Can you remove a stock rb25 turbo without jacking up the car?

[sonicz]

Can you remove a stock rb25 turbo without jacking up the car?

Just wondering if this job is possible from the top with the right tools.

[iruvyouskyrine]

Yes it is, will be difficult but definitely doable. Wouldn't be as bad as taking twins off a gtr

[sonicz]

Good to hear. What would be the hardest part? How would you get to the dump pipe bolts? adjustable spanner?

 

p.s Are you sure its doable by a regular skilled human with common tools or just taking an educated guess? 

[-S-]

Jacking it up will make it easier? How so?

[sneakey pete]

 

14 minutes ago, -S- said:

Jacking it up will make it easier? How so?

Getting the dump out.

I can't see any situation where jacking the car up wouldn't be possible though?

But yes its only one thing (dump) you need to be under there for and i'm sure with the right combo of tools etc you could do it without jacking it up.
I mean I once helped take one off in a holiday home back yard and it only took a couple of hours, its not terribly hard if you have some mechanical experience

[inmaniac]

I've done this job twice (and there are many here who have done it many more times than that lol).

I can tell you it is much easier to bring the turbo up out of the engine with the dump attached, disconnecting from the cat or w/e your next flange down from the dump is.

If you want to go your route, yes it can be done, I've taken the dump off with a socket set and ratchet spanners. The difficult parts will be the oil drain and and the banjo bolt closest to the block (the big fker 24mm)

Note: The only reason I can think of to not jack up the car is that you are either a) Inexperienced with doing that or (more likely) b) you don't have the equipment - in either scenario you probably shouldn't be attacking this job.

Jack the car up. 10x easier.

[GeeDog]

The coolant lines & oil return are easier to get off from under the car, but probably doable from above. As already stated, dump bolts will also be harder.

[sonicz]

The car is on uneven grass/stones on a downhill. moving it will be a problem in itself id really want to avoid. And yes i dont exactly want to get under it in this scenario. Maybe i can jack up the side of the car only and disconnect from the cat and just pull out the whole thing..hmm seems like an idea i can try inmaniac.

 

When you guys say the big 24mm bolt is that the coolant line thats on the turbo? Cos i undid that bolt easy already from the top.

Edited August 23, 2017 by sonicz

[inmaniac]

Strange scenario. Please be safe wherever you're working. The hassle of moving it is likely worth it but I've said that already.

As for lines, there's a coolant feed and return. My bet is if it was "easy" you've only got the bolt closest to the strut. You need to get the other on the block side of the turbo. No one has ever called that bolt "easy", especially from the top. 

[PatMol]

I would give up if I had to remove a turbo without a jack and axle stand.

I have done this many times once on the drive in 35 degrees.

You will need to get under the car to get easier access to bolts.

For the sake of sanity borrow a stand and a jack...

[sonicz]

Ok guys did the job spent about 2 half days on it and fuming now cos it was half arsed and probably was for nothing as have to do it again...  My uncle was helping and was in a rush so not really thinking.  Haven't started the car cos I'm not comfortable about a few things.

1. Is it OK if one of the bolts is missing on the compressor housing of the turbo? We had to take one bolt of to fit the oil line pipe onto the turbo as it would not fit anymore with new turbo.

 

The one in red we took off.

 

Will that hold up ok?

 

2. Did not fit copper washers on oil and cooler bolts. The only one that has a gasket is the bottom metal pipe. They will leak right?

 

Thought so.

 

Anyway it turns out you can remove the turbo from the top with a lot of swearing patience and tilting and the right tools. That water bolt thats opposite of the strut side as you guys said, you can undo it if you just use a ratchet without an extension and a 23mm socket. Its on an awkward angle but doable if you keep it in place with one hand and twist away or get someone to hold the socket on the bolt and someone else to turn Getting it back on is a lot harder than removincos they dont line up right. You sort of need two people.

 

Th hardest part is the coolant hose at the bottom. You need to take the wheel of and undo it from underneath unless you are lucky and the phillips bolt on the clamp is facing up, which it wasn't in my case. So had to do it from the side.

Edited September 23, 2017 by sonicz

[GTSBoy]

You probably _can_ leave the housing bolt out, but.......I don't think I would be happy.  There's plenty of other bolts holding the comp cover on, so it's unlikely that it will flex or leak or whatever.  If it were me, and desperation was there, I would grind the height of the bolt head down so there's just enough to grab with a tool and at least apply some clamping force to the joint.  Probably with some suitable locktight.  Otherwise it comes down to altering the fitting that you're bolting to the core to gain the required clearance.

And yes.....copper washers are not really optional.

[sonicz]

Yea all it would have taken was to grab a file and file down the metal pipe where it intrudes on the bolt. We're talking lack of clearance the size of a few grains of salt. But too late now not sure if i can take it all of.  Whats the worst case scenario of it moves? Just loose some boost or the whole turbine scarping on the housing and destroying the turbo?

 

So the copper washers, are needed on both sides of the banjo fitting? As in it goes turbo housing>copper washer>banjo fitting>copper washer>23mm bolt head?

Edited September 24, 2017 by sonicz

[inmaniac]

Mate, all of this sounds so god damn dodgy hahaha but hey, good on you for not letting anything hold you back. That said....yeah...not overly confident for you LOL.

 

11 hours ago, sonicz said:

 

1. Is it OK if one of the bolts is missing on the compressor housing of the turbo? We had to take one bolt of to fit the oil line pipe onto the turbo as it would not fit anymore with new turbo.

 

The one in red we took off.

When replacing my Wastegate I left one of these bolts off and I ended up having a leak. I would NOT suggest leaving any of the compressor bolts removed.

 

11 hours ago, sonicz said:

2. Did not fit copper washers on oil and cooler bolts. The only one that has a gasket is the bottom metal pipe. They will leak right?

Major problem. Yes they will leak. As per your last post, you need 2 x copper crush washer, one for either side of the Banjos. Having only 1 (or none) will still leak.

11 hours ago, sonicz said:

Anyway it turns out you can remove the turbo from the top with a lot of swearing patience and tilting and the right tools. That water bolt thats opposite of the strut side as you guys said, you can undo it if you just use a ratchet without an extension and a 23mm socket. Its on an awkward angle but doable if you keep it in place with one hand and twist away or get someone to hold the socket on the bolt and someone else to turn Getting it back on is a lot harder than removincos they dont line up right. You sort of need two people.

 

Th hardest part is the coolant hose at the bottom. You need to take the wheel of and undo it from underneath unless you are lucky and the phillips bolt on the clamp is facing up, which it wasn't in my case. So had to do it from the side.

Good on you for getting the engine-side 23mm with a socket. I couldn't do it but then again I was alone. You *can* do it (obviously) but a 23mm ratchet-spanner is God's gift for this job.

No one said you couldn't remove the turbo from the top, in fact, everyone does that as the norm. The point we made was doing with without jacking up the car which is a nightmare.

Regarding the coolant hose on the bottom (do you mean near the strut?) I don't know why you had to pull off the wheel, it's easily accessible. You also mention philips in the same sentence so I assume you must mean the oil drain, which is on the bottom. That I guess you would get more access by removing the wheel, assuming you aren't jacking up. My only advice here is to ensure you have connected this correctly with a new gasket as it is the most common place for oil leaks when installing a turbo.

Summary: I don't think you'll have to take the turbo out again, but yes you still have a bit of work to do. Please do it right for your own sake.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2017 by inmaniac

[sonicz]

Inmaniac yea it definitely is dodgy as. When you trying to cut corners to go faster you end up taking three times as long.

Ok so you are saying I need to fit that compressor housing bolt back on or it will or may leak !? Boost leak? One bolt out of 7 or 8? Fark.. I wonder if I can get it in there without unbolting the turbo..? Do you happen to know what size the bolt is so i can get one with a smaller head maybe?? What if I just risk it and see how it goes. Any chance of damaging the turbo? I think I may just stick my head in the sand and side with GTSboy on this one cos its too painful to take it all out and I think my uncle has thrown in the towel so I may be alone now. I'm not a  very mechanical aptitude person and I hate doing this kind of sensitive expensive work.

Yea you definitely need a suitably sized ratchet to get to the engine side 23mm coolant bolt from the top. CRCH CRCH CRCH for days. If you attempted it with a spanner or wrench you would loose your sanity long before the bolt came out. The amount of turns required is not to be taken lightly not to mention the awkward angle you need to have the tool grip the bolt head at.

Yes I mean the oil drain pipe on the bottom of the turbo leading into the bottom of the engine block. Yes that one has a gasket on it that came with the new turbo. Unfortunately the stock hose is not longer long enough And I need a new oil drain hose. That sucker is some kind of special hose painted silver and I am having problems finding one like it but longer. I assume it cant just be a heater hose cos it needs to be oil resistant.  Can I just use a silicone hose from bunnings and cut it to size? I went to supercheap repco autobarn etc nadda. I am going pirtek on monday to see if I can find a suitable hose. As in a spent an entire saturday looking for one and found nothing.

 

Also I was suggested to go to plazmaman to get a 1.5inch to 2 inch 90 degree silicone hose to attach new turbo to stock piping So I hope he has what i need.

 

What a terrible job. Wish I took it to a shop now. If anybody that has done this before in Sydney feels like swinging by to "finalize" the job I'll give you $50 and free beers. Its not much but at least its not nothing.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2017 by sonicz

[inmaniac]

1 hour ago, sonicz said:

Inmaniac yea it definitely is dodgy as. When you trying to cut corners to go faster you end up taking three times as long.

Yep. My entire build thread is dedicated to the mistakes of trying to cut corners. You just can't do it with cars (as you're learning now).

1 hour ago, sonicz said:

Ok so you are saying I need to fit that compressor housing bolt back on or it will or may leak !? Boost leak? One bolt out of 7 or 8? Fark.. I wonder if I can get it in there without unbolting the turbo..? Do you happen to know what size the bolt is so i can get one with a smaller head maybe?? What if I just risk it and see how it goes. Any chance of damaging the turbo? I think I may just stick my head in the sand and side with GTSboy on this one cos its too painful to take it all out and I think my uncle has thrown in the towel so I may be alone now. I'm not a  very mechanical aptitude person and I hate doing this kind of sensitive expensive work.

I can't tell you if it may or will leak, what I can tell you is that the manufacturer put a bolt there for a reason, right? Not to mention as I already said, I personally had a leak, so the gamble is on you but I wouldn't. Since you have the bolt out, why don't you try and go get a lower profile one yourself or, failing that, either sand it down as suggested by GTS Boy orrrr change the adapter for your oil feed?

1 hour ago, sonicz said:

you definitely need a suitably sized ratchet to get to the engine side 23mm coolant bolt from the top. CRCH CRCH CRCH for days. If you attempted it with a spanner or wrench you would loose your sanity long before the bolt came out. The amount of turns required is not to be taken lightly not to mention the awkward angle you need to have the tool grip the bolt head at.

A ratchet spanner, like this, is what I used:

 

1 hour ago, sonicz said:

Yes I mean the oil drain pipe on the bottom of the turbo leading into the bottom of the engine block. Yes that one has a gasket on it that came with the new turbo. Unfortunately the stock hose is not longer long enough And I need a new oil drain hose. That sucker is some kind of special hose painted silver and I am having problems finding one like it but longer. I assume it cant just be a heater hose cos it needs to be oil resistant.  Can I just use a silicone hose from bunnings and cut it to size? I went to supercheap repco autobarn etc nadda. I am going pirtek on monday to see if I can find a suitable hose. As in a spent an entire saturday looking for one and found nothing.

I find it hard to believe you went to all of those places and couldn't find some basic oil-resistant hose. It's a low-pressure line, you should be able to find oil-resistant hose in Supercheap, Autobarn, any of those places. Ask an attendant. No, heater hose won't do.

1 hour ago, sonicz said:

I was suggested to go to plazmaman to get a 1.5inch to 2 inch 90 degree silicone hose to attach new turbo to stock piping So I hope he has what i need.

 

What a terrible job. Wish I took it to a shop now. If anybody that has done this before in Sydney feels like swinging by to "finalize" the job I'll give you $50 and free beers. Its not much but at least its not nothing.

 

 

I got the same adapter off ebay. If you go to Plazmaman they'll have what you need.

You should have taken it to a shop as soon as you said you couldn't jack the damn car up lol - but whatever. Sounds like you'll still have it done *eventually* without the cost of getting a shop to do it. just take the time to fix up those issues you have.

You should have offered payment and beers BEFORE starting, but I don't know if anyone would do it without the right tools or being able to jack up (which I still don't understand why??)

[inmaniac]

By the way, I jsut noticed the image you used to describe your bolt issue... If you got a Maxpeedingrods turbo (or other ebay special) pleeeease tell me you ported the wastegate before installing?

Otherwise RIP you.

Edit: Yeahhhh, I see you had a thread asking for a stock turbo that had no replies, and you're asking about a silicon joiner which means it's not a stock one you're putting in. Thus my sleuthing concludes, based on the inexperienced nature of this thread, that you got an ebay cheapie turbo.

Mate, honestly and I hate to break it to you, pull it all out and start again. You now need to port that wastegate if you want any chance at boost control on that kind of turbo.

I'm speaking from experience. Ignore at your peril.

Edited September 24, 2017 by inmaniac

[sonicz]

Inmaniac, Yea that tool is gold. But hard to find in 23mm.

I went to supercheap in Warick farm, all they had was heater hoses. I went to repco and autobarn in gregorys hill. I spoke to at least 2 people there. One of the guys tried to find me power steering hoses etc but nadda. All they had was heater hoses...Nothing else. Would I lie to you? Oh and they had huge blue show off silicone hoses for like inter cooler piping and that, but none in the size i needed.

We got the car of the soft grass and onto some hard stuff. It can be jacked up now! I also have plenty of tools at my disposal.

 

Ref to wastegate I have no idea what you are talking about tbh. You mean transfer the wastegate off the old turbo to the new one? Why?

Your deduction skills are spot on. I went to see two stock turbos drove across all of sydney and they both ended up having loads of shaft play in and out. So I just thought F it im sick of this and Ive heard of people having good results with ebay stuff so I bought the best looking bolt on stock replacement I could find off ebay.

But I dont know any of this wastegate porting please elaborate? I'm not ignoring any of this just trying to get away with something if it has a good chance of working out ok because the more I work on the car the more chance i breaks something, and I may be working alone now. For example I scratched the fudge out of the turbo mating surface on the 4 bolts sticking out of the exhaust manifold trying to get it on. Its not going to affect anything cos its superficial but still stuff like that I'm worried about.

Depending on what yo say, to transfer wastegate over i will have to take turbo off again so I guess I can file down the pipe and at least fit the bolt back on...yay for having to take it out again and put it in again. I even used hi temp gasket maker on the surfaces...

Edited September 24, 2017 by sonicz

[inmaniac]

56 minutes ago, sonicz said:

I went to supercheap in Warick farm, all they had was heater hoses. I went to repco and autobarn in gregorys hill. I spoke to at least 2 people there. One of the guys tried to find me power steering hoses etc but nadda. All they had was heater hoses...Nothing else. Would I lie to you? Oh and they had huge blue show off silicone hoses for like inter cooler piping and that, but none in the size i needed.

Well that sucks. Maybe a specific hose place is next on your list of places to visit?

56 minutes ago, sonicz said:

But I dont know any of this wastegate porting please elaborate? I'm not ignoring any of this just trying to get away with something if it has a good chance of working out ok because the more I work on the car the more chance i breaks something, and I may be working alone now. For example I scratched the fudge out of the turbo mating surface on the 4 bolts sticking out of the exhaust manifold trying to get it on. Its not going to affect anything cos its superficial but still stuff like that I'm worried about.

Depending on what yo say, to transfer wastegate over i will have to take turbo off again so I guess I can file down the pipe and at least fit the bolt back on...yay for having to take it out again and put it in again. I even used hi temp gasket maker on the surfaces...

Mate... Not being a dick, but you're out of your depth and needed to do more research before you dove into this. Firstly, scratching the surface I'm assuming won't be that bad, but depending on how big of a gouge you took, it may not be great and you may have a small leak. You probably used a new gasket hopefully but the ones that come in ebay kits are pretty sh!t. Again, I know.

The wastegate is not about the actuator, it is about the size of the flapper and the wastegate hole on those ebay (specifically Maxpeedingrods) turbos. You will NOT be able to control boost with those things as the hole is >tiny< and it can't flow enough air. If you have not ported it (which you clearly haven't) it needs to be done. Do it now while you are still fiddling. Don't complain, don't grumble, you need to do it. This is the bed you've made with an ebay turbo now you have to sleep in it  Also, you shouldn't need gasket maker if you're using correct gaskets!

57 minutes ago, sonicz said:

So I bought the best looking bolt on stock replacement I could find off ebay.

If you bought Maxpeedingrods, you bought the cheapest* not nicest looking  No shame in that, I've been there, which is why I'm telling you you need to listen to my advice.

[inmaniac]

I'm gonna bet 10:1 that your new turbo looked like the first 2 pics here, right?

Well compare that wastegate flapper hole size in pic 3 (ebay turbo) to the one in the 4th pic (my Hypergear high flow)

You need to port this hole if you have any chance of really using that turbo.