R34 GT-T: COMPLETE suspension makeover

[SS8_Gohan]

Ok, i'll give the whiteline articles are read... Thanks SK

So i should probably do this in Stages?? Stage 1, 2, and 3?

I'll have read of the articles and try and come up with things to do.

So is that a unanimous no no for Jap Spec brands? Stick to Whiteline? Cos that would make it a lot easier in terms of choices.

cheers.

[SS8_Gohan]

Ok, information overload, but i read the R33 article, and the Project R34 one (not a lot of suspension info in that one), here's kinda what i followed...

In terms of the rear end of the car:

- HICAS is not your friend, and should be removed/bypassed.

- There is problem with the rear sub-frame, referring to the mounts?? Not sure on that one..

- Toe in under braking is good, and bushes can be used to control toe in

- Negative camber at the rear is problem when lowering, -1.75 normal(?) but can get to -2.5 after lowering. I'm not sure if i read this right, but is the rear camber factory adjustable to a certain extent?

- Definitely need camber kit if using lowered springs.

- Whiteline has a rear traction kit, to tune the rear end?

Ok now the front...

- Front castor kit, adds up to +1.5 degree of caster. This replaces hydro-elastic standard bush (this is from the handling plack i believe).

- Two upper transverse links have quite soft rubber bushes. Replace bushes with specifically designed urethan bushes.

- Changes to static caster/toe settings (?) - Used to fine tune behaviour of rear end or the amount of oversteer. A car is faster with a mild oversteer tendency. So i gather you want a bit of oversteer.

So that brings us to shocks/springs.

- 25mm lowered springs is about all the standard shocks can handle?

- Slightly higher spring rate compensates for reduced wheel travel.

- Shocks must be matched to springs - so shocks have a higher rate?

Then swaybars..

- Fine tune handling

- R33 whiteline swaybars fit fine for a R34

But in the Project R34 it did say that the R34 required completely different springs to what they have on the R33.

Ok, so i'm kinda piecing together all the different suspension components, which then begs the question, what order do i do all of this?? Here is what i kinda gather makes a fairly logical progression.

Stage 1: - Shocks and springs, as it seems things like castor/camber/toe in, etc are dependant on this? - So start with this. Does Whiteline only make springs? Cos it said they used Bilstein shocks, so the use other companies for shocks or they make their own as well?

Stage 2: - Castor/Camber kit. New bushes, um... Toe In settings?

Stage 3: - Whiteline Swaybars (mentioned 'blade' type a few times, these good?)

So yeah, that's an overall plan. I'm still not 100% with a lot this, but i think it's starting to make some sense. I might have a read of the Whiteline FAQ's as well.

Any suggestions very much appreciated. Hopefully i can make this kind of like a 'Project R34' thing, where i take pics, step by step stuff, updates on results. Altho none of this stuff can actually be done for a few months, but doesn't hurt to be prepared!

cheers

EDIT: The Advan Neovas?? They're on the car already, with the AVS Model 5's. Car is still in Japan, i couldn't find any prices for them locally either. So they good tyres are they?

[mist]

well, i like them... Pros in D1 use them for drift, but they're a nice grippy street performance tyre. Lucky u, i'm still looking for someone who can supply me a new set here. dunno why no one sells them, they're sold everywhere back home in Malaysia.

[SS8_Gohan]

i know you're prob wanted to give advice on everything Sydney Kid , but i was just wondering what you think of the 3 Stage idea? Dumb idea? Or should i just throw everything in at the same time, one large hit? Some ppl have already said do it bit by bit, so you get use to each modification, but i haven't even driven a Skyline before so i guess i won't have the standard handling to compare it with anyway.

cheers.

[Sydneykid]

i was just wondering what you think of the 3 Stage idea? Dumb idea? Or should i just throw everything in at the same time, one large hit?

Hi SS8_Gohan, I like to drive a car around a bit before I do anything. Plus I have seen guys buy stuff for their car before they actually see it and then find it already has it when it finally arrives. I can't be too smart on this as I did it, I bought a front and rear strut brace only to find the car had a front one on it when it arrived. Took the gloss of the cheap price I got the pair for.

As well, I like to feel the difference each part makes as you add it. If you do the whole lot at once and you don't like it, where do you start to fix it? So I would do it bit by bit, trying to avoid duplication of labour along the way. Don't do expensive stuff that has to be redone later on.

As for the order, I would do it this way;

1. Suspension geometry, every Skyline I have worked on has had some problems (worn components, broken links, poor alignment). If you leave this to last you may make some wrong decisions along the way. An example, it understeers a lot, so you choose the larger rear bar only to find the understeer was caused by poor front wheel alignment and worn front inner upper control arm bushes.

This includes caster bushes, camber adjusters and rear sub frame bushes (AKA pineapples, rear traction kit, ).

I know the usual excuse for puting this off, "I will have to adjust the camber again when I lower it". Realisically it take a few minutes to adjust the camber (since you already have the camber adjusters fitted) so I wouldn't worry about duplicating labour on this one.

2. Stabiliser bars, I do this second because it is the best value for money suspension upgrade (bang for your buck). Plus many people find the handling is so good (after 1 & 2) that they don't need do the springs and shocks. They like the ride comfort / handling compromise.

3. Springs and shocks, you know what the car feels like with all of the above done, so you know how much to upgrade the spring rates (if at all) and how much you want it lowered. This then determines the shock rates (and maybe even brand) that you need to control these spring rates.

If you decide to do HICAS, then it is best done at Stage 1 as it affects the choices for all of the above. Ditto strut braces.

Some of your questions;

Whiteline make springs, bushes, strut braces and stabiliser bars. They revalve shocks to suite the application, the spring rates and the stabiliser bar rates. Sometimes they use Bilsteins (if their characterstics suite the car), sometimes Konis, sometimes their own shocks made in Europe. Personally for the R34, I prefer Bilsteins, although the Stagea will be getting Konis as it will carry/tow different loads and I like to be able to adjust the damper rates.

I would only buy adjustable stabiliser bars if I was actually going to adjust them. If you like to fine tune the handling, then they are definitely the go. If you are a "put them on and forget about it person" then save your money and buy the fixed rate bars. This applies equally to height adjustable springs and adjustable dampers, if you want to "fit and forget" then save yourself some money and go fixed.

Hope that helps

[SS8_Gohan]

That helped A LOT!

You word is bible in these here parts, so i'll follow the steps to the letter

Stage 1: Sounds good. I was kind of under the impression that the Pineapples block the HICAS? something like that? Realistically i will probably take the car to a track a couple of times a year. I've never done anything like it in my life before so i don't know if i'll get the bug and can't stay away from the thing, or whether it will be something i just enjoy a few times a year. To the point With relatively little track usage, should i be getting rid of HICAS? Cos if it's something i should do, then as you said, better to get it done at Stage 1.

Stage 2: Cool, again, sounds good. Stabiliser bar same as Swaybar? There seems to be lots of interchangable terms :confused: Would you do strut braces here as well?

Stage 3: Going from my FWD Pulsar hatch, i'm sure i'll be impressed enough with the stock handling! So you're probably right, i'll most likely be happy with Stage 1 and 2. But i know like all stock cars, it can be made better and i think if i do all of this, i'm hoping the car will be a lot safer and more predictable car to drive. That's why i'm skipping power mods to start with. Despite all that, can't beat the look of a car lowered a touch And i want to lower it, but lower it right with performance ahead of looks in terms of priority.

So are you saying that if i'm happy with the handling after Stage 1 and Stage, maybe just get lowered springs with a slightly higher rate than standard springs to compensate for the decreased wheel travel? So i get the lowered look, but keep the performance advantage of having it lowered?

Just on a side note, have you worked on any R34's before?

I know camber is how the wheel tilts towards (-ve) or away from the car (+ve) - but i'm still not too clear on what caster is? Couldn't find a good explanation on the whiteline site.

Lastly (sorry!) is there any point looking elsewhere? As in, should i just stick with the whiteline solutions? Or should i be looking at some Japanese brand alternatives? It seems Whiteline is the most respected complete suspension specialist in Oz. I've heard nothing but shocking (excuse the pun ) things from Pedders, don't think i'd even take my Pulsar there!

Thanks again SydneyKid, just had an update on the car and hopefully it will be on a ship 28th/29th June, and here in Oz 11th July. So a few weeks off, but i can see some light at the end of the tunnel.

cheers

[Sydneykid]

Hey guys

This is a Son of SK post. NO help from the old man, all me me me. Maybe some help from google...

Camber, Toe & Castor - the difference

Most people hear these words but rarely have the opportunity to underst& what they mean & do.

TOE

This is the amount that the wheels are pointed in or out EG often called "total toe in or out". On rear independant suspension cars this is also adjustable, Subaru, Daihatsu etc. NOT live axle cars though. Fords, Holdens etc. Often measured in mm this little change makes huge differences in h&ling. As a car moves forward the suspension often moves back reducing toe in, so cars are often set with 1 - 3 mm toe IN. If the car has toe out it often tends to w&er on the road more.

On all our rally cars we run about 1 - 2 mm on the front & BACK.

Rear is less important as it tends to be less likely to be affected by knocks, pot holes & kerbs. BUT it is important to be correct

CAMBER

Think of the angle of most roads, look along it & it slopes to the side to make the water drain or is banked on fast freeway corners. This is camber, the angle your wheel sits in relation to vertical when pointed ahead & you look straight at the car from front or rear. Measured in degrees, most common road cars have 0 - .5 degree std. some more. Too much NEGATIVE camber will wear out tyres on the inside. POSITIVE wears out the outside. Look at really old cars they often have POSITIVE camber. (I do not know why).

The correct amount varies depending on CASTOR, (see follows) & how you drive your car. If you have little castor & you love driving fast through corners then you need more NEGATIVE camber, if you do heaps of freeway driving then less is better.

THE REASON? When you turn a corner the outside tyre tends to roll under the rim, causing it to wear on its outer edge. By laying it on its side you reduce this effect. Too much & it will wear on the inside, too little & wear on the outside.

NOTE this is often used to stop wide tyres rubbing on wheel arches or suspension points, this case tyres wear is not a focus! REMEMBER too much neg camber & you will lose traction in straight ahead driving as the tyre is not flat on the road.

CASTOR

This is the best of both! BUT is often not adjustable on modern cars.

Camber stays the same if the pivot (vertically) of the car suspension is zero. EG if you turn the wheel about its axis (steer not spin) it stays the same. BUT if the axis is at an angle (for & aft) then the more you steer the car, the more camber you get!

Its hard to relate, but if you imagine looking at the LHS of the cars wheel, with front to your left, if you grabbed the top of the axis & moved it back (to horizontal) with the wheel position staying still then this is castor, then imagine, if you turned the wheel to the right 90 degrees then the wheel will lay flat, this is obviously an extreme example but best explained.

SO, the more castor the more the wheel will increase negative camber the more you turn the wheel. BUT too much castor & the car will want to w&er as it has less tendency to want to point straight ahead.

REMEMBER

Check your tyre pressures, over 80% of cars have UNDER inflated tyres & most companies, TYRES & CARS, suggest low, for better ride. On most Subaru's, Hyundai's Daihatsu's etc try 35 PSI it will steer better, ride a bit harder, but go HEAPS better!

On most cars these days we can supply camber kits to increase & allow adjustable camber, most Subarus have some adjustable limits. Castor well thats hard, but possible!

Remember that you pay for what you get, a cheap wheel alignment means just that!

MRT

Toe-In/Out is a slight steering angle that is preset into the suspension. Toe-in has the tires pointing slightly toward the center of the car's front. Toe-out has the cars pointing slightly away from the car. In the diagram above, there is zero toe-in/out. Toe-in/out is used to offset the natural change in toe position caused by braking & accelleration.

Unsprung Weight

Unsprung weight is a measurement of the weight of everything outboard of the wishbones or suspension links, plus 1/2 of the weight of the wishbones or links & spring/shock. It has a great effect on h&ling. The diagram below demonstrates why unsprung weight is so important:

The more weight outboard of the car, the more force bumps exert on the suspension (& ultimately the chassis). This force must be dealt with using springs, dampers & anti-roll bars (described below), & the more force, the more difficult it is to keep the tire planted on the road. This is especially true of lighter weight cars. In the example above, if the car weighs 1000 lbs, a 2G bump would result in a vertical force of 10% of the car's weight. This will at the very least reduce the grip of the car, because the weight of the car is what keeps the tire planted, & pushing a car up into the air with that much force will inevitably reduce the weight on the tire, & hence grip.

Tyres

As the first point of contact with the road, the tires work in conjunction with the suspension geometry & weight transfer dynamics to provide grip. Many different types of tires exist, but provided you are building for a specific class, you can easily select a particularly good or popular tire.

The grip provided by a tire is linked to the coefficient of friction (Cf) of the rubber compound & to the tire's construction (Radial/bias). This coefficient indicates the lateral grip the tire is capable of providing for a given weight being placed on it. Racing slicks are very high Cf tires, in the range of 1.0 or more. Street radials, on the other h&, rarely even approach 1.0. So what is in a number? If you were to place 500 lbs weight onto each of four tires with a Cf of 1.0, you could expect 2000 lbs (actually a little less) of lateral grip. Without aerodynamic aids to add to vehicle weight, the car would almost achieve a 1G turn.

Castor angle

If the lower swivel is further forward than the upper you have positive castor (aka trail). In this situation the centre of the tyre's contact patch trails behind the point where the king pin axis intercepts the ground. Thus

the steering self centres, the drag on the tyre will pull it back behind the king pin axis. Just like a bike (push or motor).

With things the other way round the steering would tend to un-centre itself (just like reversing).

The castor has no effect on the roll. Body roll is caused by the contact with the road being lower than the centre of mass of the car so when cornering the momentum of the vehicle trying to carry on in a straight line pulls the vehicle & tends to tilt it over. What we know as centrifugal force, but which doesn't really exist.

also thanks to http://www.gmecca.com

here's some RWD assistance for toe..

Toe-in / Toe-out

I'm not the definitive expert on these matters, but AFAIK front toe is usually set so that in normal driving condition the wheels point straight ahead. A Skyline is RWD & so when driving forward the front wheels are dragged back.

Changing toe settings will affect steering feel & not much else. adding toe-out will make a car turn in quicker & make the steering more sensitive. Too much toe-out will cause darting while braking heavily & an unsteady feel at high speeds. Too much toe-in will give the steering a very lazy feel. Toe settings also need to take into account the amount of Ackermann angle designed into the front steering arms. Bump steer is when the car darts to one side or the other when one wheel moves up or down more than the other wheel. This is usually a design of the suspension, or a bent steering arm, or modification (ie. lowering) that alters the geometry too much. Bump steer happens when the up & down arc of the steering arm & the suspension arms are of a different radius.

Toe-out in front wheel drive cars is to get the wheels to a close to zero toe setting when acceleration causes the wheels to move forward slightly due to suspension bushing deflection.

No toe-out in the rear!!!! If most cars have toe-out added to the rear it can cause serious oversteer, sometimes snap-oversteer when letting off of the throttle.

Source: Haynes Workshop Manual 1969 to 1996 up to P reg (UK) (added 25 11 02)

front 1.58mm toe out

3 +/- 1 degrees positive castor

2 +/- 1 degrees positive camber

rear 3.17 mm toe in

0.5 to 2.5 degrees positive camber

thanks to www.ime.co.uk

How can Whiteline HELP????

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_0134/article.html

Should get you guys started

Hope you can find some useful & intellectual assistance here, & please, do some of your own research on the subject, becuase it really is worth it

Supplementry articles may be found on Autospeed....

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_0913/article.html

[banshee_04]

Hi everyone,

Well car has been bought and as usual, modification plans are underway before the car even lands in Oz!

Basically i've decided to do things backwards from the norm. Before i touch exhaust/intake/engine/boost, etc i thought i'd trick out the suspension. Firstly, is this a stupid way of going about things?

Car currently has 255/40/17 on the rears, not sure what up front, but most prob 235/40/17 - Tyres are Advan Neovas and rims are AVS Model 5's. So rim/tyre package seems to be pretty good.

Now, i don't really know a lot about shocks, springs, coil overs, camber, castor, bushes, pineapples, strut braces, control arms, etc. so i've come to pick some brains. Basically the car is going to be chasing complete and utter response (inspiration from Mines R34 GTR ) and a will be used on a real track (one with corners) so what am i going to need? Car is completely stock at the moment, except for rims with the Advan tyres.

Don't really have a budget (but lets not go nuts ) but don't have the faintest idea where to start, there seems to be a lot of suspension areas to modify.

Just trying to make the car faster, without making it more powerful

cheers!

EDIT: Just reading through a few threads in this section, some saying things like a good track setup can be quite dangerous on normal roads, especially in the wet, etc.

This is my first hi-po car (currently driving 57kw FWD pulsar ) so it's another reason why i wanted the car to be more stable and have more grip, rather than make it more powerful. I want to make it safer and more predictable... i've been thinking about a brake upgrade too.

[banshee_04]

ahh tried replying but new to this so this is a test i uploaded my reply is that right ill try add reply this time if this works ill start again

[banshee_04]

3rd time lucky okkkkk sus as good start as any get working 2nd hand coil overs if you can preferably adjustable if HA (hight adjust) measure ur car hight of ground & 4 now set same ive got nismo set u can adjust on car dont need remove anything if 2nd hand u also need hight adjust spanners x2 dont really need to hard a sping rate as really u will be driving on road as well set shocks firmer instead nismo fr 4way rear 8way adjust to start out u dnt really need 32way adjust to many get some thing cheap and simple that u can grow with till you get experienced & undestand whats going on. once fitted go find that 35k freeway entrance ramp set on soft and go practice till ur speeds consistant 4 now stay on centre exit through and as clean as poss (this will serve u later when on track) now set hard do the same note differance then once good with that try inbetween settings till u get the right balance for ur car with the highest consistant speed will post more when i can this is the really short version too

[banshee_04]

(dont forget that wheel alignment after install) Now go back that corner and get that nose to the guard rail at apex nail it but not to much yet get it to the point of where it wants to let go as you come out dont hook it hard slow and smooth turning if the rear wants to kick out rear sus may be too soft set on next firmer try again till its best can be. next dont be afraid of those squeeling tyres when your ass wants to go out start with light steering pressure in oposite direction to counter till you get consistant aim for 3 months daily practice till u get really good but time is not important just take ur time and learn ur car safest 4 u and everyone else. next and cheap again get a cusco torsion bar goes up b4 near radiator support between links remove link nuts put in place replace nuts now when you go around corner you will find you can go 5 - 10ks faster b4 tyres squeeel and it will only cost u about $110 bucks still on a cheap budget:) now some kiddies will not like this but dont touch that hicass it only moves 1deg or so out any way unless its been played with (evedent by the fact the warning light has been removed from the dash) to reset back put wheel in a strait ahead postion take that battery lead off go have a coffie for half an hour and when you put back on and turn things on if its out it will check and reset itself u will hear ne ne ne clunk as the servo moves and locks back in place cheapest wheel alignment ive ever done dont be afraid of it either its there to help that sensor box in the boot behind the seat is whats helping u go faster around high speed corners learn to use it nail that pedal trust me it likes it other wise uve just got a normal car too many people criticise it they dont undestand how it works or havent learnt to use it to advantage it takes time "quote i lost it cause hicass stuffed me up" hog wash ive had mine for 6 yrs and drive like a ninny lots of fun (opps) but no accidents even if it fails again 1deg of movement will really spew u off bahhh if they broke rear link more that gutter they slid into the other day even if it did that practice you did b4 will help counter (being the magic word) such a situation should it arise and for both rear wheels to be out it would have to be magic or a good bingle. ur hicass rack is also doing another great job by stiffening up the rear look up rear non hicass brace bar uve already got a hunk of metal doing that job anyway if u want ill keep posting ill go through most things i can think of the cheapest way i can think of to help you beat those better buggers around the track trust me the look on their face is priceless when u stick it to them in your so called under rated standard car powers not every thing an eg of this is the mines gtr lookup american touge 3 hot version i think great example of good balanced car not to overpowered that kicks but they also do gtt ohh before i go DONT buy bcnr33 coilovers etc etc even if they fit the spring rates front to rear are diff front to rear as gtt only buy direct for gtt

[SS8_Gohan]

hi banshee,

punctuation

[n15m0]

hi banshee,

punctuation.

And paragaphing...my head hurts now reading all tht...and u do realise u have replied to a 4 yr old thread??

[SS8_Gohan]

haven't read it, just going to "edit" it, see what this actually all says (just punctuation, won't bother with spelling)

3rd time lucky

okkkkk sus as good start as any get working 2nd hand coil overs, if you can preferably adjustable if HA (hight adjust). Measure ur car hight of ground & 4 now set same, ive got nismo set u can adjust on car dont need remove anything.

If 2nd hand u also need hight adjust spanners x2, dont really need to hard a sping rate as really u will be driving on road as well. Set shocks firmer instead nismo fr 4way rear 8way adjust to start out u, dnt really need 32way adjust to many get some thing cheap and simple that u can grow with till you get experienced & undestand whats going on.

Once fitted go find that 35k freeway entrance ramp set on soft and go practice till ur speeds consistant 4 now stay on centre, exit through and as clean as poss (this will serve u later when on track). Now set hard do the same note differance then once good with that try inbetween settings. Keep doing this until u get the right balance for ur car with the highest consistant speed. I will post more when i can this is the really short version too

[SS8_Gohan]

(dont forget that wheel alignment after install)

Now go back that corner and get that nose to the guard rail at apex, nail it but not to much yet get it to the point of where it wants to let go. As you come out dont hook it hard slow and smooth turning, if the rear wants to kick out rear sus may be too soft set on next firmer. Try again till its best can be.

Next dont be afraid of those squeeling tyres when your ass wants to go out, start with light steering pressure in oposite direction to counter till you get consistant. Aim for 3 months daily practice till u get really good but time is not important just take ur time and learn ur car safest 4 u and everyone else.

Next and cheap again get a cusco torsion bar goes up b4 near radiator support between links, remove link nuts put in place replace nuts. Now when you go around corner you will find you can go 5 - 10ks faster b4 tyres squeeel and it will only cost u about $110 bucks still on a cheap budget:)

Now some kiddies will not like this but dont touch that hicass, it only moves 1deg or so out any way unless its been played with (evedent by the fact the warning light has been removed from the dash). To reset back put wheel in a strait ahead postion, take that battery lead off go have a coffie for half an hour. When you put back on and turn things on if its out it will check and reset itself, u will hear ne ne ne clunk as the servo moves and locks back in place. Cheapest wheel alignment ive ever done. Dont be afraid of it either, its there to help that sensor box in the boot behind the seat. It's whats helping u go faster around high speed corners learn to use, it nail that pedal, trust me it likes it other wise uve just got a normal car. Too many people criticise it they dont undestand how it works or havent learnt to use it to advantage, it takes time. "Quote i lost it cause hicass stuffed me up" hog wash, ive had mine for 6 yrs and drive like a ninny lots of fun (opps) but no accidents. Even if it fails again 1deg of movement will really spew u off, bahhh, if they broke rear link more that gutter they slid into the other day. Even if it did that, practice you did b4 will help counter (being the magic word) such a situation should it arise and for both rear wheels to be out it would have to be magic or a good bingle. Ur hicass rack is also doing another great job by stiffening up the rear. Look up rear non hicass brace bar, uve already got a hunk of metal doing that job anyway.

If u want ill keep posting, ill go through most things i can think of the cheapest way i can think of to help you beat those better buggers around the track. Trust me, the look on their face is priceless when u stick it to them in your so called under rated standard car. Powers not every thing, an eg of this is the mines gtr. Lookup american touge 3 hot version, i think great example of good balanced car, not to overpowered that kicks, but they also do gtt

ohh before i go DONT buy bcnr33 coilovers etc etc even if they fit, the spring rates front to rear are diff front to rear as gtt, only buy direct for gtt

------------------------------------------------------------

Banshee_04, mate thanks for the post/s (honestly) A little hard to understand, but there's definitely some interesting stuff in there and few things that go against the status quo, that's for sure! (read HICAS) Sounds like you've played around with Skylines for a while. You in Australia? Do you have an R34 or another Skyline?

thanks for the tips!

[banshee_04]

(dont forget that wheel alignment after install)

Now go back that corner and get that nose to the guard rail at apex, nail it but not to much yet get it to the point of where it wants to let go. As you come out dont hook it hard slow and smooth turning, if the rear wants to kick out rear sus may be too soft set on next firmer. Try again till its best can be.

Next dont be afraid of those squeeling tyres when your ass wants to go out, start with light steering pressure in oposite direction to counter till you get consistant. Aim for 3 months daily practice till u get really good but time is not important just take ur time and learn ur car safest 4 u and everyone else.

Next and cheap again get a cusco torsion bar goes up b4 near radiator support between links, remove link nuts put in place replace nuts. Now when you go around corner you will find you can go 5 - 10ks faster b4 tyres squeeel and it will only cost u about $110 bucks still on a cheap budget:)

Now some kiddies will not like this but dont touch that hicass, it only moves 1deg or so out any way unless its been played with (evedent by the fact the warning light has been removed from the dash). To reset back put wheel in a strait ahead postion, take that battery lead off go have a coffie for half an hour. When you put back on and turn things on if its out it will check and reset itself, u will hear ne ne ne clunk as the servo moves and locks back in place. Cheapest wheel alignment ive ever done. Dont be afraid of it either, its there to help that sensor box in the boot behind the seat. It's whats helping u go faster around high speed corners learn to use, it nail that pedal, trust me it likes it other wise uve just got a normal car. Too many people criticise it they dont undestand how it works or havent learnt to use it to advantage, it takes time. "Quote i lost it cause hicass stuffed me up" hog wash, ive had mine for 6 yrs and drive like a ninny lots of fun (opps) but no accidents. Even if it fails again 1deg of movement will really spew u off, bahhh, if they broke rear link more that gutter they slid into the other day. Even if it did that, practice you did b4 will help counter (being the magic word) such a situation should it arise and for both rear wheels to be out it would have to be magic or a good bingle. Ur hicass rack is also doing another great job by stiffening up the rear. Look up rear non hicass brace bar, uve already got a hunk of metal doing that job anyway.

If u want ill keep posting, ill go through most things i can think of the cheapest way i can think of to help you beat those better buggers around the track. Trust me, the look on their face is priceless when u stick it to them in your so called under rated standard car. Powers not every thing, an eg of this is the mines gtr. Lookup american touge 3 hot version, i think great example of good balanced car, not to overpowered that kicks, but they also do gtt

ohh before i go DONT buy bcnr33 coilovers etc etc even if they fit, the spring rates front to rear are diff front to rear as gtt, only buy direct for gtt

------------------------------------------------------------

Banshee_04, mate thanks for the post/s (honestly) A little hard to understand, but there's definitely some interesting stuff in there and few things that go against the status quo, that's for sure! (read HICAS) Sounds like you've played around with Skylines for a while. You in Australia? Do you have an R34 or another Skyline?

thanks for the tips!

Im in AUS R34 had it for 6 years now yeah didnt care about date as anyone else reading for info might find it useful.........i tell u one thing though its been very reliable

[Downforce]

I disagree with your comments on the HICAS banshee, I locked my rear end steering because it is not friendly to drive with HICAS on the circuit. But each to their own I guess

[banshee_04]

I disagree with your comments on the HICAS banshee, I locked my rear end steering because it is not friendly to drive with HICAS on the circuit. But each to their own I guess

Ok well better go buy your self the $500 plus factory manual with insert suppliment and learn how the hicass is adjusted, at exactly after 110kph mine makes a bit of a differant movement so i dont have to stear as much for the same turn. Quite common in japan usually done for better drifting, too give you an idea to get my tail out i only have to yank 1/4 of a turn if that let go move wheel to counter postion hold with throttle, there is also alot of other things going on that effect how your cars going such as those naughty traction sensors etc etc, have a look at the rear rack there is adjustment on rack if not get a preprogramed ecu from say mines (VX ROM) comes with matching injectors tell them you want for circuit 1 to 1.2 Bar Boost should be sufficient its direct plugin factory redone computer so every thing works as it should.

If you dont have Adjustable links coil overs(HA type) upper arms etc get some and learn to do your own wheel alignment then start making changes and adding a few more degrees till you get it right for how you want it to behave (if your rears abit unstable goto a .5 bigger rim with same size tyre and that will settle it down). Theres nothing more funny than going around the circuit behind someone better, then coming round them on said corner with a slight ass out position around them where i shouldnt be abale to do such a thing, its the hicass thats helping me by controlling my postion, because without it I coundnt pull that stunt, dont be afraid to make changes find some one with equipment or buy your own if your serious, you just need learn to understand the fundamentals of how it works and why and whats happening, i dont always get it right but thats half the fun and learn as you go, you'll get better. May I suggest going to a rally school get them to teach you their techniques, you will trace a more even driving line and your lap times will improve with time. Hope this helps..............

Edited January 19, 2008 by banshee_04

[banshee_04]

Ok well better go buy your self the $500 plus factory manual with insert suppliment and learn how the hicass is adjusted, at exactly after 110kph mine makes a bit of a differant movement so i dont have to stear as much for the same turn. Quite common in japan usually done for better drifting, too give you an idea to get my tail out i only have to yank 1/4 of a turn if that let go move wheel to counter postion hold with throttle, there is also alot of other things going on that effect how your cars going such as those naughty traction sensors etc etc, have a look at the rear rack there is adjustment on rack if not get a preprogramed ecu from say mines (VX ROM) comes with matching injectors tell them you want for circuit 1 to 1.2 Bar Boost should be sufficient its direct plugin factory redone computer so every thing works as it should.

If you dont have Adjustable links coil overs(HA type) upper arms etc get some and learn to do your own wheel alignment then start making changes and adding a few more degrees till you get it right for how you want it to behave (if your rears abit unstable goto a .5 bigger rim with same size tyre and that will settle it down). Theres nothing more funny than going around the circuit behind someone better, then coming round them on said corner with a slight ass out position around them where i shouldnt be abale to do such a thing, its the hicass thats helping me by controlling my postion, because without it I coundnt pull that stunt, dont be afraid to make changes find some one with equipment or buy your own if your serious, you just need learn to understand the fundamentals of how it works and why and whats happening, i dont always get it right but thats half the fun and learn as you go, you'll get better. May I suggest going to a rally school get them to teach you their techniques, you will trace a more even driving line and your lap times will improve with time. Hope this helps..............

Oh Yeah don't forget you will need to remove the hicass warning light from dash as it will flash at you after you change adjustment, also if you remove and replace battery it will realign itself and you will loose your setting and need to reset to factory, remove replace battery (so it goes back to original position), reset to previously adjusted setting.

Edited January 19, 2008 by banshee_04