Rb20det Minor Performance Upgrades (update Turbo Selection)

[sama1500]

they have a few different options, td05 or td06 in 16g 18g or 20g, not really sure what means what?

[GTSBoy]

TD05 is a smaller turbo than TD06. In Garrett terms think of them as T25 or T28 vs T3 frames. Although they don't line up the same as those, the change in frame size is what's important.

16g, 18g, 20g are progressively bigger versions.

[Matvei27]

Roy uses his car on the track though...I'm not sure a TD-05 or D-06 RB20DET is going to be that much fun on the street.

For the street the smaller HKS turbos are going to be more responsive.

[Roy]

LOL, my car is a street car first, track car second and is a huge compromise on the track because of it. What makes good usable power on the street makes for good usable power on the track. Its not like a slow street car will make a good track car!!!

A TD05-16G may work ok but frankly...lottery dip stuff.... IF you are going to go anything after your RB25 turbo its a GTX2860 or grab a used 2530.If you are going to spend the money dont do it with one arm tied behind your back. Like i said, dont tune the RB25 turbo setup and go straight to the better turbo and you have just saved yourself the difference between a cheap lottery dip turbo and a better turbz that will give you a good result. But i get the reason why the poster wants to run his RB25 turbo for a while.

The 2530/2860 is a good bolt on option...but dont think its massively more responsive than a bigger turbo that is a proper full setup. All different dynos and tuners but here are a bunch of plots but reckon it paints the correct picture

[sama1500]

How about a td05 18g or 20g? I'd rather not get a used turbo if I can and the kinugawa turbos are about 400 cheaper than the Garrett so if I can save that money I'd like to

[sama1500]

the hks and garrett turbos arent looking a whole lot more responsive in terms of power but they boost up much faster than the other turbo's, and in the power graphs the garrett has got about 20kw's more than the hks turbo in top end, garrett turbo is definitely seeming like the way to go although i would like to find out more about the kinugawa turbos because if i can get similar performance to the garrett turbo for $400 less i'll take it in a heartbeat

[sama1500]

Roy you wouldn't by any chance have the torque version of thode graphs?

[Roy]

So cliff notes. TD05 and TD06 are referring to the turbine type and size. 16G, 18G or 30 , 25G are all referring to the size of the compressor.

So, if you are going std internal gate bolt on turbo I personally would stay away from anything as big as a TD06. That is the same size turbine as I am running and can make 300-330rwkws. So waaaay over what you are after and in turn will be bigger and heavier for the exhaust gas to spin so...laggier than you need

So the compressor side of things...if you go for as late a model 16G based turbo you will be in the window of the power and response you are after.

IMO stay away from 20G or even 18G as the 18G is really the same size as the 20G , just a different trim. So again on 98 fuel it is a 270rwkws turbo.

So, for me and what I understand your needs to be...I would be looking at getting Kando to price up the following turbo for you.

T3 TD05H turbine housing

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Turbo-Turbine-Housing-Nissan-Skyline-RB20DET-RB25DET-8cm-TD05H-T3-/271807706353?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3f490074f1

Cartridge

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Turbo-Cartridge-CHRA-TD05H-Small-16G-Oil-Cooled-49178-54700-46-60mm-/271531508287?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3f388a023f

And run a 2/4" Compressor cover.

Effectively that is an old EVO turbo

If you want to go to basically an 18G sized wheel, just the smallest trim then get the 16G6 (in Mitsubishi world they call it a Big 16G)

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Billet-Turbo-Compressor-Wheel-Mitsubishi-EVO-3-TD05H-16G-48-30-68-01-mm-6-6-/291401525948?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item43d8e26abc

And run that with the T3 Skyline housing from above. DO NOT take thei std T3 turbone housing as they are POS! ie this

They are horrible on the exhaust side for flow

[Roy]

the hks and garrett turbos arent looking a whole lot more responsive in terms of power but they boost up much faster than the other turbo's, and in the power graphs the garrett has got about 20kw's more than the hks turbo in top end, garrett turbo is definitely seeming like the way to go although i would like to find out more about the kinugawa turbos because if i can get similar performance to the garrett turbo for $400 less i'll take it in a heartbeat

They are just spreadsheet dumps of peoples dyno sheets over the years. God it was from about 2004-2005 So there are differences in dyno types, dyno operators adn importantly wheel sizes. The rolling diameter of a 16" wheel is a lot smaller than an 18" so if going by road speed you can think something is more responsive than it really is because of the smaller wheel size.

So, the important take away IMO is arming yourself with a reasonable expectation and then speak to your tuner. Your tuner is paramount and get them to show you different graphs all from the same dyno so you can compare apples to apples.

If you are in your states SAU club jump in cars and go for rides. And lastly, dont rule out the Hypergear turbos I guess. From what was posted his T3 offering for his SR20 turbo is a bit of an abomination with buts welded on here and there to make work, but if there are some good results out there for an RB20 then it should be on your consideration list. But the RB20 result he posted was not all that promising, though that may be that particular car and not the turbos fault

[sama1500]

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Billet-Turbocharger-Bolt-On-3-Anti-Surge-RB20-RB25DET-TD05H-16G-8cm-/281631148471?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item41928649b7 im guessing this is essentially the turbo you're thinking of putting together?

[Roy]

From RB20 dyno results thread

1993 R32 GTST

Stock RB20DET

TD05-18G (EG 8cm)

Nismo 555cc (with GTR Resistor Pack)

Nistune

3" Turbo Back

Walbro 255

FMIC

Z32 AFM

United 100 RON

Stock engine, stock manifold, stock cams/gears..

With some cam gears dialled in you woudl expect to pick up a little bit in response. Not sure what T3 housing he has

[GeorgesR34]

OP's asking for a good bolt on turbo for his R32, by reading this thread there are whole lot of unrelated information that I'm confused.

The photo shopped result contain a mixed batch of E85 results, pump results, externally gated results, internally gated results, cam moded, plus results of a NA+T Rb25.

Filtering out all the unrelated. Take unopened Rb20det engine on pump fuel. I'm seeing hypergear's atr43ss has the best curve which made the most power on based boost level given. Turbo is direct bolt on that required little/none modifications, that will be the turbo I will be voting for.

[Roy]

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kinugawa-Billet-Turbocharger-Bolt-On-3-Anti-Surge-RB20-RB25DET-TD05H-16G-8cm-/281631148471?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item41928649b7 im guessing this is essentially the turbo you're thinking of putting together?

I would personally go for the 2.4" compressor cover, rather than the 3" anti-surge cover. But importantly they are the wheels and turbine housing to go for

[Roy]

OP's asking for a good bolt on turbo for his R32, by reading this thread there are whole lot of unrelated information that I'm confused.

The photo shopped result contain a mixed batch of E85 results, pump results, externally gated results, internally gated results, cam moded, plus results of a NA+T Rb25.

Filtering out all the unrelated. Take unopened Rb20det engine on pump fuel. I'm seeing hypergear's atr43ss has the best curve which made the most power on based boost level given. Turbo is direct bolt on that required little/none modifications, that will be the turbo I will be voting for.

Just scrolled through the RB20 dyno results thread. The Hypergear turbos all seem very laggy, but there are so many versions of the things perhaps they are older versions

Hypergear OP6 Hiflow may be more suited to an RB25

Stock RB20

HyperGear ATR43SS1 (none PU version) turbo internally gated bolton to stock manifold.

3" Turbo Back Exhaust

Nistune tuned

Pump 98 Fuel

FMIC

480cc Injectors

Bosch 040 Fuel Pump

3inches hard intake pipe with Pod

227rwkw (green) @ 18psi

It doesnt seem a bad option if you want a bit of headspace

FJ1600s results

92' gts-t

Stock Internals - SSS Automotive Wrecker Engine

Bosch ev14 750cc injectors

Z32 AFM

Walbro pump

Sard FPR

Red jacket coils

Bellmouth dump and 3' exhaust + decat

GRedy Profec B II

FMIC

Hypergear RB20 Highflow Turbo

PULP 98

224.8kw on 17psi

Stock RB20

RB20 Turbo Hypergear Highflow

3" Turbo Back Exhaust

Nistune tuned on V-Power 98 Fuel

GTR Intercooler

555cc Nismo Injectors

Walbro Fuel Pump

Splitfire Coil Packs

Greddy Profec b Spec II

Stock Airbox and KN Panel Filter

201rwkw @ 20psi (High), dropping a bit to 19psi and 174.6rwkw @ 14psi(Low). Did 206 with the cat removed, but the engine started pinging as the timing got advanced, so had to leave it with the 201 tun

[sama1500]

what difference would a 2.4" compressor cover make vs a 3"?

[Roy]

They are the same A/R so not likely to make a big difference. 3" means more changes to inlet piping vs std vs 2.4". But more importantly there is reason to believe anti-surge covers take a bit away from response so 2.4" is easier to package and make look std. If you go 3" just go std 3", not anti-surge

[hypergear]

Few RB20det owners buys a high flowed Rb25det / Neo turbo and replaces their blown Rb20 standard turbos with it. Those high flows are not made for RB20det motors. It will be very laggy. And not so relevant.

We usually run a different combination of wheels for RB20det standard turbocharger high flows, those are Rb20det "high flowed" turbocharger results.

and

For power and response, its not bad for a high flow using stock housings.

The current ATR43SS1 per the black back ground read is made for a Rb20det, it makes reaches full boost about 4000RPM, and makes 227rwkws @ 17psi. That is turbo is engineered for a Rb20det engine, that bolt on to your factory manifold, dump pipe, and all lines.

My Rb20det dyno readings are limited, Based on SR20det, the response of a SS15 is slightly laggier to a GT2860Rs but more responsive then GT2871R. This turbo is also efficient enough to peek 281rwkws on pump fuel at 24psi internally gated. Taking accounts if installation, response, power to boost ratio, and ability of performance gain on future modifications. This is a my recommendation.

[sama1500]

as a complete turbo kit there is no non anti surge option, excuse my cluelessness but what is anti surge anyway?

[hypergear]

Anti surge comp cover reduces surge issues, which you are unlikely to see that on a RB20det motor. It also reduces power to boost ratio in some cases. I don't machine surge slots in unless there is a surging problem.

[sama1500]

its going to be much more effort to get all the pieces individually and have a turbo made rather than just buying a kit ready to bolt in, on a td05 16g will the anti surge really make much difference? because its just much less hassle to buy the kit and bolt it all in and that kit by the sounds of things is perfect for me except for the anti surge part, my intake piping is already 3" so thats not really a problem either