A few questions for my S1 Stagea

[jvtji]

S1 Stagea AWD Auto RB25DET

Current mod wishlist right now:

• Kinugawa TD06SL2-25G/HyperGear ATR45SAT Internally Gated
• GFB Respons Bov
• JustJap Intercooler Kit
• Walbro 255/Bosch 040
• Splitfire Coils
• 1000cc
• Z32 AFM
• 3inch zorst

Are there any news with ECU tuning? From forum research, it's probably best to go with Greddy eManage. Are PowerFC possible now with autos?

Also, how much output am I to expect from this setup? My goal right now is 200 awkw. Possibly 250awkw but I've heard the auto trans might need some work after 200awkw.

Edited August 20, 2019 by jvtji
1000cc added to the list.

[GTSBoy]

200rwkW is possible (just) without a turbo upgrade. The turbos you have mentioned are good for >250 and will be wasted at ~200.

There are better, more modern, less noisy pumps these days. Mostly Walbros still. Worth considering other options.

If you're buying 1000cc injectors, make sure that they are really good ones. You won't be needing that much capacity for your power targets, but you will need good ECU control over low pulsewidths. There are bad choices of injectors out there with poor matching, poor low pulsewidth spray patterns, etc.

[jvtji]

1 hour ago, GTSBoy said:

200rwkW is possible (just) without a turbo upgrade. The turbos you have mentioned are good for >250 and will be wasted at ~200.

There are better, more modern, less noisy pumps these days. Mostly Walbros still. Worth considering other options.

If you're buying 1000cc injectors, make sure that they are really good ones. You won't be needing that much capacity for your power targets, but you will need good ECU control over low pulsewidths. There are bad choices of injectors out there with poor matching, poor low pulsewidth spray patterns, etc.

Any ECU you can recommend ?

I have 1000cc injectors ready to be installed already. Unsure of the brand as I bought it off a mutual friend who ended up selling his skyline. Time will tell I guess with how these injectors perform.

[GTSBoy]

I have no idea what works with the stupid Stagea auto situation.

[KiwiRS4T]

E Manage is a very second rate solution. I wasted many dollars on parts and tuners trying piggy back options. You should resign yourself to the fact that you will end up wanting a manual box and a Link computer. If you realise that's where you are going to end up the sensible thing would be to do the manual conversion first. The better solution would be to find a manual S2 instead but that's probably not going to happen as they are pretty rare.

[mloo]

@KiwiRS4T - how does the Nistune ECU compare to Link's? 

[GTSBoy]

I don't think you can Nistune an S1 Stagea ECU. Same-ish as R33, no?

[mloo]

1 hour ago, GTSBoy said:

I don't think you can Nistune an S1 Stagea ECU. Same-ish as R33, no?

Oh whoops - forgot to clarify I've got an S2 Stagea with a NEO RB

[GTSBoy]

In that case.....Nistune is great. Runs an RB properly. There are some extra hurdles to jump sometimes, particularly with Neos, because the factory ECU started to get loaded up with extra sensors and protections that need to be worked around. A Link, or any equivalent aftermarket ECU will be able to do things that you just can't do with Nistune, like run auxiliary shit, extra boost control function, etc etc. By the same token, the Nissan ECU can penetrate the noise you get in the Nissan CAS signal far better than Haltechs can - because Nissan are responsible for both halves of the system and put a lot of effort into filtering the noise. Effort that Haltech probably haven't, because Haltech have to make their stuff work with a zillion CAS types. And where I know Haltech is not as good in that area, it is fair to assume that others, like Link, might suffer compared to the stocker. There's compromises to the left and to the right, regardless of which path you choose.

[jvtji]

I spoke to a shop yesterday and was told that Haltech's on their final stage of developing a software for their Elite Series that can control an Auto Tran. This is very good news to me as I want to keep the auto for the time being while saving up for a manual conversion. No ETA for software release so far.

[mosquitocoils]

On 8/21/2019 at 8:35 PM, jvtji said:

I spoke to a shop yesterday and was told that Haltech's on their final stage of developing a software for their Elite Series that can control an Auto Tran. This is very good news to me as I want to keep the auto for the time being while saving up for a manual conversion. No ETA for software release so far.

 

Damn that would be great news. Currently in the process of starting a parts list for my new S1 and a Haltech Elite was the highest priority but from all my reading and researching, the auto trans keeps getting in the way. 

[KiwiRS4T]

If you modify the car to any extent the auto will die so manual conversion should be a priority ahead of an aftermarket computer. If you stick a Haltech in your stock S1 you won't even notice any advantage for your $3000+ expenditure (and I am sceptical that it will happen any time soon).

[zoomzoom]

On 8/21/2019 at 8:35 PM, jvtji said:

I spoke to a shop yesterday and was told that Haltech's on their final stage of developing a software for their Elite Series that can control an Auto Tran. This is very good news to me as I want to keep the auto for the time being while saving up for a manual conversion. No ETA for software release so far.

A little late to the party, but you probably haven't made a move on any option yet, so  here's a few things to keep in mind:

The short answer is that the S1 stagea can be run with a standalone ECU piggybacked to the standard ECU no problem. The longer answer is that it does require supporting mods, and quite a few tweaks to work well.

Be mindful if you really want to, or can, reinvent the wheel here. By which I mean an aftermarket ECU will require you to be able to tweak a whole host of trim tables in varying conditions (eg cold start maps, coolant temp trims, air temp trims, transient throttle conditions etc). You are also talking about now having to remap stock auto trans maps as well (including line pressure maps, which could result in the destruction of the clutches if done improperly). You are setting yourself a mammoth task.

The auto trans requires a few mods to work well with an aftermarket ECU (or even just power increases):

• You will need a modified valve body - I use the MV auto shift kit.
• Increased resistance value for the line pressure dropping solenoid resistor. Standard is 15R or something, I run a 2-step system with 25R at low loads to keep shifts smooth, then 4.7k above about 130kpa MAP to prevent any slipping since the standard ECU doesn't expect the torque my engine can produce at a given throttle opening. A 2-step system like mine requires an aftermarket ECU with programmable outputs.
• If you go with an aftermarket ECU, you will lose the ignition retarding logic when the auto shifts under heavy load. Although the shift kit partially addresses the issue by speeding up the shifts, the harshness and loading on the clutches, especially on the 1-2 shift is unacceptable for both comfort and mechanical sympathy/reliability. So far I think I'm the only one to implement a solution for this with an aftermarket ECU. I made a microcontroller based piggyback to monitor the auto trans shifts and communicate with my ECU, in conjunction with negative RPM rate ignition retarding which is a function already built into the ECU.

On the engine side of things, there's tons of opinions on RB25 mods, but for stagea specific opinions, don't go a for a big turbo. I run the hypergear RB25 high flow 21U unit, and I wouldn't want any bigger, in fact I'd go a bit smaller. You'll want the response and early spool rpm for the weight of the stagea, and the auto trans.

As soon as possible get a wideband exhaust sensor. Otherwise you're flying blind with AF ratios. It's tricky because you'll probably need to put the turbo on first, then get an exhaust made for it, then weld the bung on for the wideband.

Only you can judge whether you're willing to try all this yourself. You can't rely on a tuner to do a full map. I paid a fair amount to a reputable tuner for a full tune and looking back at it, it's laughably bad. I had to retune nearly all the map to make all the lower load/rpm an improvement over stock. Also keep in mind what I mentioned about coolant temp enrichments for winter, cold start maps etc..... the list goes on.

I have to disagree with Kiwi that the auto trans is guaranteed to die when power is upped to any extent though. I've been running 200awkw for 5 years now. It's not huge numbers, but it's still a considerable increase over stock. I'm more concerned about what effect my early shitty tune had on the engine more than anything. But I've spent those 5 years constantly tweaking things and working on the ECU maps to try different things. Maybe that's part of the fun for me, but keep in mind if that's really the end goal for you.