd wanna keep it stock, simply for prestige value... if it ain't built right the first time, it ain't worth owning. So maybe that's why a supercar is expensive to modify, coz 1) you can't get better than the best, and 2) it ruins the overall asthetics and work that goes into building a car.

Jap cars are made with tuning in mind, an example would be the new Supra that's being prototyped, apparently the car is being designed to handle an extra 200kw of modifications.

Its like the difference between owning a mansion and building your own house... somehow your custom built house never has the same novelty as owning a mansion.

[lwells]

funky: Don't forget about the likes of Brabus, RUF, etc, etc.

LW.

[funkymonkey]

they modify production cars don't they? RUF = Porsche, Brabus = Merc, Hamann = BMW??

[predator]

they turn the factory production sports (like jamezilla was talking about) I guess more into "supercars". There are some cool ones

http://www.ruf-automobile.de/

[RBN1]

Can't compare a GTR to a Boxster. Even my lowly R32 GTS-T is able to whoop one.

Perhaps best to compare with the boxster as its certainly a mass-market product. The 911 -- even base models -- still gets quite a lot of love from what I have read/heard.

LW.

[predator]

meh...now *these* are proper supercars..

http://www.koenigsegg.com/thecars/index.asp?submenu=4

http://www.bugatti-cars.de/bugatti/index.html

[lwells]

Can't compare a GTR to a Boxster. Even my lowly R32 GTS-T is able to whoop one.

I wasn't talking in terms of speed, I was talking about production wise.

And a Boxster S on a track is pretty quick: perhaps not outright speed wise, but package wise.

LW.

[lwells]

they modify production cars don't they? RUF = Porsche, Brabus = Merc, Hamann = BMW??

Yes, but would you class the top porsche and merc (AMG) models as "production"? If so, we are talking very low numbers...

There are other companies in Europe too -- Alpina comes to mind, though they tend to spruce up cooking model BMWs --- including some that do Ferrari's and the like.

LW.

[DCIEVE]

have seen one a brand spanking 911 turbo (awd etc) at a local workshop, they easily got 400+hp out of the thing just fiddling with the ecu. these guys build some serious cars but reckon the porsche was like nothing else they'd punted on the street. still for the price of a nice house you'd want it to go pretty hard:)

[LaL]

i dont really care what anyone says to be honest. ill keep my thoughts in my head .. your right snowman, a modified GT-R is still good and prob the best all rounder

[LaL]

meh...now *these* are proper supercars..  

http://www.koenigsegg.com/thecars/index.asp?submenu=4

http://www.bugatti-cars.de/bugatti/index.html

Man how much is that 9 second car ? is that like the best car ever made or WHAT!

[2rismo]

Man how much is that 9 second car ? is that like the best car ever made or WHAT!

Yes MinesDatusn, it is.... whatever....hmmmmm........

Adrian

[LaL]

Yes MinesDatusn, it is.... whatever....hmmmmm........  

Adrian

hey, you always keep saying mines datsun to me. this is not mines datsun. how do you want me to prove this ?

[Guest INASNT]

hey, you always keep saying mines datsun to me. this is not mines datsun. how do you want me to prove this ?

All your posts, especially about GTR's point to the fact u r either his long lost brother or his love child

[LaL]

okay to be serious with you, i am who i am. and im not mines datsun. so all you guyz can think whateva

[Duncan]

anyway....back on topic.....my impression is there has been a lot of talkers in here.

In my experience an r33 gtst with the following mods:

9psi

1 way diff

cat back zorst

is quicker than:

Porsche GT3

Commodore GTS

Porsche 996 911

BMW M3

Porsche 911 Carerra

Nissan GTR

and slower than:

Porsche 996 911

Nissan 350z

PRB Clubman

Evo VI

Porsche GT3

Porsche 996 Turbo

based on how we went in Dutton Rally last year. (full results at www.hgeconsulting.com.au/teamoutright.pdf .....check em....)

Most disappointing car for me there was the BMW M3...went poorly and sounded like a tin can