Xtreme Motorsport - Gun Metal Grey R32 Gtr - Claiming 85,000Km !

[Joe@Xtreme Motorsports]

* We on the Executive of SAU.NSW have helped several Members out (and even non-members) by inspecting cars for them on request.

* To my knowledge, we've inspected two cars at Xtreme Motorsport since 2011, and did further research.

* One car was on consignment and was purchased. The other was not: and this other car was sold elsewhere.

* Our Execs receive requests via PM from time to time about a whole array of grey import cars from USA and Japan

* We do not sit idly by and simply observe Members getting scammed. We are a club affiliated with CAMs and not a government authority.

We will report anyone who furnishes cars for sale that have false odometer readings or re-anodises a build plate to assist making it look like a Nur.

Thanks Terry.

The cars in question are on consignment and were actually purchased through a new supplier who supposedly had them in stock.

Unfortunately Xtreme Motorsports copped it and even the supplier wont get back to me and my friend who purchased them is really upset and angry.

Even the dealer (another Importer) who put them onto me wont even answer my calls. He promised me to trust them and they are genuine.

The cars I posted up for JOC to check are actually cars that I hand picked and purchased through my guys and is my stock.

You and Chris know that I tell the truth no matter how much it hurts and never hide from anything.

I have always been upfront and direct and even when it came to Chris's car told you guys the truth and had no hidden agenda's.

[Alkatraz]

The cars in question are on consignment and were actually purchased through a new supplier who supposedly had them in stock.

Unfortunately Xtreme Motorsports copped it and even the supplier wont get back to me and my friend who purchased them is really upset and angry.

Even the dealer (another Importer) who put them onto me wont even answer my calls. He promised me to trust them and they are genuine.

Sorry if I am misunderstanding but are you referring to the cars which were listed on the previous page by DodgyImports?

[JapaneseOdoCheck]

Good morning,

I woke up today to a PM from Joe@Xtreme asking me to do a background check on a few of his vehicles.

I am more then happy to do this, but I would have to make him pay for it like each of my customers do.

I've already replied to his PM offering him to be the first business to take a leap into obtaining genuine paperwork from Japan to their doorstep, we shall see what his reply is.

I think $80 per certificate (delivered to him in a week) is not a bad price at all ! The question is now about whether or not he will take the leap.

I will not carry out checks on car he thinks are genuine for free out of my own wallet just to support his case ( no offence intended Joe)

Regards,

JOC

[Joe@Xtreme Motorsports]

Sorry if I am misunderstanding but are you referring to the cars which were listed on the previous page by DodgyImports?

Yes thats correct.

Good morning,

I woke up today to a PM from Joe@Xtreme asking me to do a background check on a few of his vehicles.

I am more then happy to do this, but I would have to make him pay for it like each of my customers do.

I've already replied to his PM offering him to be the first business to take a leap into obtaining genuine paperwork from Japan to their doorstep, we shall see what his reply is.

I think $80 per certificate (delivered to him in a week) is not a bad price at all ! The question is now about whether or not he will take the leap.

I will not carry out checks on car he thinks are genuine for free out of my own wallet just to support his case ( no offence intended Joe)

Regards,

JOC

I will be taking the leap.

I will PM you shortly and you can verify this.

[BakemonoRicer]

Good morning,

I woke up today to a PM from Joe@Xtreme asking me to do a background check on a few of his vehicles.

I am more then happy to do this, but I would have to make him pay for it like each of my customers do.

I've already replied to his PM offering him to be the first business to take a leap into obtaining genuine paperwork from Japan to their doorstep, we shall see what his reply is.

I think $80 per certificate (delivered to him in a week) is not a bad price at all ! The question is now about whether or not he will take the leap.

I will not carry out checks on car he thinks are genuine for free out of my own wallet just to support his case ( no offence intended Joe)

Regards,

JOC

Lol.

$80 for a certificate.....and you're trying to justify that's not a bad price.

Facepalm, brah.

Plus, there are ways for the odometer to be wound back in Japan without it coming up on one of your checks.

Anyway, to Joe, I see the fact you are paying someone to do an odometer check as fairlyyyy pointless. Lets say a hypothetical vehicle had an odometer wound back, what's to stop it from just being wound forward, before getting the odometer check done?

[Owgasm]

We will report anyone who furnishes cars for sale that have false odometer readings or re-anodises a build plate to assist making it look like a Nur.

Wow. Would love to hear about this, pm me if you ever have a spare moment Terry.

I do think I know of it a little though.

Edited August 21, 2013 by Owgasm

[dodgyimports]

$80 for a certificate.....and you're trying to justify that's not a bad price.

Facepalm, brah.

Wow... $80 is actually really good value considering what you receive is a piece of official government-issued documentation and a fully translation version which is likely to increase the value of your car (assuming the KM's check out legit). This can only be done IN JAPAN - which means someone has to be available in Japan to request the document from the government agency. These people have to eat.

$80 on a $15,000+ investment is bloody good value.

Stupid thing to post.

RE: Joe - much respect to see that you are putting additional cars up for scrutiny and looking to fix the issue. I will have a more detailed response later.

[Longz]

^ There was another NUR as i recall with a Vspec steering wheel, Red stiching. Not sure if swapped for cosmetic or fake.

[JapaneseOdoCheck]

Thank you for your reply DodgyImports.

$80 on a $15,000+ Investment equates to less then 1%. Let me be exact here it equates to 0.0053% of the purchase price !

Please explain to me how that is indeed not good value at all?

Joe is the first dealer to jump onboard after I've had numerous customers from all around Australia in the past 3 months since I've opened up business.

What motivated me to open up this business was the purchase of an import myself in September last year through a dealer here in Sydney (Not Xtreme, but I'm not mentioning names)

When I confronted the dealer with the certificate their response to me was "We feel bad, and for that we will give you trade-price servicing on your vehicle!".

That not only outraged me but made me go as far as to spread the word that such documentation was available and take it into my own hands to assist others in this matter. If Joe does indeed come onboard and hopefully with every one of his stock, it will be a first to ensuring a fair playing field for Imports from Dealers here in Australia.

Just to be clear here, there will be two reading on the odometer certificate, one when it was deregistered in Japan and another from when it went for it's previous Shaken (bi-annual registration check). My vehicle for example, read 42,700 in 2005 and 77,300 in 2007 when it was deregistered. However it was sold to me in 2012 with 60,371 ? It was brought in by an import company in 2007 and sold to its owner then with 38,000 and the owner put in on consignment at a dealer ( who should have checked the car's genuinity before placing it on their lot) and sold it to me.

What other way do you think we can resolve this situation, BakeMonoRicer?

I'd love to hear

Edited August 21, 2013 by JapaneseOdoCheck

[R31Nismoid]

JOC - Removed the business advertising

End of the day, everyone else pays to advertise so the rules are the same for you.

Thanks.

[tweety bird]

i see what's happening here..

[GTR-N1]

Wow. Would love to hear about this, pm me if you ever have a spare moment Terry.

I do think I know of it a little though.

You Simon (and Longz) aren't far off the mark.

Two SAU Members inspected that car.

You've got a PM.

[Joe@Xtreme Motorsports]

Wow... $80 is actually really good value considering what you receive is a piece of official government-issued documentation and a fully translation version which is likely to increase the value of your car (assuming the KM's check out legit). This can only be done IN JAPAN - which means someone has to be available in Japan to request the document from the government agency. These people have to eat.

$80 on a $15,000+ investment is bloody good value.

Stupid thing to post.

RE: Joe - much respect to see that you are putting additional cars up for scrutiny and looking to fix the issue. I will have a more detailed response later.

Thanks. $80 is worthwhile on any car you purchase or look at.

Also I believe its the dealers responsibility to notify the customer if the kms arent genuine and be honest and straight forward.

Sometimes the car might have had an aftermarket speedo/cluster and has been changed back etc...or

whatever the case might be.

I have told a few customers straight up especially when the car has a Nismo cluster etc that this is the real mileage.

Thank you for your reply DodgyImports.

$80 on a $15,000+ Investment equates to less then 1%. Let me be exact here it equates to 0.0053% of the purchase price !

Please explain to me how that is indeed not good value at all?

Joe is the first dealer to jump onboard after I've had numerous customers from all around Australia in the past 3 months since I've opened up business.

What motivated me to open up this business was the purchase of an import myself in September last year through a dealer here in Sydney (Not Xtreme, but I'm not mentioning names)

When I confronted the dealer with the certificate their response to me was "We feel bad, and for that we will give you trade-price servicing on your vehicle!".

That not only outraged me but made me go as far as to spread the word that such documentation was available and take it into my own hands to assist others in this matter. If Joe does indeed come onboard and hopefully with every one of his stock, it will be a first to ensuring a fair playing field for Imports from Dealers here in Australia.

Just to be clear here, there will be two reading on the odometer certificate, one when it was deregistered in Japan and another from when it went for it's previous Shaken (bi-annual registration check). My vehicle for example, read 42,700 in 2005 and 77,300 in 2007 when it was deregistered. However it was sold to me in 2012 with 60,371 ? It was brought in by an import company in 2007 and sold to its owner then with 38,000 and the owner put in on consignment at a dealer ( who should have checked the car's genuinity before placing it on their lot) and sold it to me.

What other way do you think we can resolve this situation, BakeMonoRicer?

I'd love to hear

Thats pretty unfair from the dealer you purchased your car from especially with proof.

We will be definitely going on board with you (JOC) and hopefully we can keep all the shonky

dealers in line for a change.

[JapaneseOdoCheck]

That is good to hear Joe.

Payment Details have been sent to you and as you requested, the results will be posted up on this thread as soon as they are available.

If Payment is received by close of business today, the results will definitely be out before the weekend.

Regards,

JOC

[BakemonoRicer]

As I said, don't see the point of an odometer check now.....

Pretty easy for a hypothetical person to cover up getting caught out by simply winding all the clocks forwards to auction sheet specification. However, I really do hope it was an honest mistake that the wrong km's were listed....

But end of the day, the japaneseodocheck right now won't prove anything. It will just be up to XtremeMotorsports to prove themselves from this point forward that the cars they import have genuine km's.

Thanks. $80 is worthwhile on any car you purchase or look at.

Also I believe its the dealers responsibility to notify the customer if the kms arent genuine and be honest and straight forward.

Sometimes the car might have had an aftermarket speedo/cluster and has been changed back etc...or

whatever the case might be.

I have told a few customers straight up especially when the car has a Nismo cluster etc that this is the real mileage.

Thats pretty unfair from the dealer you purchased your car from especially with proof.

We will be definitely going on board with you (JOC) and hopefully we can keep all the shonky

dealers in line for a change.

Doesn't change the fact you imported an R grade Skyline, and advertised it as very clean....

The fact the bottom of the scrap heap comes over into the Sydney dealershipss realllyyyy shits me....the only people that are fooled are people who see a dealership are trustworthy and have no idea a dealership would sell them a car that's had accident history and/or dodgy repairs done.

Import dealerships don't seem to realise that if they actually brought over genuine, nice & tidy examples over, people who actually know what theyre looking for (quite a big market) would be happy to shop at a dealership

[Cherry Racer]

^^^^^ agree 100%

It is all well and good to have a go at someone for not doing their research but a lot of people take things on face value and believe they a safer going through a dealer.

It a real shame that issues with odometers will make it harder and harder to locate genuine vehicles in the future and potentially reduce the value of imported cars.

Edited August 21, 2013 by Cherry Racer

[AxlOz]

I can attest to JOC's service. I was keen on a 2003 v35 recently. Looked tidy when I inspected it with my layman eyes, and had ~46k kms on the dial (I knew this was not true). The JOC report showed me that the car was exported from Japan in 07/2009, and had ~98k kms on the odo at that time. So when you think about it having been over here for 4 years, it realistically has probably done at least 130~140k kms..

The car in question is still up on carsales fwiw.. Buyer beware!

[dodgyimports]

CT9A-0302640 (40519kms)

CT9A-0205391 (54803kms)

BNR32-313541 (107732kms)

CT9A-0205736 (69300kms)

CP9A-0104724 (71541kms)

These are some of the cars we have in stock at the moment.

I have checked auction sheets for all four Evo chassis #'s above and can confirm that the km's listed in brackets and where applicable on Xtreme's website are consistent with those recorded on the auction sheet. Unfortunately I could not find the auction sheet for the R32 GT-R chassis # above. I expect JOC will clear all 5 vehicles and you will all be able to see for yourself the de-reg/export papers. I am not going to post these auction sheets as I do not believe it is fair to Xtreme to have gradings debated in a public forum given there has been no mis-representation on these cars. When it comes to condition, the car is at the dealership for inspection - those interested can make their own assessment.

My suggestion on the learnings that should be taken from this thread:

1) When buying an imported car from a dealer - treat every car as "guilty until proven innocent"

2) If you have high expectations and want a low km's grade 4.5 / 5A car - be realistic, look at the auction prices: it ain't going to happen at a dealer - import it yourself

3) Don't fall under the illusion that you're going to be the special person to find a "reputable/genuine" dealer (and hence can check your brain at the door) in an industry that is riddled with this cancer - chances are slim to none you'll find one. Be a skeptic every step of the way

4) Do not assume that the law, a government department or official process is protecting you from this practice, or that it will protect you after the fact

5) Look at auction price statistics for the car you're interested in and use tools on import broker websites to calculate how much it would cost to bring it in yourself. If you can't see where the dealers profit margin is, assume there is a problem with the car. Offer the dealer a price that is below what it would have cost for you to import it - if they accept, there is definately a problem with the car

6) All dealers will tell you they don't engage in such activity and import genuine cars regardless. Whether they are aware if what they are selling is genuine is another matter

7) Ask for a de-reg/export certificate and learn how to read one (there are plenty of internet resources to help). If the dealer claims they don't have it (they do) or won't give it to you - walk away. If you're still not dissuaded and have $ to spare, use a service like JOC to get a copy BEFORE you put down a deposit. Remember, depending which document you get this may only alert you to a very large windback. If the car has done very few k's since the last recorded on the certificate - be wary

8) Get an independent mechanical inspection by someone that knows the model and preferrably has some experience in smash repairs

9) A good detailer can hide a multitude of sins (and km's). Although windbacks are easy to spot at some dealers, I assure you - trying to check km's by looking at seat bolsters, steering wheel wear etc... does not work - you will be surprised

I'm sure there are plenty on this forum wiser than me that could add to this list.

PS. One of the chassis # is for the orange evo which is indeed complied - wow looked track-only to me, don't know how this got through!?

[JH32]

This whole scenario, all these new usernames ..... just seems way too fishy for my liking.

[GTR-N1]

A bit too contrived perhaps?

Collusion?