Problem with 5th after manual swap on R32 GTS4

[joshuaho96]

13 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

Well I only drove it two or 3 times likes that if I recall correctly. I was getting together a big sort of maintenence package together. With new plugs and coils and filters. So all that stuff I know when it was last changed. And getting a compression tester and such. 

It only takes one lean-out on boost to trash a piston engine. With rotary engines it's more like a single knock event. 

[MBS206]

On 2/14/2024 at 9:09 PM, GTSBoy said:

You ran it lean under boost. It could be f**ked.

And ran it super rich at idle, so dumping fuel out the exhaust most likely.

Lean under boost on the highway for 10+ mins... No wonder the exhaust heat and CEL came on... Likely was detonating badly, plus running super hot...

[TheOrangeSkittle]

On 2/17/2024 at 8:41 PM, MBS206 said:

And ran it super rich at idle, so dumping fuel out the exhaust most likely.

Lean under boost on the highway for 10+ mins... No wonder the exhaust heat and CEL came on... Likely was detonating badly, plus running super hot...

Wouldn't you notice if it was doing that though? It didn't sputter or make any bad sounds. Sounded perfectly smooth just oddly felt like it was lacking power. Past 4k. 

[GTSBoy]

6 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

Wouldn't you notice if it was doing that though?

 

6 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

oddly felt like it was lacking power. Past 4k.

 

[r32-25t]

don’t worry about it, if it feels fine then it’ll be fine. If it feels shit then go looking for problems 

[MBS206]

2 hours ago, r32-25t said:

don’t worry about it, if it feels fine then it’ll be fine. If it feels shit then go looking for problems 

Your motor felt fine though didn't it?
Water on the floor isn't a feeling

[TheOrangeSkittle]

2 hours ago, MBS206 said:

Your motor felt fine though didn't it?
Water on the floor isn't a feeling

Well It's the only rb I've had and only turbocharged engine I've had.  I don't really have anything to compare it to. Ran and felt fine before so I figured the 5th thing was just a weird kink due to the gtr box since there's few discussions regarding the gts4 and converting it and anu issues after. I did pull the plugs, and none are melted but they all have a white haze to them except one.  I assume that being the effects of them being lean. The 1 looked normal and had a blackish brown bottom. But all of its on hold now since one of my igniton coil plugs just.. ehhh fell apart into like 30 pieces after plugging it back in and gotta wait to get a new harness for it, I know they're old and brittle but I barely even touched the thing.  I've yet to get a boroscope. 

 I do appreciate your guys advice I'm just kinda a big noob to all this sorry. 

[r32-25t]

5 hours ago, MBS206 said:

Your motor felt fine though didn't it?
Water on the floor isn't a feeling

If it wasn’t for the sump leaking it would have got tuned 

[joshuaho96]

6 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

Well It's the only rb I've had and only turbocharged engine I've had.  I don't really have anything to compare it to. Ran and felt fine before so I figured the 5th thing was just a weird kink due to the gtr box since there's few discussions regarding the gts4 and converting it and anu issues after. I did pull the plugs, and none are melted but they all have a white haze to them except one.  I assume that being the effects of them being lean. The 1 looked normal and had a blackish brown bottom. But all of its on hold now since one of my igniton coil plugs just.. ehhh fell apart into like 30 pieces after plugging it back in and gotta wait to get a new harness for it, I know they're old and brittle but I barely even touched the thing.  I've yet to get a boroscope. 

 I do appreciate your guys advice I'm just kinda a big noob to all this sorry. 

https://www.3si.org/threads/crusty-white-balls-on-spark-plugs.666041/

If you see little bits of aluminum on the plugs that's a detonation sign. They don't need to melt for there to be a problem.

Coil harnesses disintegrating is normal. Welcome to owning these cars. A new one will last decades done right.

Run a compression test and see if they're all ok. If so just keep running it.

[morboost]

A stock manual rb20det r32 in good condition should feel as quick as a fox body 5.0 not a corolla. Sounds like you car makes no power, pull the cat - is it blocked is the turbine wheel in it, rev the engine with the cat off is it making turbo noises, if thats all good, check the intake pipes try and find the rag left in it check them all intercooler, turbo inlet, airbox no rags -  all good. Check fuel side replace fuel filter - all good, Now its time to do a leak down test and compression test, this is where you enter the pain of rb ownership welcome to the fu*king show.

 

Edited February 23, 2024 by morboost
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[TheOrangeSkittle]

On 2/23/2024 at 3:30 AM, morboost said:

A stock manual rb20det r32 in good condition should feel as quick as a fox body 5.0 not a corolla. Sounds like you car makes no power, pull the cat - is it blocked is the turbine wheel in it, rev the engine with the cat off is it making turbo noises, if thats all good, check the intake pipes try and find the rag left in it check them all intercooler, turbo inlet, airbox no rags -  all good. Check fuel side replace fuel filter - all good, Now its time to do a leak down test and compression test, this is where you enter the pain of rb ownership welcome to the fu*king show.

 

It makes all the turbo noises and what not.    Was going to just get new splitfire coils if the compression is good. It's got all the old heat cycled parts still on it. And was gunna do a leak down test.    Like I said it makes no bad noises at all and sounds very smooth. Runs smooth. Boost comes on and it pulls but I suppose it's not pulling as much as it could. It completely falls on its face in fifth but after redoing that vacuum line to the fpr it significantly improved and doesn't totally die but now just feels like it's fighting a losing battle to maintain speed.    I didn't see anything on the plugs except they had white on them. One plug looked completely normal though.      I was considering if the compression is good (waiting till I get the harness so I can do a cold and warm test)  doing the smart coil conversion and eliminate the ignitor, since it seems it'd be about the same price if I ever had to replace the ignitor for any reason and if I'm already getting new coils.  

[morboost]

what sizes tyres (tires) do you have on it

[TheOrangeSkittle]

On 2/28/2024 at 5:55 AM, morboost said:

what sizes tyres (tires) do you have on it

I checked the compression finally. And while COLD with the throttle wide open, unplugged the CAS and took out all the spark plugs,

#1 125PSI

#2 123PSI

#3 107PSI

#4 120PSI

#5 127PSI

#6 104PSI

 

So I figure that's not too good is it? Judging from what I've read online for an rb20det. 

 

As for the tires I'll have to check sometime, kept them the same size though as when I got the car. 

Edited March 3, 2024 by TheOrangeSkittle

[joshuaho96]

19 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

I checked the compression finally. And while COLD with the throttle wide open, unplugged the CAS and took out all the spark plugs,

#1 125PSI

#2 123PSI

#3 107PSI

#4 120PSI

#5 127PSI

#6 104PSI

 

So I figure that's not too good is it? Judging from what I've read online for an rb20det. 

 

As for the tires I'll have to check sometime, kept them the same size though as when I got the car. 

I would retest to be sure. A low battery or letting one cylinder get more compression strokes will affect results noticeably. If a retest shows those numbers are real I would leakdown test and borescope the low cylinders to figure out what happened. The air leak location will tell you. If it’s crankcase/PCV you probably need to pull the engine. It’s possible to get low overall pressure for whatever reason but the relative proportion of 3 and 6 to the others is cause for concern. 

[TheOrangeSkittle]

I tested them all a couple times, haven't tested it warm or wet though. The only seemingly really weird thing was the cylinders plug closest to the dash was pitch black nearly.  Doesn't smoke out of the exhaust or anything. 

 

Also sorry everyone for the very late response. Got busy with work and all and didn't get around to fooling with the car for awhile. 

But an update! I figured out the cause of the lean condition, my intercooler had at some point exploded or something. It's clearly separated in a spot with black oily buildup around the leak, and multiple leaks in various vacuum lines. I've replaced it and the vacuum lines, and gotten new clamps and there are 0 leaks now after doing a couple smoke tests.

 

The car now runs significantly better and the exhaust doesn't overheat anymore. I still have the main problem though where the engine feels like I'm lugging it around sub 3500rpm in any gear besides 1st, 2nd It's less noticeable but 3rd anything under 3.5k and I need to downshift or the engine is clearly struggling when trying to accelerate at all, 4th is the exact same, sub 3.5k engine won't accelerate and its hard to bring it back up to speed, 5th gear doesn't feel like the car is going to straight up fall apart now but it still can't pull 5th. It slowly loses speed and rpm and ANY gas I give I can feel the shakes from the engine and it slowly dying. If I ever so lightly give it gas it will slowly and nicely decel till around 2k rpm instead of lugging. But it cannot accelerate at all or maintain speed.

 

If I go from first gear at 5 or 6krpm and then shift to second it also feels like it's struggling to make power till above 3krpm if trying to accelerate but I can cruise around parking lots at around 1-2krpm just fine in 2nd. It's just when accelerating hard it and changing gear you really notice it die down.  But even if you shift at way lower rpms it does the same thing till somewhere above 3k. 

As far as I'm aware it's got r32 gtr transmission gear ratios with gts4 diffs.

The tire size is 205/55r16 91h

Above 3500rpm the car pulls and runs and drives quite normally and the power from engine sounds and feels very smooth.  It's perfectly driveable at above 3.5krpm but I drive on the highway alot for work and it gets really bad gas mileage in 4th at 4.4krpm. Not that I'm looking for great gas mileage with such a car, just I'm sure being at around 3krpm would be significantly better for it. 

 

Have appreciated all your guys help. I do understand the engine may just be f**ked from running with a boost leak though. 

 

One final thing I'd like to add is I'm only shifting so high in the rpm range is because if I don't I will feel the engine lugging bad with 0 power in lower rpms, pretty much anytime off boost trying to accelerate it feels really bad.  Also when I say 3500 rpm I don't mean exactly. Just around there. 

Edited April 20, 2024 by TheOrangeSkittle

[GTSBoy]

43 minutes ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

I do understand the engine may just be f**ked from running with a boost leak though. 

I would absolutely be starting with this idea over all other possibilities.

It sounds f**ked.

[joshuaho96]

8 hours ago, TheOrangeSkittle said:

I tested them all a couple times, haven't tested it warm or wet though. The only seemingly really weird thing was the cylinders plug closest to the dash was pitch black nearly.  Doesn't smoke out of the exhaust or anything. 

 

Also sorry everyone for the very late response. Got busy with work and all and didn't get around to fooling with the car for awhile. 

But an update! I figured out the cause of the lean condition, my intercooler had at some point exploded or something. It's clearly separated in a spot with black oily buildup around the leak, and multiple leaks in various vacuum lines. I've replaced it and the vacuum lines, and gotten new clamps and there are 0 leaks now after doing a couple smoke tests.

 

The car now runs significantly better and the exhaust doesn't overheat anymore. I still have the main problem though where the engine feels like I'm lugging it around sub 3500rpm in any gear besides 1st, 2nd It's less noticeable but 3rd anything under 3.5k and I need to downshift or the engine is clearly struggling when trying to accelerate at all, 4th is the exact same, sub 3.5k engine won't accelerate and its hard to bring it back up to speed, 5th gear doesn't feel like the car is going to straight up fall apart now but it still can't pull 5th. It slowly loses speed and rpm and ANY gas I give I can feel the shakes from the engine and it slowly dying. If I ever so lightly give it gas it will slowly and nicely decel till around 2k rpm instead of lugging. But it cannot accelerate at all or maintain speed.

 

If I go from first gear at 5 or 6krpm and then shift to second it also feels like it's struggling to make power till above 3krpm if trying to accelerate but I can cruise around parking lots at around 1-2krpm just fine in 2nd. It's just when accelerating hard it and changing gear you really notice it die down.  But even if you shift at way lower rpms it does the same thing till somewhere above 3k. 

As far as I'm aware it's got r32 gtr transmission gear ratios with gts4 diffs.

The tire size is 205/55r16 91h

Above 3500rpm the car pulls and runs and drives quite normally and the power from engine sounds and feels very smooth.  It's perfectly driveable at above 3.5krpm but I drive on the highway alot for work and it gets really bad gas mileage in 4th at 4.4krpm. Not that I'm looking for great gas mileage with such a car, just I'm sure being at around 3krpm would be significantly better for it. 

 

Have appreciated all your guys help. I do understand the engine may just be f**ked from running with a boost leak though. 

 

One final thing I'd like to add is I'm only shifting so high in the rpm range is because if I don't I will feel the engine lugging bad with 0 power in lower rpms, pretty much anytime off boost trying to accelerate it feels really bad.  Also when I say 3500 rpm I don't mean exactly. Just around there. 

Most likely your engine is toast, but also the R32 GTR has different ratios than the GTS4. In 5th it's basically the same, it's mostly 1st through 3rd that change. Stop trying to do WOT pulls before you make the engine entirely unsalvageable. Do a leakdown test and/or borescope the cylinders first. And a boost leak can overspeed a turbo. Make sure the turbo actually functions as intended.

Edited April 20, 2024 by joshuaho96