Brembo Brakes Squealing....again...

[Deza3000]

Hey guys, made a similar post around 1 year ago regarding my squealing brakes. Ive literally ran out of ideas, no clue what to do, i just keep getting horrible atrocious squeal every red light, every residential strip, every shopping center, crowded areas, school zones. Made me want to rip those brembos off and just smack it against the wall.

Things ive tried based on research and advice from multiple service centers:

QFM HPX pads:

- Installed shims

- sprayed anti-squeal

- Bedded in the pads - worked for like 1 week

- changed the rotors to crossdrilled/slotted

- Bedded in again

- Changed the pads to Hawks (which apparently dont make noise as advertised) Cost me another 400 dollars including machining discs and installation

Hawks pads:

- Stopped squealing for like a week but then started gradually getting louder and louder

- Bedded them in using an online guide - worked for 2 weeks until it started squealing again =='

- Drove the car bloody freakin hard doing Heavy braking and skidz out of frustration of the atrocious noise that kept occuring, in the hope that the squeal will stop...

Its pretty obvious the reason is because the rotors arent staying rough enough for the pads to stop squealing. Is there anyway that once the pads are bedded in, for the rotors to stay roughened up so they dont squeal?

They usually squeal once they get warm up, about 5 minutes worth of normal driving.

Any other suggestions?

with 400 dollars i could of fixed my damaged turbo ==; Hate these unnecessary expenses

[Sinista32]

Rotors

Sorry just read that you had replaced them.

Seems it's always when going slow.

(As I run PMU pads on DBA rotors when cold or under light braking I hear a bit of squeal)

1.Have you had the callipers looked at / fully serviced?

2. What's the brake shop think?

Edited June 14, 2014 by Sinista32

[XKLABA]

What brand disc rotors ?

Pull pads out and copper gasket silicone the shims to the pads and the pad guides to the calipers

[Deza3000]

Thanks for the quick replys

In reply to sinista32:

- Yea i had the callipers looked at, they had a look at all the brackets, pins, shims etc.... Bent them into shape (they had lost a little bit of their original shape), greased up all components, and they put it on the hoist, accelerated the car and applied the brakes, they identified that it the noise is generated between the pad and rotors

- All the brake shops and tuning companies are saying the rotors aren't rough, their isnt enough friction hence why it squeals, they keep suggesting to bed them in, but its not a permanent solution cause they keep smoothing out when i drive normally. Also when i get the rotors machined, the noise does disappear, until the pad transfers onto the rotor, which then starts to gradually squeal again, in which case i bed them in (which is basically transferring pad to the rotor anyway) and it goes away.

In reply to XKLABA:
- Disc rotors are RDA pretty sure, but even my old OEM ones would squeal, so not too sure thats the problem?
- Yea i tried that anti-squeal sticky stuff, put that both sides of the shims and stuck it onto the pads, still no luck. It happens once its warmed up, which is odd..

Sounds exactly like this :

Except much much worse in person, you'd probably pass out if you had the window down.

[Deza3000]

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-tires-wheels-brakes-suspension-sponsored-tire-rack/347375-fixed-sqealing-hawk-brake-pads.html

I also came across this, they suggested using CRC De-squeak to spray on the rotors, do we sell anything like that here in australia under a different name? Seems to have worked for them.

[Ben C34]

Yep

You can get all crc stuff here

[Ben C34]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=CRC+De-squeak

[XKLABA]

The anti squeal stuff is different the the copper silicone, I had Project Mu discs and pads on my R34 and they where terrible and the anti squeal did dick, the copper silicone did help but didn't fix it completely, a few good hard brakes to get them upto temp would work but not always possible, mine only squealed if I braked lightly, hard brake would see no noise

Problem with street/track pads is they need to be used hard or they glaze the rotors and squeal like crazy, the softer you drive/brake the worse they get

If just a normal road car drop some normal street bendix pads in it and see how it goes

[Deza3000]

In reply to XKLBA:

Cheers for the advice man!, ill try the silicone, that crc stuff and bed the discs in again before trying another set of pads. Ill also drive it a bit harder; instead of longer light braking ill try moderate heavy braking. The braking is pretty solid which i admire about the brembos, its just that noise which ruins the driving experience. Especially when those non-car enthusiasts assume you just have a bad car.

I was told by a bloke at autobarn to just get some benedix composite pads when he heard my car from the parking lot, said its just shredding my rotors, so ill probably go for that if all else fails. The car is an all rounder, track days on the holidays, daily driver during work/uni periods. 3 sets of pads in a 6 month period ...=='

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=CRC+De-squeak

Oh too easy, cheers ill give this a crack too, hopefully it will do something If it works every 2 weeks, id rather do this than bed them in every 2 weeks

[Sinista32]

that noise would drive me INSANE too

[Deza3000]

that noise would drive me INSANE too

Haha i was starting to think it was just me At least i know im not over reacting! Ill take on board all the suggestions and post back here with results I realize this discussion has been burnt through 1000s of times, but nothing seemed to be working, so wanted some fresh ideas.

Thanks for the help guys, gave me something to do

[Duncan]

yeah brake noise sucks! but even on the race car with race pads I've been lucky enough never to have the problem.

As I understand it, a major source can be dust/rust/whatever between surfaces, in particular where the disc sits against the hub. Give that a good clean down and if necessary a bit of wire brush to make sure there is no rust on the hub. Also thoroughly clean every mating surface with brake cleaner.

While that is simple, you'd be surprised how many brake shops don't clean properly; brake cleaner is expensive.

BTW you said you were using hawk pads but not which compound? It may well be that they just don't enjoy street use if they are aggressive. Swapping cheap pads to track pads can be quick so there is no need to compromise for a daily driver

[Deza3000]

#@Duncan

Cheers for the response (:, yea i got some benedix brake cleaner and a wire brush so ill give that a crack as well.

The pads say Hawks Performance ceramic? Thats what it says on the box so i assume thats the compound.

Yea i realize aggressive pads dont like normal driving conditions, hence why i told the service centre that i want some no noise brake pads, with the main priority being lower noise > performance. They used the same pads they had 100% success rate with in regards to noise, it seems to not squeal for their GTRs, evos, wrxs etc.. they use it on their own cars as well, so i trusted their judgement. They were actually surprised when i called them up to complain about the noise, so they told me to bed them in again, which only worked for a week.

But yea ill give everything listed here a go, see where it gets me, and will report back. Will do it later tonight. **Fingers crossed**

[GTRPSI]

If you try the Bendix as suggested, i can guaranty you will be throwing both rotors and pads out after 20K Km, they are that aggressive on rotors, but yes, very quiet, learnt that the expensive way, $900 full vehicle setup all undersized and in the bin in less than a year on the wifes car, and she drives like a granny.

Once you have glazed the rotors, you bedding in wont help much, they are glazed, end of story,

Your rotors are not RDA, you mentioned they are cross drilled, RDA dont produce a cross drilled rotor, theirs are dimple drilled to avoid cracking.

How did the workshop identify the noise is between the pads and rotors? Most noise if from between the pistons, caliper body ends with the pad rubbing against them.

All spring shims need to be tensioned correctly, if not your letting the pad bounce around.

Hence the suggestion by Excalba, we normally use copper grease on all contact points such as piston and leading and trailing edges of the pads (not on the pad to rotor contact surface).

We also grind a bigger leading and trailing 45 degree edge on pads to assist them from bouncing and making noise when the pistons push them into the rotors, sort of creates a gentle ramp for when they make contact.

We also find the dustier the pad, the less noise.

Having said all that we run EBC Red Stuff Ceramic compound on all but 1 car, none of them ever made a single noise except one, always the front right caliper for the first 1500Km, ive checked everything left right and center, this time i upgraded to Yellow stuff, rated to 900 degrees on that car, dusty as hell but the front right noise has gone and never returned from the moment i put them in.

[Deza3000]

#@GTRPSI
Even the softer compound benedix pads?

I was told to bed them in again when they start squealing so they roughen the rotors, worked the first time but didnt work the second so guess they are glazed ==;

the way they identified it was, with my old rotors, the noise at the time was only occuring on the driver side, so basically they just swapped the components from the drivers side to the passenger, then finally they swapped the rotors and the noise moved along with it. So when i bought the new ones, the noise did go away, however you could still hear a light braking noise, you could tell it was trying its best to become louder. Then yea became louder, i got the pads changed and disc machined, went away after that and came back 1 week later. Asked a the shop whats going on, they said the pads need a rougher surface so told me to bed them in again, and only lasted a week.

Yea both sets of pads are already chamfered, still occurs. Copper grease was applied at all contact points. Still yet to try the silicone thing behind the shims.

Yea the pads i have now are ceramic too, just not ebc. They also state that it has some sort of dampening or built in shims to keep them quiet, not too sure what the technical term was. I was also guaranteed that hawks pads wont have any noise by the service centers, as most of their GTRs, evos, wrxs, s2000s all use the same pads, they could be lieing I wouldnt mind excessive dust, my wheels to get dusty regardless cause of melbourne weather. But yea im thinking of going for a entry level toyota echo type compound, some thing soft that doesnt need to be warmed up. Just so over it, noise>performance.

Ill go see the work shop again, see what they say and if they can do something for free considering i was guaranteed no noise after spending 400 dollars. I asked him 3 times "wil there be any noise". He said no.

Anywyas Cheers man, ill look into ebc red stuff and benedix, wont mind a bit of dust or rotor chewing to get rid of that disgusting noise. I drive 15,000ks per year so going through rotors 1 and a half years aint so bad.

[75coupe]

I had squealing brakes, tried everything, shims, no shims, shim goo, cleaned everything to new, bedded in brakes numerous times, roughed up pads, chamfered the edges, dif pads, dif rotors... Etc...

Then got project mu pad shims, and perfect, no squeal...

[White GTS-T]

I'm also running Project Mu's HC+ pads with thier shims. They're whisper quiet.

[White GTS-T]

If it's an ongoing problem, even with replacement rotors, pads etc. I would be checking things like wheel bearing runout with a dial indicator. And overhauling the calipers for piece of mind.

[Deza3000]

Ill try a softer compound, im starting to think the new compound used was exactly the same as my old pads. Ill try benedix or oem brembos with another set of shims as suggested, project mu does look pretty appealing based on a quick google search, If they still squeal then ill look into faulty calipers and possible overhauling. Might just end up getting another set of calipers if its the case. Genuine parts mitsubishi sell all the evo bits surprisingly, bought a few things from there so might go there as a last resort.

But yea im convinced its just aggresive pads, feels like metal on metal, ill see what i can do over the weekend.

Thanks for the tips.

[75coupe]

Harsh pads dont cause squeal...

High frequency vibration of the pad on rotor surface causes squeal... Hence why i did lots of shim options, project mu shims are a rubber coated shim with copper grease they both work on absorbing the vibration so the squeal doesnt happen