SAU Circuit Times

[Beer Baron]

sound test!!!

yeah they should sound test. if you car is too quiet, they should send you home... gotta give the spectators something to hear/feel.

[gtr jason]

Hi Russell did the spilter help with under sterr my car also has 330kw at all four and did 1.09 at wake feild on r1rs but the under sterr is really bad and no one has been able to help me out so farI have spent a shit load on ajustable suspension parts camber kits rear arms caster rods and sway bars but the under sterr is still there.Thanks mate

[Sydneykid]

Hi Russell did the spilter help with under sterr my car also has 330kw at all four and did 1.09 at wake feild on r1rs but the under sterr is really bad and no one has been able to help me out so farI have spent a shit load on ajustable suspension parts camber kits rear arms caster rods and sway bars but the under sterr is still there.Thanks mate

A little turn in understeer is normal, there is a tonne on the front wheels after all;

What size bars?

If adjustable, what settings?

What spring rates?

What caster?

What camber?

If the settings are OK, then you may need an ATTESSA controller to set up the torque split for your driving style. The right hander onto the straight is a bitch as it is off camber, but as the corner onto the only decent straight it is important. So Wakefield Park requires a pretty unique set up with quite a bit of side to side stagger in the set up.

[gtr jason]

9 deg caster , -5camber on front 6mm toe out -2.5 camber on the back the sway bars are ajustable and 2mm bigger then standed but solid the front sping rates are 730 pound and the rears are 610 pounds i have run the car on slicks at wakefeild and got it down to 1.05 but the under steer was still very bad and wrecked a set of slicks in one day i have a spilter , but dont know how to use it ,it is a hks when i tried the car in 2 wheel drive it was worse

[Roy]

Thats massive camber and spring rates! What shocks are you running? Have you ever gone out and done a bunch of laps then pitted to check temperatures across the tyr face. Understeer could simply be you dont have enough tyre on the track to handle the corner speed you are chasing, and just heats up too much?!?!?

[Sydneykid]

9 deg caster , -5camber on front 6mm toe out -2.5 camber on the back the sway bars are ajustable and 2mm bigger then standed but solid the front sping rates are 730 pound and the rears are 610 pounds i have run the car on slicks at wakefeild and got it down to 1.05 but the under steer was still very bad and wrecked a set of slicks in one day i have a spilter , but dont know how to use it ,it is a hks when i tried the car in 2 wheel drive it was worse

Roy has basically said it, my 20 cents worth. I believe 5 degree of negative camber is far too much, expecially for a GTR with 730 lbs /inch front springs and a 24mm front bar. Add that to 9 degrees of caster and on a 20 degree steering angle turn you have 14 degrees. It simply shouldn't roll enough with those spring and bar rates to need that much angle.

Some questions;

A. How did you get 9 degrees of caster on the front, the inner mount of the lower control arm hits on the sub frame at 5. The drive shaft angle must be huge.

B. How high is it? If under 350 mm (centre of wheel to guard) then have you corrected the bump steer?

C. Have you cheked the corner weights?

D. Have you checked the tyre temperatures?

E. Does it still have HICAS?

F. What front diff? Hopefully standard.

G. What rear diff? Hopefully 1.5 way.

H. Confirm the stabiliser bar diameters? Should be 24 mm front and 24 mm rear.

What I would do;

1. Put the standard front stabiliser bar back on, if you don't have it, then set the front adjustable bar on full soft

2. Set the rear adjustable bar at full hard

3. Back the front shocks off to full soft

4. Set the rear shocks on full hard

5. Try it

6. If it still understeers, then swap the front springs to the rear

That will quickly tell you if it is a spring, shock and bar tuning problem.

Alignment needs to be checked with a pyrometer, do 3 to 5 hard laps, come in fast and measure the tyres temps (outside, middle and inside). That will tell you if you are using the whole width of the tyre ie; its contact patch. You then tune the tyre pressures and camber to get even tyre temps across the tread face.

If you can spare the time, pop out to Oran Park next weekend (Sat or Sun) for Round 3 of the NSW State Championship and I will get the driver of the Improved Production GTR to have a chat to you about how he drives one. There are some tricks. PM me for contact details.

Hope that helps:cheers:

[gtr jason]

thanks sydney kid i have spoken to them guys before my car runs 6 seconds quicker at oran park then theres have checked the tyre wear across the tyre before on new slicks after 20 laps at oran park the inside of the tyre had 4mm middle 3mm out side edge nothing the car has been corner weighted and set up at east coast suspension have backed the front sway bar off still need to do up rear bar i think i need to play with the torque spilter thanks i will give u a call if i can make the track as i live 5km away thanks again

[Roy]

Car Make and Model: 92 GTST

Circuit Name: Sandown

Lap time: 1:25.5sec

Modifications

Engine: std RB20DET, with TD06 and PFc

Power: Not sure of boost, pretty sure about 234rwkws

Suspension: Whiteline works kit

Tyres: RE55s

Brakes: 324mm DBA 4000 rotors with Comp 9 Front pads and Comp 2 Rears

Body weight: std minuw rear seat

Im stoked with the lap time, especially since the diff has finally given up, with it open wheeling onto both main straights meaning i was having trouble getting the power down:( Also as im sick of locking brakes i still have a tendency to brake a bit early...so with diff fixed and a bit more experience with such big stops form high speeds i hope to pull a low 1:24 high 1:23. I suppose it depends how much difference the diff makes:confused:

[Bullant47]

OK, just got home after competing in Round 4 NSW Supersprint at Eastern Creek. I have improved my best time and now have a fastest lap time of 1:50:3900, timed by CAMS. The car was going great and the only thing that was changed from the last outing at Eastern Creek was one of SKYLINEGEOFF'S hicas lock bars was fitted and this modification steadied the rear end and made it much more predictable. (Thanks Geoff). 2.13 secs improvement. Unfortunatly the day finished early for me when i blew a exhaust manifold gasget, but still drove the car home, 4hrs drive.

Ian.

HaHaHa...I left the track early with the blown exh manifold gasket and was seriously happy with with my 1:50:3900... I didn't check with the timekeepers for my last session on the track, but i knew I was going better than I had been earlier. I just got the official results for the day and I won my class and finished 9th outright on the day. Nothing that is road registered is withing cooee of my time. Also I am outright leading class SVD for the season and on one of the last 3 laps I recorded a time of 1:49:55.

Car Make and Model: R33 GTS-t

Circuit Name: Eastern Creek

Lap Time: 1:49:55 (timed by CAMS)

Modifications : Power FC with Apexi PFC Boost Control

GCG Hi Flow Turbo

GTR34 Front Mount Intercooler

GTR34 Fuel Pump

Sard Fuel Regulator

Nismo 550 Injectors

HKS Step 1 Cams with Adj HKS Cam timing gear on EX Cam

Oil Cooler

Suspension: Whiteline Adj Sway bars Front and Rear

Front and Rear Tower struts

Adjustable Caster Rods

Whiteline Adj Camber Kit

Adjustable Rear Upper Arms

Whiteline Springs with Bilstein Shocks

GTRGeoff HiCas Lock Bar

Pineapples

Brakes: Slotted DBA Sport Fr Rotors Stock Rear Rotors

Ferodo Racing Fr Pads Stock Rear Pads

Braided Brake and Clutch Lines

Motul RF600 Fluid

Cusco Brake Master Cyl support

Tyres: Bridgestone RE55s

Lubrication: Motol Full Synthetic 15w50 Motorsport and NEO Gearbox and Diff

Thanks Roy

Ian

[Roy]

That sure is moving:thumbsup:

You dont find the Whiteline springs a bit soft? What front and rear camber are you running. I found that i needed -2.5 to -3.0 deg on the front to stop the outside shoulder of the frotn right tyre from blistering

[Bullant47]

That sure is moving:thumbsup:  

You dont find the Whiteline springs a bit soft? What front and rear camber are you running. I found that i needed -2.5 to -3.0 deg on the front to stop the outside shoulder of the frotn right tyre from blistering

Hi Roy, no I dont find the Whiteline springs soft, I am using the Lowered spring and i have a circlip goove 1" lower than the stock Bilstein groove. I am using all the settings provided by Whiteline on their website for the R33. I try and keep the tyre pressures to 34psi after each run.

Ian

[Roy]

Do you have any photos of the car thru turn 2 or 8? I suppose with the Sprint format you arent putting the same heat into the tyres...lol then again maybe your just driving the car properly and me flying up to corners with too much entry speed/turning in too early is just cooking the front tyres:(

And looking at your EC times your only about 1sec off the giant/Russel:) But being fair he only did 6 laps to get that time. (super impressive) and the semis had one toe in the tip.

Still im dirty that it rained and i pranged it at Eastern last month. I was mega keen to see what lap improvement i would get from an extra 80rwkws, no 180km speed limiter and semi slicks. LOL...Instead because of the rain i was doing 2:20s and getting overtaken by a 1.5L Charade:)

[Bullant47]

Do you have any photos of the car thru turn 2 or 8? I suppose with the Sprint format you arent putting the same heat into the tyres...lol then again maybe your just driving the car properly and me flying up to corners with too much entry speed/turning in too early is just cooking the front tyres:(

And looking at your EC times your only about 1sec off the giant/Russel:)  But being fair he only did 6 laps to get that time. (super impressive) and the semis had one toe in the tip.  

Still im dirty that it rained and i pranged it at Eastern last month. I was mega keen to see what lap improvement i would get from an extra 80rwkws, no 180km speed limiter and semi slicks. LOL...Instead because of the rain i was doing 2:20s and getting overtaken by a 1.5L Charade:)

Hi Roy, If you PM me your address I will send you a DVD I made with a camera mounted on the rear parcel shelf and my old man videoing from the roof of the main building at EC last week. Also if you go to www.JPMphoto.com.au and click on Supersprint at EC (maybe Mini Car Club of NSW) last week and on Pages 7 and 18 their are a few pictures of my Skyline.

Thanks Roy

Ian

[Roy]

Dont worry about the DVD, just wanted to see how much attitude the car was getting thru the corners when running the semis.

[Snowman]

Brisby your the man.

Anyways - update my Sandown time to 1.22.2. Change in tyres, brakes and turb's dropped 3.5s off my PB. Very happy.

[Roy]

I so wish i had the vid camera in my car when follwoing you for that lap and a half until i spun:)

The thing gets out of corners so well, but looked to be a handful getting it into and thru the corners. If you can just get your car tied down a bit better thru the corners the thing still has plenty of time in it:)

Did the brakes sort themselved out in the end? AND you were MIA Sunday night:alcoholic:

[Snowman]

Yeah the Mrs told me I was snoring on the couch when my phone finally rang so she decided to let me sleep. Truthfully I was buggered on Sunday night.

The brakes now are perfect. Initially quite shuddery but it looks like it just needed some serious bedding. This is despite me doing about 30 stops from about 160-40 on Saturday. I took it out for a spin yesterday just to ensure the shudder hadn't returned now everything is cold again but it's still perfect.

My biggest issue now is my suspension. I'm finding the car is bouncing heaps under heavy braking. Was really noticeable into turn 1 - and to a degree into turn 4 also (where you turned around Brisby). Same at Winton at Turn 8. You can really fell the car skip which causes the brakes to lock a little. Have to get it sorted. Not sure if it's just the springs that need doing or if the HA's just aren't good enough.

But in fairness in that session you were behind me I was also experimenting a little as well. I was testing out just how deep I could go with the new brakes and missed the corners a couple of times. After you spun off I punch out a lap that was over 3s quicker than when you were behind me.

[Roy]

But in fairness in that session you were behind me I was also experimenting a little as well. I was testing out just how deep I could go with the new brakes and missed the corners a couple of times. After you spun off I punch out a lap that was over 3s quicker than when you were behind me.

LOL...no doubt. Thats what i was telling ppl, after every corner you were going quicker so i just put it down to the fact that your thing looks after tyres better and takes longer to warm up. My thing is the opposite, straight up to temp but struggle if i was to do too many laps:(

[Ronin 09]

Time to update your sig to include your recent Sandown triumphs, Roy

Excellent work

Sorry i didn't show up - absolutely positively shitty because I forgot!

[Roy]

Im just stoked that A) the car did the time, B) hopefully the ribbing i cop will start to stop:)

Still have to do a 1:52 around Phillip Island so may fall on my sword yet:(

...though the diff and front susp will be changed before the next track day so will never know if the car as is is capable of those times:(