Gt3076R Antics , Better Late Than Never .

[discopotato03]

After 4 1/2 years of living in a carton the GT3076R 52T is finally in place .

The eternally SAu addicted know it's been a long time and it's the second stage of dryer from standard , first was a HKS GTRS .

It was a typical install using a 16mm T3 spacer from Hypergear and Scotty's fabricated aluminium induction pipe , one piece front pipe made of 3 1/2" stainless with a gusset added for the IW gates outlet - nice DP XR6T flange from Best Mufflers at Carlton . Oil and water plumbing carried over from the GTRS kit .

My lump is now a 130 something K old 33 25DET and had a bit of headwork inc OS exhaust valves and 256 Tomeis , decked and said to be around 9.2-9.3 static CR . 740 Nismos and a 33 GTR pump do the fueling . Belt and water pump changed at 91 K from memory - blue coils too .

First impressions are yes it does feel better off boost which isn't surprising after a GT28 based hot side turbocharger . I'm not going pay out on that GTRS because they are a good mild turbo and easily better than the standard one - and they are an easy install which was HKSs intention . On E70 it got a better than responsive 271 RWKW though the ethanol pushed the timing and power beyond where it had any right to be . Probably a 240+ PULP turbo .

It's early days with the GT30 and it's easy to feel disappointed initially with a larger turbo but I have been here before back in the FJ20 days . Tuning needs to be looked at and invariably things that weren't a restriction for a 2871R may be with a 3076R .

My experience is that a 52T GT3076R doesn't boost as early as a GTRS so I'm not sure why some claimed them to be similar , fair bit bigger turbine in a significantly larger (0.82) turbine housing .

Now the only real squirt I've given this thing made the engine come alive I think ~ 3800-4000+ which as said was a little disappointing but again not properly tuned and I can only tune at sane speeds and up to a little over the boost threshold without a dyno .

Currently I'm running a splash blended 98E35 brew and it would have less alky if I could get a decent idle with 740s , next mod should be EV14s in a Neo 25T rail because I want the standard look . Someone else here modified a Neo rails mounting brackets to clamp down on an R33 spec inlet manifold so fingers crossed reasonably straightforward .

I'm not sure which capacity EV14s to buy though 740s should cope easily - Guilt Toy ran out of fuel at I think 360 odd RWKWs on his RB30 using Nismo 740s . Shory EV14s aren't available in as many sizes as the mid length ones and those I know of are Xspurt 740s and ID 850 GMs . Based on Guilt Toys findings 850 should romp 320 in .

Lag wise only time will tell if it suit my needs and there are a few ways to "help" this if it doesn't . Another member I was speaking to last night wonders about the the typical 0.82 vs 0.63 housings on these turbos and Mr Mafias results were good . Some like the 82 and others the 63 , the $64 question more recently is how the new "baby" GT30 - GTX3067R goes real world . If the 67R didn't reach the top end goal you wanted it should be pretty potent everywhere else .

That aside I want to have a positive outlook on what I have and give it the chance to be what I like . I know we've had plenty of GT3076R threads over the years but one more can't hurt .

A .

[Lithium]

I don't know who implied the GTRS and GT3076R would spool similar, no way that's going to happen.... Though probably due in part to unfair expectations from an undersized turbo for the engine.

Most of the other stuff you say sounds more or less as I would expect, maybe slightly lazier but maybe fiddling with preload, boost control and tune it might feel more lively. Good luck getting it all cranking better, will be interesting to see how you go. In regards to Mafias result, yeah it went well with the 0.63 with battles to fight knock... If you are having to go to lengths to fight knock where others with similar core engines aren't then you are seeing a symptom of a system not working that happily, and the ethanol is a band aid.. Though I guess strictly speaking not a huge sin.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

[discopotato03]

Pics up in the other thread now . Note the last one of the FP RED HTA in the TD06 style FAP compressor housing .

A .

[ARTZ]

which other thread...

I have set of 750cc ev14s with rail and reg here if you want em disco, fits under stock plenum and all

see link below...

[wolverine]

I don't know who implied the GTRS and GT3076R would spool similar, no way that's going to happen....

From memory Checkbuzz reckoned the GT3076 was as responsive as the GT-RS. If the GT-RS was setup correctly there was no chance unless he was just overlaying dyno printouts and somehow extrapolating things???

On the road the GT-RS is a way more responsive turbo but runs out of legs sooner exactly as you would expect.

[Dale FZ1]

It's a bit hard to think a bloke would seize on a comment from one person that is in stark contrast to loads of comments from others, and accept that as being valid/reliable.

Yes, you really need to get the thing fuelled correctly and ignition timing optimised for a deeper/easier breathing engine. Then you will know how it really goes.

Andrew and Lithium are on the money. Expect it to come on a little later and more progressively than the GTRS. Expect you will have to change down gears a little more frequently. Expect it will pull a lot harder for a lot longer.

It should make full boost - assuming 17-20psi range is the target - between 3800-4200 depending on how optimised the physical install is (no big lips or ledges) and how your particular engine responds to fuel/ignition changes.

You're on a well worn path so the experiences should largely be the same. Slightly smaller compressor inducer won't make any appreciable difference to spool (slight at best) but if you were chasing max outputs it would fall slightly short of the more common 56T. It'll be a damn good match but as with every setup will involve acceptance of what it does and the compromises that entails.

Once it's setup I reckon you should meet up with Wolverine and try a simple back-to-back with his 33 and give us some decent feedback on any contrasts between the two.

[Lithium]

It should make full boost - assuming 17-20psi range is the target - between 3800-4200 depending on how optimised the physical install is (no big lips or ledges) and how your particular engine responds to fuel/ignition changes.

You're on a well worn path so the experiences should largely be the same. Slightly smaller compressor inducer won't make any appreciable difference to spool (slight at best) but if you were chasing max outputs it would fall slightly short of the more common 56T. It'll be a damn good match but as with every setup will involve acceptance of what it does and the compromises that entails.

Once it's setup I reckon you should meet up with Wolverine and try a simple back-to-back with his 33 and give us some decent feedback on any contrasts between the two.

Agreed, I am guessing because of the well worn path thing most people who had setups which worked well and are fairly analytical and objective about it all should find similar results.

One thing I don't fully agree with, changing compressor inducer definitely makes a noticeable difference to spool - often it can be more noticeable than increasing the exducer size... funnily enough. This is one of the reasons I felt really good about the HTA3076 (which is also a 52-trim, and would be really interesting to get involved in any GT30 comparison session if one were to be done). The Mitsubishi 16G, 18G and 20G compressors are run 68mm exducers but with 48, 50, and 52mm inducers respectively and offer quite different driving experiences.

[discopotato03]

I know what a TD05HR-16G6 drives like on a 4G63T but the dynamic of that engine is totally different to an RB25 . It's well know that a 20g compressor turns those turbos into a laggy dog , very easy conversion for a lack lustre result .

I have a second series TiAL/Magnesium Evo 9 turbo that may one day go on the Evo if I keep it long enough . Same size wheels in lighter materials with updated housings that will make enough power and be more responsive than a 6 GSR turbo .

Always controversy with GT30 based BB turbos , they have their place but get the cold side wrong the well worn path is 4-7000+ rev power potential .

The 52T 3037 may not be a game changer but anything that gets that turbine off it's arse without a smaller turbine housing is worth having IMO .

I can feel it plain as day that this turbo wants to spin up but the issue is the transition from spinning to meaningful boosting , it's the gap between positive manifold pressure and the power surge that appears to be wide atm .

[AngryRB]

Not sure the OS exhaust valves and tomei cams will be helping much at this level, probably would of boosted early without that, if

are after the GTRS comparison the 0.63 would surely be the choice unless your spending a lot of time over 6000rpm, getting caught up in trying to make a GT30 boost early is a loosing game, even with a TS manifold I saw Zero effects in boost reduction, it just

is what it is, I think you have to live with it being a 4-7k turbo or try to increase the pressure with small housings or diameter

runners on the manifold, the 2.5L just doesn't pump that well before 4k with a GT30.

Edited March 9, 2014 by AngryRB

[Lithium]

I've said it before - if more response than a .82a/r GT3076R is wanted, more so than the 50+lb/min airflow these compressors can offer - then I feel that both the compressor AND turbine should be stepped down in size, on an RB25 I feel that the .63a/r turbine housing has no place with a 50+lb/min compressor.

In saying that, I guess there IS a way around what I don't like with it but thinking about what I've read this kind of thing may suit DP. - Mr Disco, what boost control are you using with the Link? And what actuator are you using with the GT3076R? Don't let this get out, but I could concede that the .63a/r housing is usable if you deliberately bleed back boost to anticipate and avoid the nasty tipping of IMEP. You want a torque beast, you could give it 20+psi by 4000rpm and bleed it back to 1bar in the higher rpm giving a flat wall of torque. The .63 will bring alive that slightly doughier 0-6psi that the .82 has though I found that after about 6psi has been picked up the .82a/r was about the same.

As I've also mentioned I think a .63 GTX3067R would probably not be a bad thing for the likes of Discopotato, hard to say for sure because we've not seen results - but I do have that hunch... I definitely think it'd be much healthier than a run of the mill GT-RS, it may not even make that much more power, but it'd be a much better suit to the engine IMHO.

[KiwiRS4T]

I wanted a .86 on my GT35/40 but was talked into a .63 and it does the job of getting my heavy Stagea moving - makes useful boost/power by 3500 although maximum is less than it could be:

[discopotato03]

Chuckles , no not touching that turbo/housing ATM because there are other things to look into .

The actuator is a large can 1 bar Garrett one and the preload was set by GCG . Boost control is I think a Mac valve run by the "V66" plug in . I wouldn't have thought with that housing the valve would be blown open but more on that in a minute .

I did a bit of fine tuning yesterday because I went back to E35 and changing the fuel trim only gets you in the ballpark . It's a juggle of getting acceptable idle pulse widths and mixture control at idle with these Denso side feeds - more eth means better control . I digress .....

I fill to the neck to do my consumption calcs and ATM it's doing better than any previous memory so at round town loads/revs its exhaling more easily . Don't be shocked people because I'm probably the only Skypilot without an aftermarket boost gauge , std one tells me the important stuff and is backed up by the lap top when online . So , it tells me that up to atmo manifold pressure not that much has changed with the turbo and it can be coaxed into positive briefly at open throttle high gear low revs . Under medium acceleration loads manifold pressure goes positive particularly on gentle rising grades . Just once I heard the faintest little whistle with the boot at ~ 3500 revs .

Now , I'm beginning to think this turbo is trying but something is getting in the way of it spooling freely in the 3000+ range and my exhaust could be part of that . It's a Japanese aftermarket one and very probably a HKS one because my car was imported with RS HKS dampers and rebranded Rays LMGT4 wheels . Previous experience with Jap aftermarket Evo exhausts is that they use smaller diameter tube where it can't be seen and fat stuff out the back . Mine isn't like that but the rear muffler has two tubes through its guts that half underlap the cans rear hole if you get my meaning . There's a pic of it in the other GT30 fitting hardware thread . If something in the pipe is restricting turbo response won't be famous and maybe liveable with a GT28 hot side questionable with a 0.82 GT30 one .

And the cold side . People here may be able to tell me where you hit the wall with the std air box and snorkel . It still has the Z32 leading to Scottys 80mm induction pipe and a silicon step up to the comp housings 100mm boss . The box has a washable panel filter I got off Fabre Midel and SK said they were better than K&N . It was cleaned a while back and will be today or tomorrow . In an old thread here at SAu someone else found the std box to run out of flow somewhere in the 320+ RWKW range which I wouldn't have ATM .

Anyway I reckon exhaust could be the place to start and I even considered 3.5 inch but not certain it could be made quiet enough . I noticed UAS do a 3" 33 GTR exhaust that's based on standard muffler positioning and style , twin outlets instead of the 5-6" OD dick extension Japs brands like to use .

On the inlet side a 33 GTR box may fit with a bit of stuffing around into the suction pipe .

I don't want to think too far ahead with other turbos yet , yes the 0.63 AR GTX3067R should boost sooner than any 3076R and is probably be a better upgrade from a GTRS if you wanted shove from say 2800-3000 revs - guesses 2835 Pros Style .
If I hadn't had the 52T already I would have thought harder about the 67R . TBH a number got in the way and 300 RWKW was my aiming point where realistically an efficient responsive 280+ would surely adequate - for me anyway .

Anyway opinions about exhausts and inlet systems I'd like to hear inc cats .

Thanks all , cheers A .

[KiwiRS4T]

Using a Venom 100cell 5in cat.

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

Using a Venom 100 cell 5" inch body cat also, hasn't dislodged itself like another brand I've used before in a previous fridge.

[34GeeTeeTee]

Using a Venom 100 cell 5" cat.

[GTScotT]

I have an 80mm tanabe exhaust in mint condition for a 33 under the house. No step downs or flow restrictions, and no drone. No penile extension tips, either. Its a nice rounded tip on a fat stainless oval muffler. Its all stainless actually.

Let me know if you wish to take a look and perhaps make an offer on this item.

Edited March 10, 2014 by GTScotT

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

I have an 80mm tanabe exhaust in mint condition for a 33 under the house. No step downs or flow restrictions, and no drone. No penile extension tips, either. Its a nice rounded tip on a fat stainless oval muffler. Its all stainless actually.

Let me know if you wish to take a look and perhaps make an offer on this item.

clear ya inbox already! I want to buy your front springs only lol

[GTScotT]

clear ya inbox already! I want to buy your front springs only lol

LOL WHOOPS.

Now resolved.

[scotty nm35]

My latest graph, externally gated GTX3076 with a .82 Tial copy rear. I realise the Ecvvt on the VQ25det probably brings it on a little earlier than the equivalent RB, but there wouldn't be much in it... You can see in the graph the ramp differences, due to the electronic throttle and auto, Trent was having issues giving it full throttle due to the auto kicking down. If I can get a GTX3076 ramping like that, you should be able to get close to similar results...

Disco, I have seen 500kw through a cotton panel filter, if there is a restriction it's in the snorkle, not the airbox.

[discopotato03]

Thanks for that Scott , I sort of wondered if Neo differences had much say but probably not a lot in this case .

I was hoping to get some exhaust feedback like best flow with least noise . From searching it seems quiet exhausts have custom (largest can area for the space) straight through mufflers mid and rear and aftermarket race type cats . I wonder if I continued back in 3.5" for the cat and mid muffler and kept the rear 3" it could work alright .

I don't have a lot of faith in my rear muffler and not sure what the offset centre mid Nismo muffler is like either .

And Cats , I suppose any aftermarket one isn't cop proof so is there any OE one out there from a big capacity car/truck that looks OE ?

A .