New Untubbed Class At Jambo 04

[BU5TER]

So by the looks of it if we want to be acknowledged with our input we have to email Jason, if anyone has any more input please post it and I will email Jason with our concerns about being alienated from it

Jason sorry if it seemed like I/we were chewing you out as you posted on Ausrotary, but I am passionate about my drag racing and am in the final process of building a high powered drag GTST that I think would eventually slot nicely into this bracket one day but not with the sized slicks you've listed as a maximum size, I'll be lucky to have traction with a 26x10 which is what i'll be using and I think this would be the same for any other big Supras, Vl's etc etc

admitted you do quote this as a trial class several times but honestly what makes you think you'll see any interest from other non rotary cars like skylines, supras when with the min wieghts and max tyre size puts them out of the race even before it starts and once the class is finalised I bet you'll say well there was no interest or emails to me from anyone else so there's no reason to change the rules when the rules were the reason why there was no interest to begin with, why start with rules that alienate us to begin with? when the rules could be made to include us at a competitive level to begin with?

Its easy to say don't fear them beat them but how is this meant to happen when the rules have been made up for them, is it that they are scared if the rules were fair they might get beat?

My other concern is with a class like this aimed at those lighter very old cars is honestly how many more years will they still be as abundantly available to build up as drag cars, time is working against them and with this in mind as the modern import becomes more common and cheaper to buy for the average person to build up as a drag car the tides will turn and we will be the future of sports compact racing so shouldn't the future be thought of and the rules be made according

Jason please don't take this the wrong way, I think what you've done in a short period of time for sports compact racers is amazing and don't mean any disrespect to you in any way or form, thank you for taking the time to inform us and keep us posted

Brett

[MrBlonde]

Jason,

Good work so far. Open your eyes and read what's being said. Brett and Adrian have hit the nail on the head. If you want Sport Compact to be about late model performance cars that spectators can recognise as a lot like the cars they see on the street, then making the new class rotary biased (via low low weight breaks and narrow slick size limits) isn't going to get there.

26"x10" is a much better size for slicks. 1970s rotaries may slot nicely in to the 2600 lb range with cage and driver, but not many late model cars do.

How about setting up a new class for 6 cylinder late model cars with IRS?

I love rotaries and I like seeing some action in sport compact. Wouldn't it be a shame if the Skyline, Supra, VL turbo and other 6 cylinder late model cars weren't a part of this new movement?

[2rismo]

This is a TRIAL CLASS and it will only become a reality if there are enough cars competing. I was chewed out by a few dudes on Skylinesaustralia.com for making this class to biased towards the rotors!!!!!!!

Why don't those of you who can't make the Jambo with your cars, hop onto a few of the applicable RWD website forums and put a rocket up a few people.....

I think I see the problem, Jason. The thing that will determine the success of this class in MY mind is not whether ENOUGH cars are competing, but whether enough DIFFERENT types of cars are competing.

And on a side note, skylinesaustralia.com welcomes any new forum members you hope to refer. Maybe once they leave the rotary ONLY world they post in, they'll see another point of view. A point of view that believes that a TRIAL CLASS should start off, not by excluding as many popular types of cars as possible and working backwards, but by including as MANY UNTUBBED CARS AS POSSIBLE and deciding what fits and what doesn't.

I just don't know why you think that it's better your way. Don't you think that the Supra, VL, Skyline communities will be more than a little slapped in the face by class rules that leave out their primary size slick tyre?

It's one thing to say, "I want Skylines/ Supra's etc in this class and the rules that have been formulated have been done so to attract a majority of players not a boutique few like the rotor boys", but i'm afraid it reads like bullshit !!

The weight thing is neither here nor there for now as I don't think you know enough about the cars you claim to want to attract to use this as a restriction, (Skylines & Supras). The slick size is another big indicator of this point making it the least researched new class I have seen for a long while. But why, with all of the southern states' running massively fast VL's, have you not looked further than your mates Ray Box and Rob @ Ausrotary for the tyre size rules?

Sorry mate, but this just can't be ignored. I have also emailed this to you so you can forget the, "I have had not one email from any member of Skylinesaustralia.com.au regarding Sport Compact drag racing!!!" schtick.

I appreciate the effort required in getting Sport Compact racing in Australia off the ground and so far, so good. OzMod however will be doomed to failure if your focus remains on quantity of entrants over quality.

Adrian Hodgson

Wollongong, NSW

[2rismo]

As a matter of fact I haven't sent this to your email, Jason.

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From: "Adrian" <[email protected]>

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Subject: Oz-Mod issues and suggestions

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[tomj]

I think I see the problem, Jason.  The thing that will determine the success of this class in MY mind is not whether ENOUGH cars are competing, but whether enough DIFFERENT types of cars are competing.

And on a side note, skylinesaustralia.com welcomes any new forum members you hope to refer.  Maybe once they leave the rotary ONLY world they post in, they'll see another point of view.  A point of view that believes that a TRIAL CLASS should start off, not by excluding as many popular types of cars as possible and working backwards, but by including as MANY UNTUBBED CARS AS POSSIBLE and deciding what fits and what doesn't.

I just don't know why you think that it's better your way.  Don't you think that the Supra, VL, Skyline communities will be more than a little slapped in the face by class rules that leave out their primary size slick tyre?

It's one thing to say, "I want Skylines/ Supra's etc in this class and the rules that have been formulated have been done so to attract a majority of players not a boutique few like the rotor boys", but i'm afraid it reads like bullshit !!

The weight thing is neither here nor there for now as I don't think you know enough about the cars you claim to want to attract to use this as a restriction, (Skylines & Supras).  The slick size is another big indicator of this point making it the least researched new class I have seen for a long while.  But why, with all of the southern states' running massively fast VL's, have you not looked further than your mates Ray Box and Rob @ Ausrotary for the tyre size rules?

Sorry mate, but this just can't be ignored.  I have also emailed this to you so you can forget the, "I have had not one email from any member of Skylinesaustralia.com.au regarding Sport Compact drag racing!!!" schtick.

I appreciate the effort required in getting Sport Compact racing in Australia off the ground and so far, so good.  OzMod however will be doomed to failure if your focus remains on quantity of entrants over quality.

Adrian Hodgson

Wollongong, NSW

Jason,

Adrian along with a few other mates just had an approximately one hour discussion about your new proposed class.

I dont think there was anyone who diasgreed at all with anyone of Adrians points, and from the brief look Ive just had im very sure i would have agreed with his points regardless of the discussion we had or not.

It does really smack of a rotor biased class, regardless whether you wanted it to be like that or not. It is a very good idea besides a few niggly points, which im sure you are willing to listen to a wide range of ppl and get some real consensus.

Id really like to sign to the antilag.com forums ( www.antilag.com/forums ) we are only 6 months old, so we arnt quite as big as SAU yet, but we have a large majority of perth based ppl who are interested in drag. Simply copy and paste what you wrote here and im sure you will get a reply from a lot of people over here.

Thankyou for your time and ill write something more significant soon

Tom Jakovljevic

Antilag.com contributor

Perth , WA

[2rismo]

And while we're at it, lets just have a quick look at the confirmed entries for Jamboree in the Oz Mod class:

1. Rob (project_x) 13BTT 323

2. Frank (etstreet aka MRHELI) 13BT 1200 ute

3. Daniel (PRO20B) 20BT rx4

4. Craig (RX3ROTOR) 20BT rx3

5. Marty (AVENGE) 13BT rx4

6. Tim (BUSHPIG) 13BT Contina

7. Damien (Grump2) 13BT rx2

8. Bryce (13BEE) 13BT rx3

9. Michael (CRZYFJ) FJ20T Gemini

10. Elia (HEKTYK) 13BT rx3

11. Kevin (AWADSN) 20BT rx4

12. Rodney (WKD13B) 13BT rx3

13. Benny (PNK13B) 13BT rx3

14. Jon (RXENG aka DRAGME) 13BT rx3

15. Peter (RICE RACING) ???

16. Angus (A777) 13BT rx7

17. Daniel (12ENV) 13BT rx3

18. Jason Both 13BT rx7

19. Dale (10sec_rx7) 13BT rx7

20. Pat (citta) 13BT rx3

21. Nassar (DRAGIT) 13BT rx3

22. Dean (RUN10Z) 13BT rx3

23. Rodney (7 SINS aka spankme_rotor) 13BT rx7

24. HYP13T 13BT ute

22, possibly 23 of the 24 confrimed entrants so far are rotors. Suspicions confirmed.

Rotary class.

Adrian

[2rismo]

Good discussion. I won't get involved as I want to watch you debate this amongst yourselves. Please private message me a copy of what you do as I'd like to submit it on behalf of your forum.  

Keep up the good work! This is your sport, so get involved and make a difference.  

Jason O'Halloran  

ANDRA Sport Compact Director

So you'll accept ausrotary.com forum input but not ours? Thanks very much.

What about:

Tyre size limited to 26x10 in 26 inch height tyre, and 28x9 for 28 inch height tyres?

Adrian

[NA_R33]

Jason, if i do end up keeping my car will i be permitted to race in some sort of Bracket racing at jamboree??

[Racin Jason]

I write a monthly article for drags.com, and this month I have written one about the passion within our sport. After getting back from the weekend and reading what you guys have written....I see passion. And I must respond!

The deal with this new class was started from an email from an Ausrotary.com member...it was an idea....but it has since grown. I approached the Jambo promoter Ray Box with the idea, and the wheels started moving. It all culminated with 3 Ausrotary.com members scheduling a meeting with me in Sydney to discuss and put forward their proposal. They were organised, disciplined and good communicators.

After a few months we had our rules, and a press release was issued. Then you guys came along!!! I posted the idea on your forum, to get you involved with this new and exciting class. What I got back was a pretty big slap in the chops! Then I went away and thought about it. This was no insult (although it was pretty damn close 2rismo!) it was passion in it's rawest form....it was racers who wanted to be apart of the show.....I had to act.

So going on the bench mark set by the Ausrotary.com guys....who were organised and disciplined........I guess I should expect the same from you guys too! If you want to be involved then do some reasearch within the forum, or better still ask the Ausrotary.com guys what they did to get this class off the ground!

I must say if 2rismo had the time to check out their site and copy that list......why didn't he ask them how they got the whole thing started? I have been a passanger in this whole thing......a passanger responding to my racers needs.....what's yours? because I know what the Ausrotary.com guys need.

As for my email.......damn broadband junk is up shyte creek again and I should be back on line in a few hours....so please send you correspondance to me personally.

Skylines etc are what you guys use to express your selfs with.....and my job is to accomodate that...like I have with the rotary guys.....You have a very passionate member in the shape of 2rismo....why not get him to be your point man on all of this?...collate the data, organise the rules and document the whole lot down and present a tangible class that may be trialled at an event to gauge your style of racing....what about it 2rismo, you have thrown a few stones in the last few weeks....time to step up and take a bigger role!

Thanks for the passion....it keeps me inspired.

Jason O'Halloran

ANDRA Sport Compact Director

[project_x]

Hi guys

didnt realised we rocked your boat so much....

what are the main concerns

where do you guys see where this class is aimed to and how(specificly)

from where a couple of fellow racers and i stand the gap between sport mod and sport rwd was where our cars stood so we got of our asses and did something about it...

for a skyline in this class you will have to go to jenny craig cause 3100lb is fat...

it is not specificly aimed at full street cars but they are welcome to race if they like..

it is more for a SERIOUS RACER who wants to lighten the car, fit a huge f#@k off turbo and doesnt care if its laggy run 4 bottles of nos(fast and furious style :headspin: ) its more a race orientated class and is not rota biased ..(eg croydon 200sx with 8.7)

the vl turbo issue is a subject that i support but understand it is difficult to bring in as once you let them in so come the uc toranas as well but they are a jap engine so that may be the argument..

as far as tyre size is concered the 28x9 is a starting point and they work better than a 26x10any bigger and you may as well run in sport mod as that class is more suited to larger tyre cars..most of our OLD cars need mods to fit these tyres skylines dont seem to have a prob..the fastest untubbed rotor car runs a 8.5 with a 28x9 tire now the fastest skyline i think runs a 9.4 , the subzero supra runs a 9.2 th vls from vic run mid 8s (dont know if they are tech inspected but)

i have a mate who is doing the tunning work on a 200sx with rb30 with a 25 head set to make 800hp who is specificly designing the car to run in this class so i dont think it is to rota biased...it may not suit a street skyline but you just have to put your mind to it.....

in reality how many rwd skylines are tech inspected atm and running into the nines that would be elligible to run....?????

all we are doing is drawing a line in the sand to say this is what we going to do but feel free to add to the discussion if you are viewing it as we can only improve

at the end of the day we welcome all and will listen to what you have to say...

because if you dont speak up how do you know what is wrong

my 2c

cheers

rob

oz mod racer

[project_x]

So you'll accept ausrotary.com forum input but not ours?  Thanks very much.

What about:

Tyre size limited to 26x10 in 26 inch height tyre, and 28x9 for 28 inch height tyres?

Adrian

26 x10 was also on the cards aswel but we opted to the 28 as they are a better tire and its simple

26 x10 are not out of the question

the weight breaks may get tweaked as well but this jamboree is to see how things go

my own car runs a 13bt and weighs in at 2365lb with me in it it has 450 rwhp and runs a 9.5 @142mph on a 26 x8.5

cheers

rob

[tomj]

The list for Jamboree says alot doesnt it though?

The class may be for people who want to go pretty hardcore, but why not allow them to use all thier capabilty with 10 inch slicks?

The weight issue is fixable too.

[2rismo]

OK.

A couple of replies that I am very very happy with. I think perhaps we got off on the wrong foot, Jason. When I innitially emailed you to check out our forum some months ago, I was very pleased to see you show a genuine interest in keeping us in the loop. You seemed keen to discuss with the 7000 odd members of skylinesaustralia.com, the changes and developments in Australian Championship Drag Racing and I thank you for this.

Now that we're (I'm) past the fact that you don't intend to leave us out and I have an appreciation for what the Oz Mod class is designed to do, I am keener than ever to talk to you about our ideas and how we fit into Sport Compact racing in Australia.

I know as well as anyone here that it isn't the every day, slow cars that bring in the crowds and you get more of a crowd at a venue like WSID for Nitrochamps etc than for a street meet, but the majority of people on this forum are just that - the crowd. Encouraging seriously fast Skylines into a class like Oz Mod is commendable but it really is a case, in my opinion, that the REALLY fast Skylines will either:

1/ Not race in this class due to the fact that we drive tubby lard-balls

or

2/ Not race in this class due to the tyre size issue.

Now, I love racing my car and as it's not one of the fastest *cough far from it cough*, I will probably be a spectator for Oz Mod racing. But I think you've hit on an excellent couple of points and the ausrotary.com guys have led by example. Once we've organised what "we the otherwise spectators with slower cars" would need to fit into Sport Compact racing in Aus, can I arrange to sit down with you and go through some stuff relating to or leading to a proper street tyre class?

You don't know how keen the vast majority of people who are interested in drag racing on this site are for a street tyre class to be incorporated into your portfolio as ANDRA Sport Compact Director. It is the source of MUCH discussion amongst club and forum members and comes up in conversation on EVERY cruise and EVERY street meet.

How about it Jason? Lets organise a time frame, get submissions from various sections of the street car community and sit down and talk about it. I'm buzzing with the prospect of actually helping develop a class like this in Australia as opposed to waiting for the states to do it and copying their formats.

Best of luck with this new class at Jambo. It sure looks like it will be well populated if not immediately with the cars i'd pay to watch.

Can't wait to hear from you.

Adrian

[project_x]

OK.

A couple of replies that I am very very happy with.  I think perhaps we got off on the wrong foot, Jason.  When I innitially emailed you to check out our forum some months ago, I was very pleased to see you show a genuine interest in keeping us in the loop.  You seemed keen to discuss with the 7000 odd members of skylinesaustralia.com, the changes and developments in Australian Championship Drag Racing and I thank you for this.

Now that we're (I'm) past the fact that you don't intend to leave us out and I have an appreciation for what the Oz Mod class is designed to do, I am keener than ever to talk to you about our ideas and how we fit into Sport Compact racing in Australia.

I know as well as anyone here that it isn't the every day, slow cars that bring in the crowds and you get more of a crowd at a venue like WSID for Nitrochamps etc than for a street meet, but the majority of people on this forum are just that - the crowd.  Encouraging seriously fast Skylines into a class like Oz Mod is commendable but it really is a case, in my opinion, that the REALLY fast Skylines will either:

1/ Not race in this class due to the fact that we drive tubby lard-balls

or

2/ Not race in this class due to the tyre size issue.

Now, I love racing my car and as it's not one of the fastest *cough far from it cough*, I will probably be a spectator for Oz Mod racing.  But I think you've hit on an excellent couple of points and the ausrotary.com guys have led by example.  Once we've organised what "we the otherwise spectators with slower cars" would need to fit into Sport Compact racing in Aus, can I arrange to sit down with you and go through some stuff relating to or leading to a proper street tyre class?

You don't know how keen the vast majority of people who are interested in drag racing on this site are for a street tyre class to be incorporated into your portfolio as ANDRA Sport Compact Director.  It is the source of MUCH discussion amongst club and forum members and comes up in conversation on EVERY cruise and EVERY street meet.

How about it Jason?  Lets organise a time frame, get submissions from various sections of the street car community and sit down and talk about it.  I'm buzzing with the prospect of actually helping develop a class like this in Australia as opposed to waiting for the states to do it and copying their formats.

Best of luck with this new class at Jambo.  It sure looks like it will be well populated if not immediately with the cars i'd pay to watch.

Can't wait to hear from you.

Adrian

2rismo...

mate if you need any help with what your doing just ask...jason is a breath of fresh air as far as im concered because dealing with andra in the past has been a very difficult task... I have been racing for ove 10 years and havin to put up with pricks that dont recognise that your car is arace car and not a shopping trolley, to be desriminated against cause your not a v8 and to be told to take your shitbox home.........

look what we have now, we must thank tony thornton and crew for acually doing something about it and starting sport compact.... this type of racing is for us

The direction we are goin with this class may not be the same as the cars that you have but,, i realy belive that it wont be a rotary dominated class for too long as it will just take someone to have enough balls to pilot something with 1000hp rb30 or 2jz in a smaller aero type car and i think you will see seven second cars in this class :aroused:

the tire size issue is one that we will bring up and personally im happy to include the 26x10 but i cant make that decision

with weight breaks some people want to see them lifted but what we will do is weigh every eligible car at jambo an work out where to go from there.( dont worry about weight just use more nos) I just added a new liquid to air intercooler which will add over 100lb but it will allow me to make another 200hp :headspin: :headspin:

if anyone is intrested or you know someone who may fit this class point them in our direction as we welcome all.

Robert Iacono

oz mod racer

what are you guys chasing, can you run in sport rwd

[project_x]

The list for Jamboree says alot doesnt it though?

The class may be for people who want to go pretty hardcore, but why not allow them to use all thier capabilty with 10 inch slicks?  

The weight issue is fixable too.

26 x10 s are on the cards but for the moment we are just going to pull the string and see how it goes

what does a street skyline weigh and what does a race modded one weigh?

what about r32 and r31 skylines

[2rismo]

what does a street skyline weigh and what does a race modded one weigh?

R33's are 3100lb or thereabouts... I guess you could strip out 200lb if you REALLY tried which still means they're a LOT of car.

Stripping the interior etc?? Really dunno. But i'm already looking into it.

Rob, I'll be emailing you tonight or tomorrow to start to pick your brains. Thanks again.

Adrian

[2rismo]

Here's what it says on the ANDRA website:

Four/Six and Rotary Vehicles

The benefits of a new bracket, catering for vehicles using four or six cylinder, or rotary engines, with various forms of supercharging and electronics based engine controls will be considered. Expressions of interest and general input will be invited through relevant print media, and the ANDRA Online website at www.andra.com.au.

What a great idea I think I will.

I have posted a thread in the Drag section on this forum, and am in the process of posting on a number of others asking for suggestions, thoughts, ideas, criticisms etc on a new RWD STREET TYRE class. One of the biggest bones of contention will be the debate as to what constitutes a "Street Tyre".

Feel free to weigh into this argument boys and girls Let me know what you think, if you'd support a class like this by racing/attending, what kinds of cars should be eligible to compete, whether i'm wasting my time or not?!?!?

Basically, I feel there is a huge demand for a TRUE street car class with records being kept and support from the wider drag racing community including ANDRA who are keen to grow Sport Compact Racing as demonstrated above.

Who's with me?

Adrian

[BU5TER]

If you want street tyre records go to http://www.hpi.com.au/drag_records.php and whats wrong with SPORT RWD as the tyre used in that class has to be DOT rated which at the end of the day opens the door to non radial tyres but as shown in other threads no matter what we say they are legal, maybe at best they could seperate the RWD and AWD in having SPORT RWD and SPORT AWD

Full rules for sports mod racing are here http://www.andra.com.au/technical/drafts/S...actRulebook.pdf have a look at section 3.3 SPORTS RWD and I think its pretty well what your asking for other then the fact of AWD and RWD are together

Brett

[project_x]

I think the brainchild of an Ausrotary moderator sums it up.

This class will be good for rotor vs. rotor which is all well and good.

In all honesty I think there needs to be a class for RWD  cars with one power adder running on 'street tyres'

Would be very competitive with skylines, VL's, 200sx's, Supras.

I have always wondered what kind of times the VL's would run with Nitto's, etc.

Evan

I aint no moderator firstly

I aint no riced up fool

I AM A RACER NOT A RICER :flamed:

the oz mod class is the BRAINCHILD of racers involved in the class with real race cars that go to real race meetings and race other real cars.

after contacting andra and putting the idea to the current untubbed racers ,after having a civilized meeting jason, ray box aggreed to run it as a trial as he was already running a untbbed class....

im on this forum to HELP get something done, as it just isnt a skyline class or a rotary class for that matter......

rob

OZ MOD RACER