50/50 Mix Of E85 And 98 Q's

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Hey guys i have been reading through the e85 thread but don't really know where to start to find my answers. Im not looking at getting flamed or smart comments, if you have info and or links that would be great.

Keeping a long story short i have been building my hr up for a few years and im planning on having it running this year. I have a limited budget this year so upgrading injectors, rail or anything like that wont be on the cards unfortunately. I have spent time researching and getting what i believe will work for me. I have recently gone through and replaced gaskets and seals, timing belt kit, n1 water pump and oil pump so its not a slap together job and she will be alright build.

Quick run through.

Unopened s2 rb25 apart from tomei pon cams and exhaust gear

Kando td06 20g with turbosmart 45mm gate

550cc side feed injectors

in tank 040 with 2l surge and 044 external

Big npc clutch, 25 box supporting mods engne and drive line yada yada

Will be tuned with an apexi power fc

For the present time the car will be used for mainly track work and the odd street drive at times. Im looking for more safe guard with the engine and i realize alot is to do with the tune, but e85 seems to give that little bit extra in protection.

I understand that going straight e85 the current injectors would be way too small, but doing a 50/50 mix would this setup be ok?

What is the best way to store and mix up even batchs with the 20l jerrys?

What sort of figures would i be looking at with the current setup?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

[Simon-S14]

just go straight e85, mixing is a pain in the butt.

[GTSBoy]

You won't benefit from doing an E42.5 setup on the standard injectors. The standard ones will run out of flow at 210-220rwkW on 98 anyway. Adding any extra fuel demand from adding ethanol will actually decrease the max power you can make on them, and 220rwkW is not exactly pushing the engine hard enough to worry about "extra protection".

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550 cc aren't standard though. Yes small but not 370cc standard.

[GTSBoy]

Ah. Missed that. Move on. Nothing to see here.

[KiwiRS4T]

I'm making 312awkw at 90% max duty with 550 injectors on 98 petrol so unless you are planning on going way over 300 you should be ok with e85

[discopotato03]

Need adequate injectors regardless , no way around that one .

How to make the easiest 50/50 you'll ever do and never screw up . Buy 3 20L fuel containers and stick 10L of each flavour in each . Pour into cars hole to whatever level you want . You want 1/3 tank add one jerry , if you need to top it up the blend doesn't change . Trying to do this pump to tank at a servo leaves lots of scope for error - silly things like watching the dollars instead of litres and once its in it's too late if you screwed up .

If pouring petrol into a car jerry style is too hard what happens when you need to change spark plugs , how hard is too hard ? If you did this once a week is it really that difficult ?

Also you can experiment with less than 50/50 and still have higher octane than pump 98 ULP .

Much of what I read from US forums is that somewhere in the 20-35% ethanol area is a sweet spot for many engines , these are not drag race engines but a variety of std OE ones where power potential is up over ULP and consumption similar .

Your call .

[WMDC35]

As people say the mixing is a hassle, you should be able to make around 300ish on e85 with those injectors which is about where the turbo should be, maybe a reg just in case

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By the sounds of it ill stick it straight on e85 and not run the injectors at 100%.

Is there any issues with the fuel sitting in the tank for a few months before its next outing? Or because its sealed up it shouldn't attract water from anywhere?

Thanks for the reply's

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

maybe try P100 (10% ethanol)..

have a read of this article:

http://www.plmsdevelopments.com/customers/chris_ceffy.shtml

quite interesting that only 10% ethanol in the blend actually makes a decent enough difference, allowing for more timing to be added.

[Blackkers]

By the sounds of it ill stick it straight on e85 and not run the injectors at 100%.

Is there any issues with the fuel sitting in the tank for a few months before its next outing? Or because its sealed up it shouldn't attract water from anywhere?

Thanks for the reply's

If you're worried maybe change the seal on the lid of your fuel tank. Or talk to scotty, he will tell you about the zero problems he has had in 6 years or so

edit: just wanted to add that disco has some pretty valid points. If you mix 30ish% of e85 and the rest 98 you will still get HEAPS of knock resistance without needing the huge amount of flow required for e85. worth looking into I'd reckon, how hard can it be mixing fuel in jerrys at the bowser?

Edited February 17, 2014 by Blackkers

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New seal is waiting to go in in as im still messing around with the fuel system in the boot and haven't put the lid back on yet. All new fuel hoses and speed flow fittings are done from the engine to the tank, all that's missing is the fuel .

[ARTZ]

just get a fuel reg and bump pressure up a bit....I believe e85 may run better at higher pressure though I am yet to see it proven

[scotty nm35]

Or get a secondary single 5000cc moran injector fitted and run it off a spare PWM output on the ecu, fed from a poly tank in the boot full of ethanol.

[ARTZ]

interesting idea but why not just use water meth if you are going to do that?

[Super Drager]

Or get a secondary single 5000cc moran injector fitted and run it off a spare PWM output on the ecu, fed from a poly tank in the boot full of ethanol.

I have heard of this done with C16 before.

[GTSBoy]

Octane on demand. Fraught with the same risk of engine damage should the aux fuel system stop working whilst everything else is still working. Best avoided if possible.

[scotty nm35]

Same could be said of the primary fuel system.

There are dangers with any power increases. I think you would soon know if the secondary failed, the backfires should make it well known, and anyone not running a wideband when leaning on it hard should probably learn the hard way...

[discopotato03]

The calcs are SO easy . Assumes 50/50 . 7L divide 20L = 0.35 or 35% or E35 . 10L of Eflex = 7L ethanol .

.................................................................8.5L ........20L ...0.42.....42% ... E42 . 10L of E85 = 8.5L ethanol .

AFAIK you can't cheaply buy straight fuel grade ethanol so getting it in E70 or E85 seems way to go .

Plus it's a real bitch being full and having 60L of home brew kicking around when the price cycle goes through the roof for a week or two ...

7Eleven 98 gets down to ~ 1.56.9L and Eflex sadly 1.22.9L , works out to 1.39.9L for 98E35 . I don't recall BP Ultimate getting below 1.60.9L last time .

I'd really like to hear from tuners who have tried 10-30% ethanol blends because it sounds like the gains are significant while the fuel system can be less extreme .

My 33 has all its factory fuel system except the GTR pump and 740 side feeds , new OE filters . When the 76R goes in it may run out of pump and if so a GTR Nismo will replace it . To get 300 wheel wasps 98 PULP probably needs a bit of help but I don't reckon it's anything like 70-85% ethanol , could well be 20% which is about 1/4 of the hassle of doing it fuel system wise with E85 .

A .