M35 Stagea Potential Odo Tampering

[Godzilladat]

Hey Guys,

Bought a M35 Autech Axis last week. Odometer said 48000kms, purchased the car from a import dealer.

I'm aware that 90 percent of imports have had the odo wound back, and in the case of this car it seemed to match the kilometres on the dash so I wasn't to fussed at the time.

But after getting the car home and having a chance to play with the japanese dash screen and settings I stumbled across this menu item, which is incrementing and I can only assume is either the trip meter that has never been reset/used on the car OR some other form of logging the kilometres.

That and the fact the airbag light came on the 2nd time I drove it and I had to follow the steps another forum member posted on resetting it, I'm not interested in looking into these issues further.

So I have a few questions if anyone can help me;

1. Am I right in assuming that part is the trip meter? (pics below)

2. What are my rights in terms of requesting a discount on this car? I'm not to keen on a refund as I have already gone through the expense of changing the rego to my name and paying duties, swapping number plates and selling our current car. But I am open to some sort of financial fix in the way of $$$$. If it had another 20000kms I probably wouldn't bother, but the fact it has double the advertised km's I think I have something worth enquiring about.

3. Does anyone have any online URL's I can reference to do my own reading on this? Mainly looking for government regulatory links for odometer tampering and penalties.

Pics

Thanks and appreciate the help, feel free to shoot me down if I have got this wrong. Also I will be asking the importer if they have access to the import and sales documents, deregistration from japan so I can view the kilometres on that documentation.

Also, I did search the forums & read other posts, but didn't find anyone who had found the stuff I have (potentially) above.

Thanks

[Daleo]

It sure does look like an odometer; I'll take a stab & say that it is tied in to the GPS system, and wasn't something they even thought about.

I have personally seen, in a well respected Sydney compliance workshop 4 Stagea instrument binnacles sitting next to each other on a workbench.
What could be the possible reason to need 4 instrument binnacles for one type of car?

Do they fail regularly? No.

I'll leave it for you to decide.

Clocking odometers is RIFE in the industry, and even a few of the big players, who pour scorn on others for doing it; are doing it quietly in the background.

There is a member on here Japaneseodocheck (also on FB: https://www.facebook.com/japodocheck?fref=ts) Maybe you should get in touch with them with your VIN. They will also be able to advise you on your options.

It sucks when it happens, but it's not the end of the world. Hopefully they will redress the situation with you, and learn from it.

Hey look!

[Godzilladat]

Thanks Daleo! Will get in touch with those guys on facebook. So looks like I was right about that being the electronic trip meter, my brother works with dude from Japan and got him to translate as follows;

The fields on the left in order;

1. Driving time
2. Driving distance
3. Avg Spd

The buttons on the right all say reset and the message on the top says “driver information”.

Looks like these guys have a case to answer.

[M35woah]

But couldn't the dealer just argue that they didn't know and the tampering could have possibly happened in Japan?

Also being a series 2 car I believe there is only one shop that can do compliance for them?

I'd put it to them and see what they come back with.

It sure does look like an odometer; I'll take a stab & say that it is tied in to the GPS system, and wasn't something they even thought about.

I have personally seen, in a well respected Sydney compliance workshop 4 Stagea instrument binnacles sitting next to each other on a workbench.
What could be the possible reason to need 4 instrument binnacles for one type of car?

Do they fail regularly? No.

I'll leave it for you to decide.

Clocking odometers is RIFE in the industry, and even a few of the big players, who pour scorn on others for doing it; are doing it quietly in the background.

There is a member on here Japaneseodocheck (also on FB: https://www.facebook.com/japodocheck?fref=ts) Maybe you should get in touch with them with your VIN. They will also be able to advise you on your options.

It sucks when it happens, but it's not the end of the world. Hopefully they will redress the situation with you, and learn from it.

Hey look!

Yup! Learn how to reset the trip information on the navi!!

Edited December 16, 2013 by M35woah

[M35woah]

It sure does look like an odometer; I'll take a stab & say that it is tied in to the GPS system, and wasn't something they even thought about.

I have personally seen, in a well respected Sydney compliance workshop 4 Stagea instrument binnacles sitting next to each other on a workbench.

What could be the possible reason to need 4 instrument binnacles for one type of car?

Do they fail regularly? No.

I'll leave it for you to decide.

Clocking odometers is RIFE in the industry, and even a few of the big players, who pour scorn on others for doing it; are doing it quietly in the background.

There is a member on here Japaneseodocheck (also on FB: https://www.facebook.com/japodocheck?fref=ts) Maybe you should get in touch with them with your VIN. They will also be able to advise you on your options.

It sucks when it happens, but it's not the end of the world. Hopefully they will redress the situation with you, and learn from it.

Hey look!

It sure does look like an odometer; I'll take a stab & say that it is tied in to the GPS system, and wasn't something they even thought about.

I have personally seen, in a well respected Sydney compliance workshop 4 Stagea instrument binnacles sitting next to each other on a workbench.

What could be the possible reason to need 4 instrument binnacles for one type of car?

Do they fail regularly? No.

I'll leave it for you to decide.

Clocking odometers is RIFE in the industry, and even a few of the big players, who pour scorn on others for doing it; are doing it quietly in the background.

There is a member on here Japaneseodocheck (also on FB: https://www.facebook.com/japodocheck?fref=ts) Maybe you should get in touch with them with your VIN. They will also be able to advise you on your options.

It sucks when it happens, but it's not the end of the world. Hopefully they will redress the situation with you, and learn from it.

Hey look!

Heh, yup learn how to reset the trip information on the navi!

[kjb_r33]

thats not going to change the fact that he was ripped off...these bastards need to be made accountable

Heh, yup learn how to reset the trip information on the navi!

[Daleo]

But couldn't the dealer just argue that they didn't know and the tampering could have possibly happened in Japan?

Also being a series 2 car I believe there is only one shop that can do compliance for them?

I'd put it to them and see what they come back with.

Yup! Learn how to reset the trip information on the navi!!

Yeah, I thought the same thing myself; I guess Godzilladat could always offer to inform Department of Fair Trading of a possible breach of their duty of care?

Also, Godzilladat, welcome to the forum, don't let this sour you on the Stagea.

These cars are very robust, and a haircut like that isn't likely to have compromised the car at all.

I do understand that it would definitely have effected the the used car price you would have paid. That's certainly the avenue I'd be going down.

Best of luck with it, we'd love to see some pics, and maybe hear your plans (if any) for it.

I used to have a 180B SSS a couple of years ago; seems like most of the Stagea owners have a history of cool Dattos!

[M35woah]

Sigh @ my failed double post -.-

Yeah, I thought the same thing myself; I guess Godzilladat could always offer to inform Department of Fair Trading of a possible breach of their duty of care?

Also, Godzilladat, welcome to the forum, don't let this sour you on the Stagea.
These cars are very robust, and a haircut like that isn't likely to have compromised the car at all.
I do understand that it would definitely have effected the the used car price you would have paid. That's certainly the avenue I'd be going down.

Best of luck with it, we'd love to see some pics, and maybe hear your plans (if any) for it.

I used to have a 180B SSS a couple of years ago; seems like most of the Stagea owners have a history of cool Dattos!

+1 for the robustness, mine says 150k km on the clock and going strong.

[PN-Mad]

There is more than one shop that imports Series 2 cars now, but I'd be interested to see where you got it.

As Dale said, get onto the odo check, and find out what's going on. I might have been reset and could have 150k on it!

However, besides the name and shame aspect of it, there is very little you can do. Your not going to get money back or anything, unfortunately it's caveat emptor.

[Aegats]

Where did you purchase the car from?

[GoldZilla]

Where did you purchase the car from?

If you do wish to disclose this, PLEASE keep it to PMs only - it's part of the rules of being on this forum.

[Godzilladat]

Hey Guys, I have spoken to the ACCC and they were very very helpful. The dealer definitely has a case to answer for, and I have just sent an email off to them this morning starting with a friendly "please explain" style.

I'm not up for the naming or shaming, I just want to get this resolved. For anyone else in a similar situation, here are my call notes to the ACCC which should help;

Competition and consumers act - The item must be fit for the purpose that the business said it was fit for.

Product must match descriptions - It doesn't...

Misleading and false representations - illegal to make false impressions i.e. saying the car has travelled 48,000km's when it has done 94,000kms

################

Recouping costs - Compensation for costs incurred e.g. transfer of rego etc

http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/repair-replace-refund

http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/compensation-for-damages-loss

http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/misleading-claims-advertising/false-or-misleading-claims


There is a office of fair trading in each state, if the company is not willing to negotiate I just go to them and they will mediate the issue on my behalf.

##############

Will advise how it pans out.

[PN-Mad]

Did you contact the odo check person?

Just saying, just cause it says 90xxxkms doesn't mean that it hasn't done more. The dereg will show.

Also, don't let them near your car without you there. They may well just clear the trip computer....

[Dane]

Wow Man, just wow. The autech axis you bought I sat in 1 week prior to you buying, and If i didnt find HAYDN's awesome Dayz edition that week, It would be mine a week before you bought it!

TBH I kind of new they wind the clocks back....you can just tell...The condition of the car is pretty good though apart from that ripped leather on the centre console

Its the NA one with Camel interior from XX XXXX XXXXXXXXXXX out kirawee way right?

Hey at least you got Tein coilovers as a bonus!

How much did you pay for the car? It was advertised at 18400 IIRC

Edited December 17, 2013 by Dane

[Dane]

EDIT: Removed

Edited December 17, 2013 by Dane

[Dane]

If you do wish to disclose this, PLEASE keep it to PMs only - it's part of the rules of being on this forum.

Hey GoldZilla,

I kind of disclosed this above - does it matter that the OP hasnt disclosed but I may have? I dont mind if my posts need to be edited, Im just keen to know If it IS the same car I had a look at...because they offered the car quite cheap to me - maybe if paid too much he can definately get some money back!

EDIT: going to get rid of the names of the shop I think for the greater good.

Edited December 17, 2013 by Dane

[ECR33_RB25DET]

Godzilladat hope you bring the guys to justice. Shops like need to be shutdown and made to pay up. Totally support you taking it further, I'm sure Dotars will like to know as well as then they'll hopefully review every import sold by this shop.

The name and shame rules of this forum are FN weak just like the Australian Government. Bunch of girly men. There is nothing better than naming and shaming in my opinion to protect future buyers. Such $hit should be publically known not covered up.

[junkie]

Found the shop, and the car ad, even with the info above. Dodgy a-holes...

[Godzilladat]

I've been in touch with the dealer and we've agreed on an outcome. No money will exchange hands but the alternative was a long drawn out process of returning the car and potentially going through fair trading etc etc to get my out of pocket expenses back.

I honestly don't have the time to deal with that kind of mess as I'm strapped for time with a young family and business commitments anyway. So I settled for an outcome with us keeping the car, upgraded warranty & some things fixed/adjusted on the car that I wanted sorted and would have otherwise had to pay to get done.

I don't think the dealer needs to be burnt at the stake, and to be honest I don't think they themselves wound back the odometer but hopefully this gives them a little scare to prompt them to do their checks a bit better to cover themselves for future buyers asking the same questions. Again I obviously could have taken this further, but I still would have had to search for a replacement car and would still be out of pocket for stuff I couldn't claim.

Looking forward to moving on and driving the car from here (all going well). I'll still get the odometer reading from the guys on fb, but the reality is the body and interior/suspension is in good condition on this thing, a vq35de or rear diff parts aren't massively expensive if they do fail so I can live with that risk.

Appreciate the help/feedback.

[Dane]

How much did you end up paying and how much rego did she give you? TBH you still got a very nice example so enjoy the resale on those low low k's lol