Ecu Ecu Ecu Which One !!!!! ????????

[rob82]

You can tune Low and HIgh Octane fuel and timing maps 16*16 resolution, knock sensitivity, acceleration pumps, CLT and MAT compensation tables. A knock sensor that actually retards timing when it sensors a certain level. It basically retains all of the original functions its just that with the software you will be able to alter these values to the new desire tune.

[pnblight]

You can tune Low and HIgh Octane fuel and timing maps 16*16 resolution, knock sensitivity, acceleration pumps, CLT and MAT compensation tables.  A knock sensor that actually retards timing when it sensors a certain level.  It basically retains all of the original functions its just that with the software you will be able to alter these values to the new desire tune.

have i miss something here but the pfc has 20*20 resolution amd can be tune for what ever octane fuel you like ,has great knock sensor sensitivty (or why would australias fastest gtr ( KW) still retain a pfc and hand controller when he is running a fully optioned motec).The pfc also runs compensation tables ?

[rob82]

It runs the lower octane map if you put lower octane fuel in it that. It has sensitivity but no ability to retard the timing.

The thing is the standard computer is more consistent than the PFC and doesn't need any higher resolution, the interpolation and extrapolation is exceptional. How much do you think nissan spent developing their ECU compared to APEXI I would say about a whole F***load more.

The PFC is very powerfull computer dont get me wrong, its ok to tune and although a little nintendo like it does create a nice tune. THe difference comes in calculating the transitions and acceleration rates and predicting where the motor is heading thats what make a good computer. Try to think outside the box or inside the box I should say!

[pnblight]

So the only difference you can show is the to ability the retard when knock level reached the rest is your personal option, as who can truely say what company sent on development but i can say the std computer was only design to run 208kw where the development of the pfc was 208kw to 1000kw+ (apexi 8sec drag car runs pfc). To call the pfc inconsistent is a big call, as it must be close to the world most used after market ecu on the rb series engine. The pfc ability to control large injectors at low % operation is nothing short of remarkable and i must have talked to a dozen other tuner who have had not a problem with the units ability .Personally i have met an unhappy pfc owner but thats only my experience unfortunately i can't say the same the same for alot of the others(wolf,mines chipped ecu,etc).

But if the pfc is so lacking and inconsistent as you say i'm sure you will find a large market for your home grown software and really how could a company the size of APEXI compete with you at home on your laptop.

[R31Nismoid]

how do you intend to re-burn the chip for the R33 ECU?

From what ive seen and dabbled in a loooong time ago in a galaxy far far away

The Stock 33 ECU has a totally different type of chip. It can only be burnt once, not overwritten.

To be overwritten you'd need to convert it via a daughterboard or similar to have a basic R32 setup... or follow a costly burning route. Which everytime you want a retune is gonna cost you $$$$

My old R33 ECU has this setup, but it was one of very few ever seen out of Japan.

It runs the lower octane map if you put lower octane fuel in it that.  It has sensitivity but no ability to retard the timing.  

are you saying this about the PowerFC or stocker ecu?

[rob82]

The software I'm making is just a way of editing the factory computer. Sure there are limits of the factory ECU of which I dont know yet but as I've said around 400rwkw is what i've seen and it drove beautifully.

I never said that the PFC was inconsistent I just said that the standard ECU is more consistent, more powerful with mathematical calculations. The thing is how many skylines out there are over 400rwkw - not that many I would suggest. This is where my software will hopefully bridge the gap.

I will say that the PFC is shit for tuning time but so are the likes of Wolf. The datalogit type software should be standard software with PFC IMHO. PFC is also my preference for the skyline in regards to aftermarket computers so dont get me wrong I'm not underestimating it at all.

Dont knock the home PC thats where Bill Gates came from.

[rob82]

how do you intend to re-burn the chip for the R33 ECU?

From what ive seen and dabbled in a loooong time ago in a galaxy far far away

The Stock 33 ECU has a totally different type of chip. It can only be burnt once, not overwritten.

To be overwritten you'd need to convert it via a daughterboard or similar to have a basic R32 setup... or follow a costly burning route. Which everytime you want a retune is gonna cost you $$$$  

My old R33 ECU has this setup, but it was one of very few ever seen out of Japan.

are you saying this about the PowerFC or stocker ecu?

The standard ECU, if it detects more knock than what it has learnt it will revert to a lower octane map of where the timing numbers are reduced.

Ahh dont really want to reveal at this stage. Sorry

[R31Nismoid]

A properly tuned PowerFC wont knock

So there is no need to revert to a less powerful map.

And dont forget you can put sh|t pertol in and just alter the figure with the H/C via the PFC.

I've done that before loads of times when i cant find premium nearby.

takes all of 15seconds to knock timing out of it

well once you do its gonna be easy enough to copy anyhow mate

rest assured.

But it cant be much differet to what i have mentioned above from what ive seen

[R31Nismoid]

Oh, and if you aont wanna reveal, thats hardly being helpful which is what this forum is about.

no point coming on here and yabbering on if your going to keep secrets

[super26]

as alot of you guys said it is not only the computer you have too look at it is the tuner too, i have seen alot of power maid with the rb26 using a dta it was some where around 860hp to be exact and i am personally using an electromotive on my rb26 and looking to get around the same power or maybe more if i can, i really think all the computers are good it is the tuner who has to know what he is doing.

[Roy]

I dont have a problem with moding the std ecu over the PFc, id actually prefer it myself. Especially with that readout thingie in the for sale section. Have see a few cars running them and was impressed.

As for R33 GTRs, just plug in the R32 GTR ECU, too easy:)

[Cubes]

Martin Donnan remaps the ecu's over here with his own software.

So its nothing new really.

[rob82]

I know. I have been doing it for the past year and its not something you can sell to a mechanic. He most likely has a HEx editor that displays data that is being accessed at that exact moment. If you've seen the current software you would now its just tables and tables of hexidecimal code.

Such a negative bunch aren't we.

[Turbine]

I run an Autronic SMC in my race car. For a race car it's perfect, for the street it does more than what you really need but if you like tweaking engines i don't think you'll find much better.

So they are $1800 or so and then you need all the compatible sensors to run it, but I'll bet you have more horsepower per dollar when compared to another type of ecu setup on a similar engine. If not more horsepower you'll have better drivability/ torque.

Turbine.

[Cubes]

Rob82,

Have you had any experience tuning the stock ecu's with RX7 550cc high imp. injectors and the rb20?

I remember Martin had issues with trying to obtain a decent idle.

RX7 injectors being squirters they don't atomize fuel too well, that combined with the 2ltr 6cyl it doesn't work too well.

[Turbine]

Rob82,

Have you had any experience tuning the stock ecu's with RX7 550cc high imp. injectors and the rb20?

I remember Martin had issues with trying to obtain a decent idle.

RX7 injectors being squirters they don't atomize fuel too well, that combined with the 2ltr 6cyl it doesn't work too well.

We have a R32 GTS4 RB20DET with quite a few mods done to it, also with those injectors installed.

If we did'nt tell anyone they were in their, they would'nt know the difference with the idle and low RPM stability. This is with the standard ecu.

http://www.turboclub.com/Australia/Members...GTS4_AWD_21.jpg

Turbine

[Cubes]

Interestering..

Still return stock light load/cruise economy?

[Roy]

Hang on Turbine...have we changed nics, or are we posting pictures of someone elses car?

[Sydneykid]

I think we need to clarify a few things;

1. In our race team cars we have a number of different ECU's (Power FC's, Motec's, Microtech's, Autronic's and even an Electromotive in the SuperTourer). I can tell you that I truly believe only the PFC gives driveability as "nice" as the standard ECU with a very sensible amount of set up and tuning time. We can install a PFC and get a reasonably modified Skyline to run very nicely for ~$1300 (including the cost of the PFC). We can also get a Skyline to run nicely on a Motec, but it will cost closer to $5,000 and it won't make 1% more power either.

2. On line tuning for R32/Z32/S13 vintage ECU's has been around for years. Plenty of tuners have the software and the experience to carry out that process. The cost is usually around $800, being $500 for the rechip and $300 for the tune.

The problem is I can buy a Power FC for $950 now, that takes similar tuning time to a rechip of the standard ecu. So for $450 extra I get the Commander, which saves me buying a whole heap of gauges and gives me superior diagnostic ability to the Consult style readers (which cost $300 or so on their own).

3.There is considerable difficulty with rechipping the later vintage ECU's (R33GTST, R34GTT, Stagea S1 & S2 and R34GTR). Since R33GTST is the most popular model currently modified, this issue is not to be underestimated. There are some Japanese tuned (rechip via daughter board)) ECU's around, but their cost makes my nose bleed.

Buying a Power FC for this vintage is even more worthwhile with the same advantages (as above) plus a lower cost than the currently available rechips.

Is it any wonder that the PFC is the most popular ECU.

[Turbine]

Yes cubes, the car feels fine at light load and cruise. Economy is good enough to drive out along the great ocean road from melbourne with the car club.

The real trick was to modify the standard airflow meter so that it sees or feels the same air velocity across the sensor as it would if it had the stock turbo still on it. But it's mass is increased dramatically.

It was difficult to figure but it works. We have had a few tuners baffled by this when they get told what size those injectors are on a stock ecu.