Top RB20 Club... do you have over 260rwkw?

[Roy]

But inregards to the manifold maintaning the heat, you mean in the metal, or just heat in general?  As I've been told a number of times the more heat there pretty much the better, as hotter air is thinner, and therefore moves faster, and as its on the exaust side the heat isnt a major issuse (asuming cooling for everything else is up to scratch)

 

Well im hoping that the temp of the metal used for the manifold isnt the problem. The problem is the rapid cooling, heating etc. Also the differential temp from inside the metal to outside the metal will cause stresses inside the metal. Im thinking if the manifold metal is basically a uniform temperature accross its wall thickness then its going to be less prone to crack.

Thats from a temp standpoint, the fact that the turbo weight a couple of kilos, i want to support its weight off thehead so that when glowing red the manifold doesnt have to cope with a mechanical load. I think that a bigger drama then the temp of the manifold metal.

[Roy]

Ok so for the RB20 die hards, (the few of us:))

Thankfully Phillip Island wasnt too eventful. Firts session i popped the ECU fuse as the AVCR was still semi wired into the ECU and it was still playing up. So out with the wire cutters and completely removed the AVCR and some good old electrical tape and the fuse from the power windows saw me back out on the track.

It was a 32deg day so kept boost to 14.5-15psi which equates to about 215rwkws. Rev limit was a girly 7,000rpm. With the new exhaust housing the car isnt a whole lot different in 2nd gear, but in 3rd and 4th the car is transformed. It comes on boost so much earlier, you find yourself happy to be shifting at 6,500rpm.

I dont have a scanner so cant post up the chart, but a summary is:

OLD SETUP

Roy - TD06-20G , 10cm

rwkw-rpm

165 7,750

175 7,500

180 7,250

195 7,000

205 6,500

209 6,000

222 5,500

216 5,250

198 5,000

174 4,750

132 4,500

Boost came on strong at 4,500rpm, hits 17psi at 4,700rpm (approx) for an average power of 193 rwkws between 4,750-7,750rpm

NEW SETUP

Roy - TD06-20G , 8cm

rwkw-rpm

222 7,000

228 6,500

234 6,000

232 5,500

228 5,250

216 5,000

204 4,750

198 4,500

180 4,250

144 4,000

Boost comes on strong at 17psi at 4,000rpm

I am absolutely stoked. Thats an average power of 208rwkws between 4,000 -7,000rpm:thumbsup:

Considering i now only have to rev the car to 7,000rpm max, in the back of my mind im telling myself i can now run a little more boost:) Can have boost or revs, cant have both with a std motor.

So the only thing in the back of my mind now is how would a BB HKS 2835 compare to the TD06 setup? If all the fluff about HKS ball bearing turbo etc lives up to their promise you would be led to believe that it would perform even better:)

Im abosolutely stoked with how the car goes. Who says RB20s are laggy pieces of crap:)

[Sydneykid]

Way to go Roy, max power tells you nothing about an engine, average power is where you realy find out how well it is going to perform. So how was it on the track? Philip Island wasn't it? That should be around 190kph onto the straight and 250 kph top. Did you have to back off for the kink?

[Roy]

PI was awesome fun. Was a little gun shy about reliability, so wasnt going too hard. Also was trying different lines etc, still cant get onto the straight though:(

The one session where i had a go and every gear change was 7,000rpm just before the 7,100 limiter i did a 1:58.13 sec with a yellow flag out thru Woolshed/Lukey:( So i guess a 1:5-56 may have been on the cards?!?!?!?!

After that i think i have some gunk in my master cylinder from the whole Winton thing as the brake pedal is very soft and doesnt inspire confidence , so was just tolling around in the 2.00 flat practicing corner exits lines thru turn 2 and onto the straight etc:)

When i was having a go or chasing Ferni in his GTR i was coming onto the straight in 4th at 7,000rpm so was was having to grab 5th gear when the car started to drift wide on corner exit. So mid corner probably around 180km/h corner exit must have been close to 190km/h going on the revs and the diam of the Dunlops.

If i was serious i should wind up the limiter so that i can carry more speed in 4th and not upset the car by grabbing 5th in what i think is the scariest part of the track as im getting out of Lukey well enought that im braking before hooking into the final turn. Its a very busy part of the track:)

Down the straight with only running 1 bar and not being too brave on the brake for turn 1, i think my best top speed was 237 (Pfc recall)

As for kink before Honda, MY GOD.!! Early in the day when i was trying to hook it up out of turn 2 it was easy to go flat thru there. By the last session i was really struggling to stay flat as i was carrying so much extra speed. LOL, so its now actually a corner to me, not just a kink:)

So off to have a good look at the oil from the engine, new radiator as the top tank is a bit ordinary oafter PI, new Mater cylinder (i think?!) and ill be aback for a PIARC day, this time a little better prepared and a little more confident with the car and the track:thumbsup:

[Chris32]

Good to hear mate, at least its all in one piece still

Sounds like its miles better to drive, I would love to see what differance a set of Poncams makes to your setup (hint hint )

Funny though, I was reading a old Zoom mag on the weekend, it had a bit about Trust turbo's and there conclusion was that its the exhaust housings that make the power differance on Trust turbos, and matching the exhaust housing to the engine gives awesome results

Found one of those fuel pump strainers too, damn that took some finding! I will post the results of the pump swap after its done

Chris

[dangerous_daveo]

198 5,000  

174 4,750  

132 4,500

216 5,000  

204 4,750  

198 4,500

180 4,250

144 4,000

Boost comes on strong at 17psi at 4,000rpm  

I am absolutely stoked. Thats an average power of 208rwkws between 4,000 -7,000rpm:thumbsup:

Who says RB20s are laggy pieces of crap:)

Now that IS nice! Your 4000rpm power is my max

How did you find the torque curve going??? (sorry to keep going on and on about it, just I got a good 150-200kgs than most of you!)

So yeah, UP THE MIGHTY DATTO!!!

[Cubes]

Roy, your results.. I'm now thinking about trust turbos

[Roy]

Well to make sure i didnt have stars in my eyes i was throwing the keys at everybody on the weekend to get their thoughts, GTR owners, GTST with RB26 etc etc. And the general consensus was it had some damn respectable stomp:)

To some who love their low end grunt, the RB20 will never do it for them. But i have to say, it even surprises me how much midrange it has. It just pulls real hard and revs out so quickly...and the general consensus was it was one of the best sounding cars down the straight at Phillip island:thumbsup:

LOL...after being the RB20 Minister of Propoganda for so long, its great to see that the results are pretty stout, and make you really question the best avenue for going about getting 230-250rwkws into an R32 GTST chassis.

:)...im just very happy that all the agro has paid off with results better then i expected.

For now, stop spending money on the car, and get spending on Super Sprints:)

...oh nad provided the diff ratio is the same as an R32 GTST, then id say the extra weight wont really hurt too much. I suppose its what you want from the car, right now mine is fun, with a bit of luck it may pull a 12.8 at about 112-115mph:)

[dangerous_daveo]

There is no such thing as propoganda when it comes to RB20s, other than they are slow and bad! Thats rubbish!

[Cubes]

hehehe Roy, you definitely sound a happy chappy.

How were the knock readings?

[Sydneykid]

with a bit of luck it may pull a 12.8 at about 112-115mph:)

Oh Roy, that's a bit conservative/modest, the R34GTT with 185 rwkw average power did an 11.9 at 120 mph. And it's a damn site heavier than the R32GTST. You would need to soften up the rear though, track spec is way too hard for decent 60' traction.

[Slain]

pitchd: can you get some photos of the plenum chamber? after my power fc and avcr go in that was my though for next step, infinity throttle body and custom plenum.

[Sydneykid]

pitchd: can you get some photos of the plenum chamber? after my power fc and avcr go in that was my though for next step, infinity throttle body and custom plenum.

Have you done the cams? Adj Pulleys? Split dump? Airfilter? Heat Shield? Ambient air feed? Because all of those (if you haven't already done them) will give you a power increase, and the plenum won't.

[Roy]

Oh Roy, that's a bit conservative/modest, the R34GTT with 185 rwkw average power did an 11.9 at 120 mph.

Well i was going to go to the drags on Friday night, but a few ppls birthdays meant that drinks were the order of the night. So last week PI, and today it was a drift day at Calder.

Drifting was good fun and actually after plenty of spins i grew pretty comfortable throwing the car around... Thing was with the rev limit at 7,000rpm i was forever bouncing it off the rev limiter:(

Originally started with 15psi, then as night was upon us i wound 18psi into it. When i try to lose traction it does so pretty easy, plus the woeful 215/50/16s didnt help out back either:(

Sick of bouncing off the rev limiter i wound boost back to 15 psi and gave it i think and 8,500 or 8,600rpm rev limit fot the last 8-10 laps. And sadly the thing still head butted the rev limiter as soon as i pitched it sideways.

So i have had my taste of the drifting thing, and once i get my new bonnet and bar resprayed, oh and i better get that kiss in the guard fixed as well now:) i wont be doing any more drifitn...its just too hard on the car, including stoen chips etc on the car:(

The relevancee to this thread? Well the same sump of oil has done a day at Phillip Island then 8 days later a drift day...ill send the oil off for analysis and see how the oil comes back. Im hoping that will tell me a little about the bearing condition. The catch can and hosing is bone dry with absolutely no blow by:)

Engine has run in differing boost and rev levels , 215rwkws/15psi and 8,500 rev limit & 235rwks/18psi and 7,000rev limit at the drift day, and 215rwkws/15psi and 7,000 rev limit at the Phillip Island Sprint.

I have to say gut feeling is that a std RB20 making this much power wouldnt last too many drift days:( Especially with a PFc and only a fuel cut rev limit, the things water temps sored 8-10degress in 3 corners:(

The temps, knock levels etc all seemed so much more stabel and lower on a circuit. Low 30s, whereas today it got up to low to mid 40s:confused:

Im guessing its all the rev limiter work and combustion chamber temps climbing thru the roof?!?!?!?!

[predator]

Do you still have a stock radiator Roy?

I am unsure how the stock rb20 one even stops the car from blowing up in any form of Australian heat. Even my (current) stocker had trouble keep the temps down after just 5 lap stretches the other day..

[dangerous_daveo]

Also would PI be cooler than Calder??? And remember drift would be on the revs whole corner, not sorta slowing down etc.

[Roy]

Yeh std radiator, and usually water temps are never a problem in my car. But i dont like running it when the temps get into the high 80s. Im also concerned about the std 13 yr old radiator and splitting a tank if i let it get too hot.

But typically my water temps stay around the 82-85 on the track. Ill see how much it costs to get mt cf bonnet painted, and some paint blemishes cleaned up, if there are some funds leftover then i may stick ann alloy 50mm radiator with electric thermo fans on it. More for reduced load on crank then water temps.

I think the speeds at PI combined with the fact that i wasnt constantly on the limiter meant plenty of cooling. Drifting at Calder i think would have a whole less airflow thru the radiator:(

[Wazz]

im goin to have to go dyno my car again... last time it made 186.4rwkw(from memory) at redline... turbo back zorst 10psi rb25 turbo... power was just gradual power full boost comes on at 4000rpm and my rb20 is meant to be stock standard besides rb25 turb stock r32 cooler

[Sydneykid]

Yeh std radiator, and usually water temps are never a problem in my car. But i dont like running it when the temps get into the high 80s. Im also concerned about the std 13 yr old radiator and splitting a tank if i let it get too hot.  

But typically my water temps stay around the 82-85 on the track. Ill see how much it costs to get mt cf bonnet painted, and some paint blemishes cleaned up, if there are some funds leftover then i may stick ann alloy 50mm radiator with electric thermo fans on it.  More for reduced load on crank then water temps.

I think the speeds at PI combined with the fact that i wasnt constantly on the limiter meant plenty of cooling. Drifting at Calder i think would have a whole less airflow thru the radiator:(

Hi Roy, when drifting, the airflow goes across the front of the car, not straight in and through the radiator as it does when circuit racing or driving on the road. This affects both the water radiator and the oil cooler (maybe even more as it doesn't have a fan). The intercooler suffers in this area as well. Plus you have a much higher engine rpm and load versus road speed equation. The fan does most of the airflow work but it is working against the partial vacuum in front of the radiator created by the sideways motion.

A larger radiator will help, but I would stick wiith the engine driven fan. Replacing it completely with electric fans (as big and as many as you can be fitted) usually results in lower airflows. Maybe having both electric and engine driven would be a better solution. And don't forget about the oil cooler.

Hope that helps:cheers:

[Roy]

I wont be drifting the old girl again, i enjoy taking the corner quicker with the car twitching around more then just flat out sideways on/off the throttle. Its fun, but a std road car can only take so much abuse before the maintenance cost must spiral out of control.