Illicit Drugs

[Trozzle]

Well, for everyone else - I don't think there are ANY online communities even remotely close to the size of this one, on the topic of recreational drug use and harm reduction. Literally, there is no alternative of the same nature (so far as I'm aware), at least certainly not anywhere near as large.

[-FIGJAM-]

Yes and no lol. If I didn't know any of you beyond an SAU user name, sure I would. However since I do, I'm wary of how your opinions of me will change once you see that side of my life haha

I will state one thing - my life, and my health (in all senses of the word, both physically and mentally/emotionally), took significantly larger toll from owning a skyline than from any and ALL the illicit substances I've put in my body. That ain't a joke either, as amusing as it is haha

owning the skyline must have played havoc to then buy a golf

[Trozzle]

flamin mongrel. Haha. If Reece, motorkhana extraordinaire, took you for a test drive through the twisties, you'd buy one too.

[Trozzle]

Good to see the conversation die as soon as I chime in. Funny.

[Manuel Kasko]

I think it's more the fact you guys all agreed that we are all never going to see eye to eye about the subject. I'm easily bias because I would never wish what my family has had to deal with on any other family.

I still just belive that making them legal would just incourage someone who otherwise would have never tried it to actually try it. They they have the potential to turn into an addict when they would have never had that chance.

This is coming though from a person who has never even touched drugs. My fear behind that is that I have an adictive personality and if I tried them and enjoyed them then I would convince myself that it's okay to keep doing them, probably to excess.

[Manuel Kasko]

Your opinion didn't kill the convo, I just stopped replying because both sides will always think they are right.

Very similar to the American gun debate

[Trozzle]

I agree with you on the potential to abuse, though not the potential for that excessive use to actually have negative impact. Similarly to the addiction potential being largely specific to the individual, the potential for harm from smoking MJ is very much down to the individual, particularly their personality.

The only thing I really take issue with is the grouping of all 'illicit' drugs and the massive demonisation that follows. We as car enthusiasts despise all being painted with the same broad brush as 'hoons', this you can't deny. So why is it acceptable to blatantly do the same thing unto another social demographic? I understand personal experience plays a large role, however again back to the modified car scene how often are we all placed in the same boat by someone who had some complete dickhead driver in a skyline/turbo car do something reckless?

Edited October 10, 2015 by Trozzle

[Trozzle]

And funnily Dan, I think your attitude is much more appropriate to have if you were to simply try something to see what it's about. You obviously have no interest in taking up a vice of sorts, so even if you did enjoy it I doubt you'd bother making time in your day to abuse it, knowing it would likely take away from your current lifestyle.

[Manuel Kasko]

Yeah good point about the getting painted with the same brush. It's something that I have done with all drugs is paint them with the same brush due to the addiction I have see to pot. I have plenty of friends who take ecstasy without any adverse effects but I still paint it with the same brush as pot.

I just still don't see the plus side of making it legal though. There really isn't that much of a strong argument other than "we should have the right" or the medical argument which I already agree with.

[Trex]

I think it's more the fact you guys all agreed that we are all never going to see eye to eye about the subject. I'm easily bias because I would never wish what my family has had to deal with on any other family.

I still just belive that making them legal would just incourage someone who otherwise would have never tried it to actually try it. They they have the potential to turn into an addict when they would have never had that chance.

This is coming though from a person who has never even touched drugs. My fear behind that is that I have an adictive personality and if I tried them and enjoyed them then I would convince myself that it's okay to keep doing them, probably to excess.

incorrect. i have spoken to a lot of people who have never tried drugs, and all have said they would still not try them even if they were legal. The fact is, they are already easily accessible and they have all been around someone at one point who they could have scored off but chose not to.

You can go through your phone book now and could see someone who could get you drugs if you wanted them, but you choose not to.

Sounds like you have made up your mind whether they are legal or illegal, your stance is 'no to drugs'.

You could already go to a tobacconist and get the synthetic pot, but you never did. Now that shit should be downright illegal with sever consequences to suppliers and distributors, one bong and you have a high chance of dying. heart palpitations, stop breathing, losing consciousness etc

[Trozzle]

Have tried synthetic shit way back when it wasn't THAT bad... f**k that, never again. So long as real weed exists, that stuff can go to hell....and the only reason the synthetics are even synthesised is due to the current alternatives being prohibited. Similarly, it's why shit like flakka (a-PVP) exists. Though meth shouldn't be legalised by any means through the same argument haha

Edited October 10, 2015 by Trozzle

[Manuel Kasko]

So let's get this out in the open. What drugs do you guys think should be legal and what drugs do you think should stay illegal?

Or are you of the opinion that everything should be legal?

[Robzilla32]

Legalise everything. Half measures are futile.

[Trozzle]

I'd like to say legalise everything bar a couple like meth, heroin/hard opiates, and shit like PCP (coz that's a bit of a risky one haha).

Personally I'd be happy if they only fully legalised weed and a handful of psychedelics, and found a way to somehow regulate things like MDMA (believe me, prohibition has done baaaaaaad things for MDMA misrepresentation). I've no idea how to approach typical amphetamines' legality, since speed is high on the abuse potential and can result in harm, however such things do still have use...just not enough to outweigh the negatives when abused.

Decriminalisation would be a better approach to some things.

[Trex]

I'd like to say legalise everything bar a couple like meth, heroin/hard opiates, and shit like PCP (coz that's a bit of a risky one haha).

Personally I'd be happy if they only fully legalised weed and a handful of psychedelics, and found a way to somehow regulate things like MDMA (believe me, prohibition has done baaaaaaad things for MDMA misrepresentation). I've no idea how to approach typical amphetamines' legality, since speed is high on the abuse potential and can result in harm, however such things do still have use...just not enough to outweigh the negatives when abused.

Decriminalisation would be a better approach to some things.

like the alcohol prohibition and the shit that was getting around through illegal avenues? So you are saying we would have better substances that are less harmfull to their users as we have seen in the passed with alcohol?

[Trozzle]

Absolutely beyond all doubt. MDMA is not only significantly less toxic than the chemicals currently in its place such as 5-MAPB. You should watch the first minute of this below documentary. You'll understand just how rampant drug misrepresentation is, and we know nothing about these new drugs taking its place; MDMA has been around for a LONG time, relatively speaking.

Similarly with LSD we see the NBOMe series. Cheap as all f**k to produce, and highly toxic. For the purpose of argument, you cannot overdose on LSD. It's non toxic, good luck ever getting hold of enough to make it toxic. 25i-NBOMe however has caused seizures and a handful of known deaths at NORMAL doses. This shit is being sold EVERYWHERE as acid/LSD. Kids who don't use a reagent test kit to confirm what they have is actually LSD are running a risk. If they're really stupid and take multiple hits for a strong trip running on the assumption it's real LSD and it isn't, they're dead. If it were LSD, which it very likely would be if it weren't scheduled so tightly, they'd be in for nothing more than a heavy trip, which only comes with risks of doing something stupid while inebriated (like walking in front of a car drunk? Lol), or if shit goes south and they're not mentally prepared, could leave them a bit shaken. But otherwise in perfect health, as far as the drug is concerned.

[Trozzle]

Derp, documentary

https://youtu.be/dYzmZ1IU4zY

Can't remember embedding tags

Edited October 10, 2015 by Trozzle

[Anfanee]

Good to see the conversation die as soon as I chime in. Funny.

I was going to leave the conversation at what it was but this comment has just got under my skin in usual smart ass Troy fashion.

First of all, you didn't bring any new information to this thread. None what so ever.

Literally all you said was "i'm part of an online community so i know better" but you didn't provide any link or anything so that people that may want further information can get it. And you didn't post it because you don't want to be judged? Mate if people are going to judge you they already have.

You could have said you were the president of the united states for all i care. You can't come out making statements being like "i'm better than everyone because i'm part of something no one else is" if the knowledge in this magical place is so good share the bloody thing.

On top of that, all you have said is "drugs don't harm the user as much as people think" and you completely ignored the elephant in the room.

The issue with that is, most people against drugs don't give a f**k if the user harms themselves. Honestly. No f**ks given. Your family will care, but everyone else? No f**ks given. However, if you say, drive high and hit a family killing them people will pay huge attention. That is where the line is drawn. The issue arrives when it starts to impact the people around you. I suppose it's one of those things i was told "you'll understand when you have kids" and you really do.

And i know you will turn back to Alcohol. Again i say this is a perfect example as to why drugs should not be legal.

This nation has enough of an issue dealing with alcohol as it is. The government pours money into rehab clinics, the police force, and pretty much everything they can think of to stop alcohol related deaths. Not to mention the centerlink payments that go to those people not willing to work due to addiction. It is one of our biggest problems currently facing our police force.

Now you can't honestly sit there and say that adding drugs to that would do this nation any good. When the government is going around trying to restrict alcohol more, adding lock out times for both bars and shops and it is still one of our biggest current issues.

So the answer i want is:

Why should my tax dollars go to druggies rehab clinics/police force/centerlink payments instead of schools and health care because some people wanted to have a slightly better night?

Why should peoples lives be put at risk (again not the users lives, other people. ) because some people wanted to have a slightly better night?

Why should work places have to deal with that shit and potentially have lives at risk due to peoples negligence?

Now if this magical forum of knowledge and wealth (yet to know if it actually exists) can prove that tax dollars won't be spent trying to fix an issue that would make alcohol look like a walk in the park, if this magical forum of knowledge and wealth can prove that it won't put other peoples lives at risk, and if this magical forum of knowledge and wealth can prove it won't have a negative impact on workplaces and other parts of society then sure... Legalise it.

Again i know this is something we both won't ever agree on. But i couldn't let that comment sit.

Also. This is coming from the guy that sits on the pharmacy board for Australia* so prove me wrong.

*User may or may not sit on the pharmacy board for Australia, but you will never know because i didn't provide any proof.

[XGTRX]

I went to a kindergarten and asked the kids if they think drugs are good.

They answered no.

Guess what they are right.

Don't need a Google search or peer review to make sense of that.

[Trozzle]

Broke the post

Edited October 10, 2015 by Trozzle