R32: Gtst Budget Brake Upgrade

[Roy]

Are there any R32 GTST owners that are looking for a front brake upgrade.

Ok, while my front end is apart, i figure i can draw up the kit on my car and get a few sets of brackets machined up...if enough ppl are interested perhaps we can pool our buying power and some machined up.

I already have the rotors, and my brake setup will be back on the car by next weekend. Apart from the offset brackets that im going to get machined up, Im not looking to sell these kits, more a punch list of ppl to talk to if you want to get this done yourself.

Just as a reference, the std R32 GTST rotors are 280mm diam

You can pick and choose between the following options:

The offset bracket.

Bracket allows you to run either DBA 4000 1-piece rotors or DBA 5000 2-piece rotors, measuring 324 x 30mm thk. Brackets will come with high tensile Cap screws and brackets will be machined from aluminium to offset the std caliper to suit larger rotors.

If you are interested and i can get the brackets machined up, or if you prefer i can provide a CAD drawing for you to price up with your local machinist. Though the thing to remember with this sort of thing is you pay for the setup of the machinist, so its expensive to do one set. If you can get 20 done then the setup expense it spread accross the run of brackets.

The Rotors.

Shop around and find the best deal you can on the following part number rotors. Again if someone wants to organise a group buy to pool ppls buying power, then great you may save yourself $50 odd.

DBA 4000 1-pce rotors

DBA-4928 SL & DBA-4928 SR (SL = Slotted Left hand , SR = Slotted Right hand)

DBA 5000 2-pce rotors

DBA-5928 SL & DBA-5928 SR

Hats can come in various colours, Black (BLK), Blue (BLU), Gold (GLD), Natural Silver (NAT), Red (RED). When ordering part number is eg. DBA-5928 RED SL and DBA-5928 RED SR

The Caliper

Either leave them if your happy enough with their appearance, and seals are ok. Or do as i have and strip the caliper for a service. Whilst the pistons/seals etc are out, send the calipers off to HPC Coatings at either:

HPC Queensland

12 Strathwyn Street

Brendale 4500

Queensland

Australia

Phone: 61 7 3881 0885

Fax 61 7 3881 0887

OR

HPC Victoria

6 Watson Road Industrial Park

Leongatha, 3953 Victoria

Australia

Phone: 61 0356 624 719

Phone: 61 0356 624 338

Fax 61 0356 624 719

I am getting the caliper coated using the HiPerCrystal™ appearance coating. See here for a selection of colours and info. Essentially the coating providees a hard weaing surface, also improving the appearance of the caliper and theoretically reduces the heat transfer from the caliper to the fluid. This can translate into reduced brake fluid temps whereby helping to improve braking consistancy/performance.

Including postage you are looking at around $120-140 for the HPC coating of both front calipers.

After the calipers have been coated, its time to get a new seal kit thrown in. Its a pretty easy job to do yourself. However it appears that Race Brakes get such a good discount from Nissan, they can buy the seal kit and install for you at about the same price Nissan want to charge Joe Public for the seal kit alone:(

So im using Race Brakes in Melbourne, see Here for your local outlet. In all you are looking at around $100 depending whether you are dropping the calipers off or posting them.

So thats about it...i think considering the weights of an R32 GTST then you can end up with a great brake package that handles track abuse and looks trick:)

So shop around and see what prices you can get your rotors for, and if you are interested in getting the brackets then let me know. Otherwise UAS sell the DBA rotor/bracket kit for just under $800, meaning that with the caliper coating and rebuild it can all be had for around $1000...perhaps even less if you shop around for rotors at rhe right price/on sale/group buy:)

Will post up work in progress pics this weekend, along with finish intalled pics:)

[Dahtone Racing]

does anyone know how much 5000 series rotors are worth?

[Roy]

Prices vary between $475 each to $525 each depending who you speak to. So far i have found Penrith Brake and Clutch to be the cheapest, but havent had a minute to speak to Race Brakes in Wetherill Park.

Im about 1-2 weeks away from perhaps buying a set, so if you are after some, perhaps we can swing another $20 off the price if we by 3-4 pairs///anyone else interested

PS, you can get the DB4000s for abot $250-270each

[Dahtone Racing]

ive got the 4000s on the car

if i can get rid of em ill get the 5000s

either way if you are gonna get em let me know and ill probably get a pair

[Roy]

Im in the same boat, I have the 324mm DBA 4000s, but prefer to get DBA 5000s off an R33 GTR.

[tom_g]

I had my front calipers serviced last year by Race Brakes in Melbourne and they used a kit for an australian delivered s14 200sx. They said the calipers are basically the same and the parts are a lot cheaper.

I might have a part number in a box in Melbourne somewhere. If any ones after the part number i can have a look when i get back to Melbourne next month.

cheers,

Tom.

[B0oStEr]

I'm interested in the adapter. Can anyone post pics of them?

Any idea how much it would cost to have them made either as a one off or part of a group buy?

I'd also be interested in Series 4000 discs if any of you guys with them want to go for the 5000s

Roy, PM me if any group buy goes ahead or if you have plans drawn up could you please e-mail them to me at [email protected]

[Roy]

Ill have some pics up tomorrow:)

Picked up my calipers today and very happy with them. A few ppl laughed at my attempts at improving the performance of the stock caliper:(...but thats ok. I knew on paper there may be merit to my thinking, reality is there is probably no difference but at least they are now brand new to look at:)

Oh and im not going to bother with DBA 5000s, just stick with what ive got...if i need to do another upgrade ill get serious with prpoer vaned rotors and suitable calipers:)

One thing i did notice today is that the caliper struggles to ensure the entire pad area is in contact with the rotor.... Ill check the overhang tomorrow, but even if its not optimal, its still daylight to the std setup. This slight compromise is the reason why i wouldnt bother with anything better then DBA4000s.

Also having a chat with a brake guy today confirmed my suspicion about GTR Brembos. Whilst they are a very good caliper for std equipment, they aint the greatest caliper Brembo make. So good if you own a GTR, but of you have a GTST then they are not a great upgrade especially considering the money ppl are asking for 2nd hand calipers is the same/more then much better brand new AP 4-calipers:)

[GTRgeoff]

Yep, these look great. Even though it's the early morning ramblings of a (most likely) pissed guy enjoying a late night lamb sandwich (souvlaki), Roy is telling the truth.

Just to elaborate on a number of points:

-The standard four piston calipers on GTSt's (32/33/34) are pretty good OEM stuff, better than sliding calipers of any type,

-The GTR calipers, while an improvement are marginally better and not worth the exorbitant prices asked compared to REALLY good off the shelf product, eg. AP Racing calipers at ~ $800-$1000 each, but remember there are mounting brackets and discs and pads and possibly braided lines and labour so it will be costly,

-An improvement can be made with larger discs as long as the caliper can accomodate the disc diameter without overhang of the pad, otherwise you are wasting pad and reducing possible swept area,

-Drilled discs need to be changed more often and don't necessarily have any advantage other than less weight, but they have less heat capacity and are more susceptiblee to cracking. Slotted are the way to go.

I'm in the process of preparing a tutorial on brake systems and the important elements in matching and balancing. Just slapping on bigger calipers without improving disc size, matching the master cylinder volume etc is a sure fire way to degrade the system feel and any chance of using good heel toe techniques.

[Richard Everett]

GREAT INFO - THANKS!

- My son & I are undertaking a major front brake upgrade on his Oz R31 sedan.

- Original fronts are small 250 mm rotors & small single piston calipers.

- Have now got HR31 front stut legs that allow fitmemt of R32 / R33 / R34 brakes.

- Got the R34 four pot calipers & will take the advice on getting them HPC coated & new piston kit installed.

- Intending to fit up DBA # 4928 R34 slotted & cross-drilled rotors - 334 mm x 30 mm , however the best price have got so far is $653 / pair! Does anyone know where we can get them for a better price? Anybody got experience with RDA equivalents?

- Next step will be sourcing the custom billet alloy caliper brackets to fit up the R34 calipers to the HR31 strut legs. Are both 100 mm bolt spacing. Anybody know where best to get & price for a pair of these? Happy to be part of a Group Buy if this is to proceed.

Cheers,

Richard

[Roy]

Ok here are some pics...

Here is the HPC Coated Caliper. I requested Cobalt Blue, but i think they have supplied me Ford Racing Blue. No matter im still very happy with the colour and finish.

Side View of coated and reco'd caliper

Top View of coated and reco'd caliper.

You can see the new dust seals and coated pistons in this shot.

Mounted on car...lol, dont mind all the crap on the garage floor. I promise Geoff ill clean it up:(

And perhaps the most important pic.

So remembering that these calipers were designed for 280mm rotors. So asking them to accept a 324mm rotor is a big step. At best the pad overhangs the edge of the rotor by 2mm, more like 1mm. So its just about a perfect fit for the larger rotors.

Cosidering the new offset of the calipers' pistons there is a dramatic increase in the torque/leverage applied to the rotor. Ppl often comment on the brakes when driving my car. I suspect its a combination of pad, rotor, braided line and rebuilt master cylinder that make the brakes better then std GTST setups. But the rotors play a big part:)

I use either AP 5.1 or Motul RBF500 brake fluid with RB74 front pads and Comp 2 rears. I have however just started using Comp 9s on the front looking to get the most out of the semi slicks:)

[B0oStEr]

The calipers look great Roy.

How much did Race Brakes charge you to rebuild the calipers?

Is there a pic of the mounting bracket that you could post?

[Roy]

Half an hours labour and around $80 for the seal kit. I bought soem brake fluid at thesame time so cant recall off the top of my head the exact price, but it was somehitng like $100-120 for both calipers. It is cheap as they use the seal kit from Nissan off the 200SX

..and ill get some pics of the bracket this weekend.

[B0oStEr]

Do you know how much new pistons would cost if they are required?

[GTRgeoff]

That cheap because the local brake place wants that much per caliper but I always knew they were a rip off.

Just for reference Nissan quoted me about $250 just for the front seal kit for a 33gtst. BANDITS!!

[Roy]

No idea about the pisotns. Mien showed a few signs of corrosion, but a blast and a lick of ceramic coating they were as good as new. Apart from some pitting eytc what else can really go wrong with a piston?

[B0oStEr]

I haven't mine apart yet but I think they need rebuilding because the pads are binding.

I tried to push the pads back but the pistons were very tight.

My DR30 calipers were tight like this and needed new pistons as there was rust under the chrome.

Do R32 calipers have chromed steel or alloy pistons?

[Roy]

They look to be chromed steel. Mien were pitted a little, a good blast and the ceramic coating and we will see what condition they are in an oanother 12-18 months time when i rip them off again. It seems the temps of the track seem to knock the dust seals around...perhaps thats why the top shelf calipers have internal dust seals:)

[Richard Everett]

Hi Roy - great tutorial!

What is status on the caliper brackets?

Cheers,

Richard

[Roy]

Ohh, sorry. I took some dimensions and hand sketched them up. Im seriously under the pump at the moment...i worked 56.5 hour week last week, plus my unit got knocked around by the storms, and i drove my car at Calder the other night..and now im back in Adelaide...so busy, busy, busy.

Im a chance of drawing up the bracket on the weekend of the 19th, then i can email it off to ppl if they want to get them priced by their local machine shop, or i can try a few places...its just that at the moment im commissioning a new factory in Adelaide and its pretty time consuming:(

Did you try Race Brakes in Wetherill Park?

If you cant wait until i get the drawing together, then remove the rotor and caliper from the car, and look at the std bolt locations for locating the caliper to the hub. All the bracket does is move those bolt holes out 26mm, and present the caliper with the same mounting face....albeit offset an extra 26mm to suit the larger rotor