Project: Anything Is Possible

[No Crust Racing]

Still having major problems with squat and I've had a week off so I'm not tired. I have no idea why the knee is bending in but was very bad today,so will just continue to do 40kg for reps. I'm upset because it feels like I won't make progress this way as 40kg isn't heavy for me but any heavier and the knee bends in.

Something I'll add.

I've found a few times that I'm fine at weight X but as soon as I go up from there, something bad will happen form wise. I've also found that SOMETIMES, not all the time and this should be done very carefully, the best thing to do is just start training at the heavier weight.

If the problem doesn't exist until a certain point, you must train at that point to solve the problem. Look at the so you think you can squat video series, they take him well beyond where he starts to show small signs of form issues to really push him. You're really on scraping the tip of the iceberg in terms of what form problems you could have at higher weights.

I'd be inclined to go a week or two training at the heavier weight and working on the problem with the working weight on board rather than trying to force your body to "fix" an issue that doesn't exists at the lower weight you're using.

Just an idea.

Before training - BN whey protein shake with creatine, taurine and beta alanine

I was under the impression creatine was best taken immediately after exercise, not before it (assuming you are not in a loading phase and are just taking it regularly).

This could be Bro science, but take a look at: http://www.mensfitness.com/nutrition/supplements/when%E2%80%99s-the-best-time-to-take-creatine

"While creatine boosted strength and muscle mass among all men in the study, those who took creatine after working out gained more lean mass and increased their bench-press one-rep max more than men who took the supplement pre-workout."

Edited November 4, 2013 by ActionDan

[L33SH]

Hi Dan thanks for your suggestion about the squats, personally i agree with you but as soon as i start on a heavier weight it happens straight away, so how am i going to correct it?

I purchased creatine from the BN website; their instructions were 2-10g 30 minutes before training. I take 3.45g which is one scoop.

Maybe I should add a half scoop after training as well?

What's everyone else's thoughts?

[No Crust Racing]

I think as long as you're getting up to 5g a day you'll be fine.

I've just read a lot of stuff that said take it after you exercise.

As for the squats, how do you expect to improve the problem if you don't train at that weight? Is a little knee bending on one side that big a deal? Is it hurting you? Remember a ROM problem or muscle weakness anywhere must be compensated for my other parts of the chain, the problem may not be the knee at all.

My point about training at that weight or beyond it is similar to what I said in my thread about me adding weight to anything. Sometimes I can go 8/8/7 at a given weight for ages and ages, and not ever make that 8th rep, but then I'll add weight an quickly get to 8/8/7 at the new weight, which has pushed me beyond the 8th rep on the previous weight.

In your case I see it as, at 45kg your knee starts to bend in, so train at that weight for a while, say 2-3 weeks or so, then go up to 47.5 or 50 and spend another 2-4 weeks at 50. My guess being that after a few weeks at 50, if you dropped back down to 45, there'd be no knee bending because your body is now trained for 50kg and whatever weakness that showed up at 45, has been strengthened such that you get knee bend at 50 now but no longer at 45.

Sometimes you have to go a few steps beyond the problem weight to fix the problem at the weight it shows up at.

Say a guy can bench 180kg, I bet his 140kg bench is rock solid form wise, but at some point, when he could only bench 145, his 140 might have looked pretty shaky, but as he pushed further and further forward, 140 becomes easier and easier.

So for you, by the time you are squatting 60kg reps, your 45 will look solid as. Sometimes you have to go well beyond the problem zone before it gets better.

BUT this is just, one view, I'm no trainer or strength coach etc.

[L33SH]

yeah it does hurt my hamstring

[rev210]

Two things for squat . One , don't think the training is geared to strength ( so improvements in strength will be muted). Two , I reckon you need to look at your squat width and make sure the hip motion is right. How wide are the feet? How is the glute activation are you using the glutes actively/focus? How far up do you get the knee bend?

[No Crust Racing]

Ahh well, that's different then.

If you have pain, on one side you've got a ROM, form (setup), or a strength bias issue.

[L33SH]

Two things for squat . One , don't think the training is geared to strength ( so improvements in strength will be muted). Two , I reckon you need to look at your squat width and make sure the hip motion is right. How wide are the feet? How is the glute activation are you using the glutes actively/focus? How far up do you get the knee bend?

Feet are a bit wider than shoulder width with toes pointed slightly outwards. I've tried other widths and stances and this feels the best for me. I squeeze glutes before I squat down and just before I stand up again. I try and squeeze them the whole time but that's very difficult.

I get the knee bend at the start at the motion upwards so I've bent down and done the squat and it's just as I bend up and continues until I stand up straight again.

[Trozzle]

https://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_supplements/catching_up_on_creatine

[Trozzle]

That's a 2 page article, by the way. Bit hard to notice haha

[L33SH]

From the article:

Pre-workout creatine will certainly increase your intravascular volume, and could help you get a bigger pump. But it can also pump up your GI tract, while the increased fluid in your veins could indicate intramuscular and tissue dehydration.

That's why I think creatine works best as part of your post-workout shake.

Wah, now I'm confused.. why are BN saying to have it 30 minutes before workout?

[Trozzle]

The bit you've quoted is the only real reason you'd want to have it a more than a certain time before your workout...everyone would be different there, so either trial it for yourself over a week or so to see how you feel depending on when you take it, or just err on the side of caution and take it WELL before your workout. Unlike most things you'd supplement prior to your workout, I believe creatine's most effective over time - as in you don't take it Monday arvo for that day's training session; you take it every day for the future's sessions as it takes time to accumulate and reach maximum saturation in your muscle cells etc

[L33SH]

Okay, so I've been taking creatine in my protein shake on the way to the gym with taurine and beta alanine.

I'm worried that this is potentially unsafe after reading the article you link Troy.

Maybe I should just have creatine post workout? However I've read that taurine is best consumed with creatine? So should I be having taurine post workout too?

[-FIGJAM-]

Hi Leesh

I am with Rev in regards to squats. It may just be a slight technique issue. My knees bend in as well due to a number of issues mainly mobility is the key. Does the bend happen immediately as in first rep of the new set or does it happen as you start getting towards the end of the set?

Also in regards to creatin who cares? Just drink it or dont drink it. I know people who believe they lift more on it then they do without it and I know people on the other side of the coin. I think you are giving yourself a migrain trying to think of all of these things and getting upset about them. I take creatin at night have never ever noticed any difference in weight or workouts whilst taking the supplement. My cousin takes it after his workouts, he believes that it (an other supplements) have helped him to maintain strength druing his cutting phases.

BN probably say take before a workout because they have read a few studies of many that suggest its good to take it at that time

It almost seems that you have forgotten to enjoy your workouts and if that is the case, that will play a big part of mindset and performance in the gym (as well as out but thats another story)

Just another side of the coin

[Trozzle]

There's nothing unsafe about what you're doing Leesh - just the remote potential for gastric upset or remote dehydration (which is the only potential negatives I took from that article). As you said, you've already been taking it at a particular time - if this hasn't presented you with any concerns as I mentioned, then you've got nothing to worry about at all.

It's not like they're prescription meds with potential interactions

[rev210]

Feet are a bit wider than shoulder width with toes pointed slightly outwards. I've tried other widths and stances and this feels the best for me. I squeeze glutes before I squat down and just before I stand up again. I try and squeeze them the whole time but that's very difficult.

I get the knee bend at the start at the motion upwards so I've bent down and done the squat and it's just as I bend up and continues until I stand up straight again.

Ok . So potentially the legs are doing more share than they should. Your width on the squat will effect glute activation and hip motion to some degree. Out of the bottom of the movement you want explosive accelleration generated from all the muscles but, importantly glutes. If you play with feet width , notice the activation of the glutes changing in relation to the width.

When learning , what 'feels' best and what 'works' best are sometimes different. If you can take a look at the setup and see if you can noticably increase the glute /hip activation. You will also get much better hip/glute power with a low bar squat. But, start with the way you are doing it.

Again. I'd like to point out that going for bigger weight numbers is not how your training is setup. If you are really serious about squatting more then you need to turf it for squats , is my opinion.

[L33SH]

Rev what would you suggest the reps and sets would look like if training in squats for strength?

[L33SH]

06/11/13

Deadlift

60kg x 10

70kg x 10

80kg x 10

90kg x 3

100kg x 1

Bench Press

35kg x 10

40kg x 6

40kg x 5

40kg x 5

45kg x 2

45 Leg Press

80kg x 10

100kg x 10

120kg x 10

140kg x 10

160kg x 5

Right hammy hurting so stopped, think it's related to my right knee bending in issue, not sure what to do.

Bicep Curl

15kg x 10

15kg x 10

15kg x 10

20kg x 7

20kg x 7

20kg x 6

Captains Chair

30

20

20

20

20

10

Knee Raises

20

10

Diet:

Breakfast: 1/2 cup oats with banana, chia seeds and a banana and apple smoothie

Hour after breakfast: coffee

Recess: punnet of blueberries

Lunch: pasta

Afternoon: dried coconut chips and whey protein shake with creatine, taurine and beta alanine

After training: whey protein shake with Alcar and 1/2 scoop of creatine

Dinner: 4 egg omelette with mushroom, tomato, spinach, cheese and chives with oven baked chips

[rev210]

Rev what would you suggest the reps and sets would look like if training in squats for strength?

For starts , I reckon give the hammies some rehab. You need them. Good mornings will help. Make sure you warm them up before things like squats.

I reckon your squat issues are around the hip strength and letting the hips work more.To help when you are squatting you want to think about pushing the feet out ,as opposed to down or away. This should be felt in the hips and it's going to help push the knees out actively. The knees out shortens the distance and increases hip leverage but, the hip power has to kick in.

I'm no expert but, box squats would probably help you learn that better.

Strength wise 5-7 reps a set , 3 max would do and lots of rest between sets. Fix the hammy first .

[No Crust Racing]

100kg Deads, aww yeah.

Re the creatine, I don't treat it as a performance enhancer, rather as a recovery enhancer. You're not going to see any mad improvement in output, but you may recover faster.

I've been smashing my protein and creatine shakes while doing yard work this week and I'm holding up OK (except my lady hands).

[L33SH]

100kg Deads, aww yeah.

Huge improvement in deads from last session!!! I'm still working out how I should progress weight wise each session though.