Illicit Drugs

[Anfanee]

And again there is a difference between controlled supervised use aka through therapy.

and old mate on a friday night because he feels a bit shit.

Also this is totally turning into an episode of Hannibal.....

[Anfanee]

And drugs don't have to be decriminalized for therapy like stuff to happen.

That IMO is where the line is drawn.

[Trozzle]

And again there is a difference between controlled supervised use aka through therapy.

and old mate on a friday night because he feels a bit shit.

Also this is totally turning into an episode of Hannibal.....

It's seriously like you didn't even read what I posted.

[Anfanee]

I was agreeing with you Troy lol

[Anfanee]

I was just stating that's what i've been saying since this thread started lol

[Trozzle]

Fair enough, my bad. I read it as though you just wanted to repeat yourself regardless of what I'd posted lol.

While we'll continue to more or less disagree over decriminalisation etc, I'm glad you do see that they have real value beyond a good time, and aren't necessarily the toxic killers they're made out to be.

[Anfanee]

Well...

The current stuff can be. I know someone that was put into a coma for 4 months.

Point is if it was controlled (and not made in darrens basement with industrial grade rat poison) that stuff practically wouldn't happen apart from a reaction.

[Trozzle]

Well...

The current stuff can be. I know someone that was put into a coma for 4 months.

Point is if it was controlled (and not made in darrens basement with industrial grade rat poison) that stuff practically wouldn't happen apart from a reaction.

The following is absolute assumption we speak on MDMA/ecstasy - please let me know if the person you know was dabbling in a completely different drug.

I don't want to reignite the repetitious aspects of this thread, but when you say "current stuff" do you mean what's sold on the street as something it isn't (like 5-MAPB, 4-MMC, PMA, etc)? Again, unless they were extremely unlucky to be one of the very few to have a serious adverse reaction to MDMA, it was not the MDMA to cause the coma (well, unless they bombed like 5 times what they should have).

Either way, that sucks

Also while clandestine home-labs are for the very large majority an absolute cesspool dump I wouldn't even want to step foot in, the use of "rat poison" is for the most part absolute myth. Strychnine (rat poison) adulteration has been found in very few cases, and those were almost exclusively attempted poisonings. It exhibits no effects even remotely similar to the desired effect of the drug it's allegedly used in the synthesis of, so beyond the desire of killing your clients (which would be terrible for business) there's no reason to put it in whatever you're making. Clandestine labs might be the filthiest makeshift dumps one could possibly attempt chemistry in, but simply there's no point dumping random chemicals into the mix when it'd ruin the synthesis process resulting in poor or even no yield of the desired end product.

Funnily, a lot of the 'danger' myths to do with these drugs were started by the users themselves lol. f**k knows why. The Strychnine in LSD myth is a good example of how it simply doesn't add up - strychnine is one of the most bitter substances known, so you'd know immediately what is on your tiny little piece of blotter paper is NOT LSD. Also its toxicity would see any amount you could manage to fit on an LSD blotter have little to no toxic effect (the LD50 is roughly 1–2 mg/kg orally in humans, or 70-80mg for the average male at the low end of that scale; a 'normal' sized LSD blotter would struggle to fit 1mg of anything on it).

I know my interactions in this thread have been a bit heated and arrogant/stubborn, I won't deny; I just ask you try to consider the idea that regardless of what your final opinion is on this subject, what I'm trying to get across is the most "factual" information I can present, and I try to show what information my opinions are based on. Believe what I say, or don't - that's entirely up to you. My intentions to educate are sincere - I spend most of my day trying to do the same thing with clowns who dive head first into this shit before doing their research, so honestly getting my message through to those who have no interest in touching this stuff ergo no need to know proper harm minimisation practices isn't really high on the priority list. I just have too much time.

Edited December 14, 2015 by Trozzle

[Anfanee]

It was esctasy and my point with rat cleaner was more pointing out you have no idea what they do.

[Trozzle]

Please see above regarding strychnine - none of it makes any sense by the fact it would ruin the synthesis (chemistry is very specific in process), and that the only confirmed cases of adulteration were found to be attempted murder:

Strychnine has indeed rarely been discovered mixed with LSD and other drugs in a few samples recovered by law enforcement agencies, but these were all found in murder or attempted murder investigations where someone was being specifically targeted for poisoning, and not associated with recreational LSD use.^[26]

[Trozzle]

Sorry forgot to actually hit post:

I do agree that we have nfi "what's in" our stuff in terms of purity and undesired byproducts/unclean synthesis. That's absolutely true, and a result of shitty practices in filthy setups by semi-educated and likely intoxicated muppets. So yes, even if you received MDMA, it likely contains impurities from an imperfect synthesis, and the chemist who made it surely isn't going to go to the further effort to wash their product. I mean impurities increase weight which in turn increases profit

That being said, the instance of impurities and their speciifc characteristics are unlikely to dramatically change the effects, though that is definitely an 'unknown'

[Trozzle]

OH! OH! I'd like to share these links to 2 published books written by renowned American medicinal chemist, biochemist, pharmacologist, psychopharmacologist, and author (stole that description from wiki lol), Alexander "Sasha" Shulgin. Shulgin is responsible for first synthesising a great number of psychoactive compounds and investigating their effects. Over his many many years of discovering and subsequently self-trialling these compounds, he authored 2 booked - "PIHKAL" and "TIHKAL", which stand for Phenethylamines/Tryptamines I Have Known And Loved. These books detail the synthesis route leading to the end compound, its effects at various dosages, and qualatitive thoughts/commentary.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Shulgin

PIHKAL

TIHKAL

If you actually have an interest in knowing what these substances do (as in the FACTS) without having to touch them yourself, this is possibly the best you're going to get. I'd love it if XGTRX could have a glance over some of the compounds he's so sure he knows everything about, but really since that's about as likely as blood from a stone, I at least hope anybody else has a read for the hell of it. If you're interested.

An example of some of the amusing bits. This was taken from the page on DOPr. Bolded for lulz.

QUALITATIVE COMMENTS: (with 2.0 mg) The onset is slower than any other thing I can think of. There was nothing at all at the end of an hour, and only a threshold a half hour later. By the middle of the third hour, I was up to 1+, and that seemed to be about as high as it intended to take me. Attempts to sleep at the ninth hour were not successful, as there were strange patterns of not-quite logical thinking going on. Stuff like: `The block events (like a baby's rectangular building blocks) that were gotten, along with other things, from the full octaves of the left hand in Listz's Hungarian Rhapsody, events that allowed an easy recognition of the odds of achieving successful re-entry from any of several erotic codes.' Clearly this was not a baseline state. After six hours of successful sleep, I was still off-baseline , and on into the following day. Go on up with curiosity but with caution.

[Trozzle]

Stoner Sloth

http://junkee.com/nice-try-guys-4/71169 (yeah I know that's hardly a news source, but might as well link a funny one for something this stupid)

Anyone wanna comment on this hilarious failure, or have I truly killed this thread for good?

[IcedTea]

Stoner Sloth is hilarious, can't believe tax payer money actually paid for this shit.

When i first saw it I was sure it had to be satire, nope, sponsored by the Gov.

Been all over the news/Reddit/4chan...

T-Shirt Comp for it:
http://musicfeeds.com.au/news/bennies-stoner-sloth-t-shirt-competition-pure-genius/

[Trozzle]

It is pretty ridiculous that the taxpayer paid for that ridiculous skit hey....would really hate to think how much

[hardsteppa]

just saw how Lemurs like to irritate millipedes to make them secret a toxic liquid....which the Lemurs then use to get thoroughly intoxicated..

[Trozzle]

Jaguar's munch on the roots of the B. caapi vine for the hallucinogenic alkaloids Harmine, Harmaline, and tetrahydroharmine.

The south American hallucinogenic brew "Ayahuasca" is traditionally made from the roots of this vine combined with a source of DMT such as Psychotria viridis. DMT is not orally active unless in ludicrous doses, as it is rapidly metabolised by the enzyme monoamine oxidase during first-pass metabolism (smoking/vapourising, injecting, insufflating, or plugging will all skip first-pass metabolism in the liver, but will still be rapidly metabolised which is why the trip is so damned short). The addition of an MAOI (monoamine oxidase inhibitor), in the form of the hamine alkaloids, allows the DMT to both survive first-pass metabolism to be orally active, and also remain active within the body for a much longer duration.

There's also a species of toad - Bufo alvarius - whose poison contains the psychoactive compounds 5-MeO-DMT and 5-HO-DMT (Bufotenin). I could swear I remember a story about another creature that purposely licks these toads to get high hahaha

Some dolphins 'play' with puffer fish to get high too.

I guess these creatures missed the memo about how bad drugs are, and how wrong it is to use them. Pick up your game XGTRX, we have innocent creatures falling victim to the deadly world of recreational drugs lololol

[IcedTea]

I guess these creatures missed the memo about how bad drugs are, and how wrong it is to use them. Pick up your game XGTRX, we have innocent creatures falling victim to the deadly world of recreational drugs lololol

[XGTRX]

Hey Trozzle,

Do you know why dogs lick their balls?

Because they can.

That info is more valuable that your useless Google search and cut and paste.

Edited December 23, 2015 by XGTRX

[Trozzle]

Didn't cut and paste ya f**king clown, it's called acquired knowledge I've attained from reading... Either way good to know you're still checking in, I hope I've taught you something

Edited December 23, 2015 by Trozzle