Stagea Suspension

[Terminal]

While i was shopping for my stagea, one of the dealers said that R34 springs bolt straight in. since you guys have all been talking about R33 GTR/GTST spring and shocks i was wondering if this guy might have been talking out his arse? i'm just asking because i want to get my stagea lowered and new shocks and i don't want to get the wrong stuff

[Sydneykid]

thanks would aprecaite that.  If anyone finds out required spring rates looks like afew of us are keen for the information

 I'm confused though how my old factory tired shocks didn't seem to have the problem as severe as the replacement KYB's.  They have confirmed that the factory and R33 GTR ones are identical lengths in every aspect though, so it's rulling out a difference in the body of the shock.  Springs are my next port of call, seeing as I really do not know the history of the chosen springs, (Blue coloured with Type R written on them)  all I know is they are from Japan.  For all I know they came off a Toyota Starlet

Let me make sure I have this right;

1. It was OK with standard spring and shocks, not bottoming out on the bump stops

2. Put in lowered (unkown) springs with the standard shocks and it still didn't bottom out on the bump tops. The standard shocks didn't have enough dampening though

3. Put in brand new R33 GTR KYB shocks with the same lowered springs and it now bottoms out on the bump stops

4. Checked the dimension of the KYB's and they are the same as the standard shocks.

Have I got it right?

[Happymeal]

You have it bang on the money SydneyKid. baffling isn't it, defies logic almost! I only undertook the last step in that sequence, the step involved with changing the strut to the KYB edition. Spring was the same one used with each strut (old factory and new KYB). Hitting the stop. Have now changed the bump stop over to a version that is slightly shorter and I have travel back, but not a lot. Still hits bump stops on occasion, but better. Think I should really shop for springs, GTR33 lowering ones. For all I know the springs in there have been chosen by some backyard Japanese cowboy for the Stagea task at hand and are not really up to the mark. replacing with GTR33 lowering springs may in fact increase the ride height in the shock, and free up some more travel. Car is a really nice height, yet still very legal. Wouldn't want to go too much higher, but I'm also not about to sacrifice my cars ride comfort and safety, to have it look too low. Bit frustrated that no one I can find to talk to has definite answers to give me so almost everything we try is hit and miss or experimental. A couple of suppliers keep trying to get me into coilovers, which I have been tempted by, due to a really attractive price deal/break. But a mate of mine has shone the torch of reality on the subject for me, and I really would not use a coilover to it's full advantage for the sort of use my car would be subjected too. It's not doing track time, or heavy fast road driving. The suspension would be setup once and stay setup. having the adjustiblity for the cost involved doesn't really suit me. So I think getting the right shock/spring setup right suits me better.

Gained heaps of information from here though, which has helped in my plight beyond measure. It's been easier to weed out the suppliers who really were out of their depth in regard to Stagea's due to their lack of knowledge, from the ones who were on the right track. The crowd I got my KYB's from have been exceptiionally helpful, and really good.

Next question: GTR R33 springs, have heard people drop their cars on GTR super lows. How many differnt height settings are available for the GTR's standard, low and super low? probably keen on a low, rather than super low.

[Gary1]

I went for the GTR low heavy duty springs they are good. I had to shorten the bunp stop a little but it hasn't hit since. The car is very stiff and handles well but i think that has more to do with shocks rather than springs.

Cheers

Gary

[Sydneykid]

Hi HappyMeal, the difficulties you are describing is exactly the reason I have chosen to stick with the standard springs and take a little height out by adjusting the lower spring seat circlip on the Bilsteins. The larger stabiliser bars will prevent the standard spring rate from being a problem for travel or roll.

I have encounterd the problem with GTR travel a number times, people tend to have them too low. But I have found one case where GTST shocks were used in the front instead of GTR, the GTST shock is 15 mm longer than a GTR and that was enough to cause it to bottom out the bump stops regularly. I know that yours have been compared to what came out of the Stagea, but I am wondering whether the KYB are in fact GTST length. I have the respective GTR/GTST lengths somewhere, I will post them up when I find them:cheers:

[GTR-Ben]

Glad to hear they are trying to get to the bottom of it for you Happymeal, as you can see I have been looking here as much as I can also, as no one down here knows anything about the Stagea.

I will be installing a GTR engine in one soon, plus this information, I will know a bit about them.

The numbers/lengths etc all match up to the KYB part numbers which were the FRONT for the R33 GTR. NFS9058. The R33 GTS-T part number is NFS9053.

Wish I could see them for myself.. I'm sure they will get to the bottom of it though.

Ben

[Jay95R33]

SK - have you installed the GTR swaybars in your Stagea yet ? Just wondering how you went.

Cheers

J

[Sydneykid]

SK - have you installed the GTR swaybars in your Stagea yet ?  Just wondering how you went.

Cheers

J

Hi J, unfortunately not yet, Star Track Express still has them, since Friday :wassup:

[Jay95R33]

Damn

I'll be interested to see how they go when you put them on.

Could be a cheap upgrade.

J

[mcnamg]

when you do get around to doing them sk you should take a few piccies so we can all see how its done

[FaithStalker]

Pleasde feel free to delete this post if its in the wrong place, but as we're talking suspension etc, anyone get the camber/toe/castor and any other alignment settings for the Stagea ? I assume they would be the same across the C34 range?

Back in the UK when I got my Jap Supra I got a 4wheel laser alignment done and could not believe the difference in handling it made, superb at all speeds...

Regards

[Sydneykid]

Pleasde feel free to delete this post if its in the wrong place, but as we're talking suspension etc, anyone get the camber/toe/castor and any other alignment settings for the Stagea ? I assume they would be the same across the C34 range?

Back in the UK when I got my Jap Supra I got a 4wheel laser alignment done and could not believe the difference in handling it made, superb at all speeds...

Regards

I have no idea what the standard settings are but this is what mine will be set at.

Front toe = zero

Rear toe = zero

Front camber = 1 degree negative

Front caster = as much as I can get, but I know it won't be enough

I will run a little more caster on the left (~0.25 degree) to stop the drift due to road camber.

Rear camber = 0.5 degree negative

Hope that helps:cheers:

[burkey22]

Is it O.K. to just fit lowered springs to the standard shocks? I think I remember reading somewhere that you shouldn't do it. I'm quite happy with how it handles I'd just like it to ride a little lower. How long do the stock shocks normally last? My car has only done 35000ks.

[michaeljquinn]

Is it O.K. to just fit lowered springs to the standard shocks? I think I remember reading somewhere that you shouldn't do it. I'm quite happy with how it handles I'd just like it to ride a little lower. How long do the stock shocks normally last? My car has only done 35000ks.

1 - Depends on how much, haven't done this to my stagea yet, but had a VR4 (loved that car!!), but when I got it, the prev owner had lowered it about 50 mm (around 2 inch) by cutting the springs (dont know how he got a roadworthy) and it was diabolical. The poor shocks had no hope of controlling the rebound. I then spent about 3K on full whiteline kit and konis - it was great then. But I wouldn't get konis again though, I had the car for 100,000 K and had the konis rebuilt 3 times ( and no rallying).

2 - My stag has 65K on it and the shocks are gone !!.

3 - We need to put together a recommendation, ie

- rollbars

Fronts - adjustable whiteline - ?? part number

Rear - adjustable whiteline - ?? part number

F&R alignment settings here

- shocks

Front Bilstein part number ?? (SK can you nominate a good supplier)

Rears Bilstein

F&R alignment settings here (if any different to previous)

- springs

Front Kings part number ??

Rear Kings part number ??

Definately F&R alignment here (camber/castor kits as well??)

Would be great to put this info into a central area

cheers

[Sydneykid]

Hi Guys, fitted the stabiliser bars to the Stagea yesterday and, as promised, I took a few photos. All up it took about 3 hours but taking photos adds to the time a lot, I reckon I could do it in under 2 hours without stopping. Where I can remember, I have included the tools (sizes) required at each step.

These are the part numbers I used for a 24 mm adjustable front and 22 mm adjustable rear.

B= Bar

N = Nissan

F = Front

R = Rear

#'s = the next number available

X = Extra Heavy Duty

XX = Extra Extra Heavy Duty

No X = Heavy Duty

Z = Adjustable

[Sydneykid]

I started at the rear. First job undo the links at the both ends of the std bar, using a 10 mm socket at the top and a 10 mm ring spanner on the bottom.

You have to remove the link completely as the Whiteline rear bar comes with its own link. Which you assemble like this, note the white grease on all surfaces where the polyurethane touches metal (it'll squeek like crazy if you don't), It has a crush tube inside the polurethane bushes, so you just tighten it up (14mm and 15mm);

Next you remove the std D brackets (14mm socket), loosen but leave the rear bolt in, it gives you somewhere to hang the bracket (it's slotted) when you put the Whiteline bar on.

Undo the LHS D bracket first as it goes over the exhaust pipe and that will hold it up while you undo the RHS D bracket;

Comparison of the bars (the standard one is hollow), note that the Whilteline bar is on its softest setting (the hole furthest out on the arm;

Refitting is the reverse, slot the bar over the exhaust pipe (it's a wiggle), then do up the RHS D bracket while the exhaust pipe holds up the LHS. Then do the LHS D bracket and both of the links. The nylock nut (17mm) goes on the top. Tighten up until the polyurethane bushes expand out to the same size as the cup washers, don't tightem them so much they bulge. If you have a large exhaust system you may have to fit the link on the LHS after you have squeezed the bar past the exhaust.

[Sydneykid]

The front looks a little trickier than the rear but it isn't, you just have to remove the undetray first. It has lots of bolts around the front and down the sides, 12 of them I think (10mm socket);

Then you need to undo the std links, only where they attach to the bar as the Whiteline bar uses the standard links (14mm ring and 14 mm open ended spanner);

Once you have undone the links, then its time for the D brackets, there is a bolt at the front (14mm socket);

And you get at the nut at the rear (14 mm socket and medium extension), it is a bit hidden up above the radius rod bush;

This is comparison of the bars, note the links are still on the Stagea

Once again you simply reverse the process for fitting the Whiteline bar, this one I put on the highest rate (hole furthest in on the arm). Don't forget to grease inside the polyurethane D bushes, they touch metal as well.

Put the undertray back on and you are finished.

Hope that helps:cheers:

[Sydneykid]

After I fiited up the bars I did about 100k's driving around Sydney, in Saturday traffic mostly. As you may have noted from the above, I set the rear bar on full soft and the front bar on full hard. That was my guess, as the rear bar was a pretty big upgrade going from a 19mm hollow bar to a 22mm solid bar (more than 155% increase in roll stiffness), so I figured softest setting would be a good place to start. On the other hand the front bar upgrade was pretty mild, going from a 22mm solid bar to a 24mm (42% increase in roll stiffness) solid bar, so I went for the hardest setting.

The first thing you notice is how much the rear roll has been reduced, the Stagea no longer diagonally leans over onto the outside front wheel through the corner. The tyre squeel is almost gone at sane speeds (double the posted). In addition the initial turn in is greatly improved, as soon as you turn the wheel, it points. It still needs more caster though as the feel is not enough for me. The ride is hardly affected, it still absorbs bumps very well, it just doesn't rock from side to side like it used to. The big improvement is when going left and then right quickly, the change of direction speed and stability are greatly improved.

It doesn't show up how bad the worn out std shocks are, well not as much as I thought. But it still needs shocks real bad, that's the next task. A set of Bilsteins and machine the extra circlip grooves to get the height right. That'll be in a following installment of Stagea Suspension.

Hope you all got something out of this:cheers:

[mcnamg]

1 - Depends on how much, haven't done this to my stagea yet, but had a VR4 (loved that car!!), but when I got it, the prev owner had lowered it about 50 mm (around 2 inch) by cutting the springs (dont know how he got a roadworthy) and it was diabolical.  The poor shocks had no hope of controlling the rebound.  I then spent about 3K on full whiteline kit and konis - it was great then.  But I wouldn't get konis again though, I had the car for 100,000 K and had the konis rebuilt 3 times ( and no rallying).

2 - My stag has 65K on it and the shocks are gone !!.

3 - We need to put together a recommendation, ie

     - rollbars  

              Fronts - adjustable whiteline - ?? part number

              Rear    - adjustable whiteline  -  ?? part number

              F&R alignment settings here

    - shocks  

              Front  Bilstein   part number ?? (SK can you nominate a good supplier)

              Rears Bilstein

       

              F&R alignment settings here (if any different to previous)

   - springs

             Front Kings   part number ??

             Rear Kings    part number ??

             Definately F&R alignment here (camber/castor kits as well??)

Would be great to put this info into a central area  

cheers

Buddy Just Give me a chance to finish my exams and I will add this and any other information you guys want me to add to the stageas specifications section. will post any other diy or tuning info anyone else wishes to contribute

Cheers

Glenn

[Jay95R33]

That's for the info SK. Great effort, and will help all of us.

J