New clutch = strange grinding noise + clank in reverse...

[Zahos]

Hi All,

I have a strange problem I was not able to dig up any info on...

Recently I had my clutch changed to daiken exceedy Heavy duty. The thrust bearing and spigot bush were also replaced. Dunno if this makes a difference, but I was told that the spigot bush was installed under high pressure oil.

Anyhow,

It has developed a strange problem where once in gear, at low RPM and under load, I get a grinding noise (up until 2500 - 3000 rpm).

I can only hear it in the following gears:

2nd (not very loud)

3rd (very loud)

4th (not very loud)

It is very apparent when the car is cold, and less noticeable when warm.

The noise is intermittent, at a low frequency, but increases as revs do.

I cannot do it in neutral, and if I change gears at higher rpm, or do not put load on at low rpm I cannot hear the noise at all.

The other issue is, in reverse, if say reversing up-hill and put load on the clutch, I hear a VERY loud rattling noise which appears to be coming from the front left hand corner of the car.

AND, if the car is stationary, in reverse, clutch pedal in, and I VERY quickly let the pedal out to friction point and depress again, I hear a VERY loud clank or bang which appears to part of the rattling noise I hear when reversing under load.

Has anyone ever had these issues before? They seem quite strange to me.

I took it back to the guy that did my clutch, but the car had warmed up by the time I got there and didn’t do it at all... so he couldn't be of any help...

Thanks in advance

[Bobjones]

Who installed it???

I would be taking it back and it sounds like the thrust bearing has not been put in correctly and most likely the clutch and pressure plate have not been lined up correctly that is why the noise at certain revs.

Does it make any noise upon engagement...??? Release????

[Zahos]

Hey,

No noise on relese / engagement.

Clutch is otherwise very quite, and pedal feel is great (very light).

Clutch also has a very strong bite!

and most likely the clutch and pressure plate have not been lined up correctly that is why the noise at certain revs

I was thinking that, but don't know enough about clutches to be sure.

I forgot to mention that he thinks that there may be some play on the main shaft, and that b/c there is a new spigot bush, the main shaft is rubbing on the bush????

I called them and will be taking it down later, they are happy to have a look at it for me...

So how can a thrust bearing that has not been installed correctly make that type of noise? I have never seen how they are installed, so I wouldn't know...

[LANFOH]

Is it a single plate or multi?

And is the clutch plate got a sprung center?

I had a new clutch put in recently and have a slight rattle on cold starts which Ive been told is the springs in the clutch plate but Im not sure. Also when Im in reverse and put my foot on the clutch quickly I can also here a clunk quite loud.

So your not the only one.

[Zahos]

It's a single organic with a clamp load of 850kg ~ 1800lbs.

It does have a sprung center.

Well, if I find out anything, I'll post up here so you can fix ur problem to hopefully.

How long ago did you do your clutch?

Mine was done about 1 month ago.

[LANFOH]

Cheers mate,

Yeah mines an Xtreme 9 puck single plate ceramic button clutch and a I got it put in about 2 weeks ago, the clutch engages and disengages sweet just a few rattles that im not used to compared to my stocko clutch.

[Bobjones]

It's a single organic with a clamp load of 850kg ~ 1800lbs.

It does have a sprung center.

Well, if I find out anything, I'll post up here so you can fix ur problem to hopefully.

How long ago did you do your clutch?

Mine was done about 1 month ago.

I have the same/similar clutch, full face organic with upgraded pressure plate.

When it was installed the first time I had a similar rattle (no clunk that I can remember)

the alignment of the plates was average and thus causing additional stress on the thrust bearing during engagement and disengagement (why I asked the question)

I had ANOTHER one installed (for free) and runs perfectly. So my only guess then is alignment combined with the sprigot...possibly

[boosted]

i had a similar type problem with mine....it turned out to be that every time i clicked it into reverse the diff was smacking up against the exhaust creating this clunking noise every time i changed into reverse! give the guys at hyper-tech a call in victoria...the guys are so knowledgeable there that even if the problem is different they will be able to pin-point it anyway! (03) 9876 8844

[TracidTrax]

Hi All,

I have a strange problem I was not able to dig up any info on...

Recently I had my clutch changed to daiken exceedy Heavy duty.

Thanks in advance

i dont think u should have installed the daiken, nothing but prblems with them, how much did u pay for the clutch installed?

[Jax]

Don't know about the reversing problems, - But, the other noises seem to say 'gearbox' rather than clutch. [including differences cold to hot] Let us know what is found.

[Zahos]

well, I just came back from the workshop, and he reckons the noise is the springs on the center vibrating. He is going to replace the clutch. It's not a major isue, just an annoyance.

As for clunking in reverse, it still remains a mystery.

boosted: Thanks for that info. My noise seems to come from the front, but like i said it may be resonantion from elsewhere and appear to come from the front... I'll give them a call if it desn't work out wih the workshop I have it at now.

TracidTrax: I paid $800 fitted. I ave heard mainly good hings about daiken/exceedy. I thought they were also suppliers of most OEM clutches? Other than the noise, the clutch is very good. What are common problems with Daiken clutches?

Jax: I thought about that, but they started happening right after I changed my clutch. Before that the only noise I heard was the old spigot bush tweeting like a bird, and the thrust bearing squeeking... Thanks for the input anyhow...

[Jax]

I'm a bit puzzled by what appears to be current normal practice, of fitting a 'spring centre' clutch plate with an increased pressure Pressure Plate. Originally, all clutch plates were solid, that is no cushion centre. The sprung centre was introduced to compensate for the general lack of skill of drivers in co-ordinating the clutch take-up with revs and the range of types of take-off from slow and gentle to full power for maximum initial acceleration.

In the 60s - 70s you would seldom combine a upgraded Pressure Plate with a 'Touring' type Clutch Plate.

Even in reasonably recent times [ and possibly still currently in V8 Supercars] in, say, Production Touring Cars, as raced at Bathurst, and almost certainly the GTRs of the early 90s solid centre Clutch Plates would have been used, I would have thought.

I would strongly advise that anyone fitting 'heavy duty' clutches, do the same to-day. It's almost a contradiction in terms not to. They're not as easy to work smoothly in heavy traffic conditions, but when you learn to use them they are more consistant and reliable for all conditions.

[Bobjones]

Sprung centres provide additional give when applying the clutch the take up point. They are used to distribute the frictional force and thus reduce the vibration through the clutch pedal.

Solid centres should be used for performance applications such as V8 supercars. However, most do not have a 600hp car. Therefore, the additional clamping pressure from the pressure plate more effectively uses the existing frictional properties of the sprung centre clutch without the additional forces that would occur with a solid centre.

In addition, the solid centre clutches also place addtional strain on driveline compenents, mainly input shafts to gearboxes and alternatively output. Therefore, in a street driven vehicle having a solid centre will not only make it extremely hard to drive but also place additional and unwanted strain on gearboxes that are not designed to take a solid centre.

Therefore, a compromise, as in all things, is upgraded friction material such as kevlar etc etc , sprung centres and additional clamping pressure from pressure plates.

Hope that answers the question...

Cheers

Neill

[Zahos]

OK so I found out what the loud clank was when reversing.

I could not believe it when I discoverd it whilst washing my car...

The bonnet was loose....

B/c reversing forces the front end down, the bonnet would go down, them spring back up and make the noise as it tapped the latch.

So I re-adjusted the latch, and the 2 rubbers on each corner of the bonnet to the point where it was a tight fit, and noise gone....

[Zahos]

BTW, LANFOH, you should get them to replace your clutch. Rattling springs doesn't sound normal to me. The longer you wait, the harder it will be....

[T04GTR]

the grinding noise that you can hear is gear rattle. or as subaru like to call it "garra-garra" noise.

this happens when the harmonics of the engine cannot be absorbed by the new clutch/clutch plate. if its mass is changed or if larger cushioning springs are fitted(heavy duty) its totaly normal and not detrimental to the gearbox but sounds really bad. i got thes when i put a nismo twin plate in. hope that helps

[Jax]

Sounds right - Sounds good - Always thought it sounded like G/box noises. Whilst some disagree that you could [should] fit a solid centre clutch plate, it never even occurred to me that anyone would fit a 'heavy duty' Pressure Plate with a normal 'touring type'Clutch Plate, without stronger centre springs. Please tell me I'm wrong and it did'nt happen?

[LANFOH]

the grinding noise that you can hear is gear rattle. or as subaru like to call it "garra-garra" noise.  

this happens when the harmonics of the engine cannot be absorbed by the new clutch/clutch plate. if its mass is changed or if larger cushioning springs are fitted(heavy duty)  its totaly normal and not detrimental to the gearbox but sounds really bad. i got thes when i put a nismo twin plate in. hope that helps

Thanks for the reply, this makes sense, it does sound really bad when cold but once she warms up a bit it goes away.

[Zahos]

I thought I would update this thread with more recent updates in case anyone else is experiencing the same problem.

The clank I was getting in reverse came back a few days after I re-adjusted the bonnet, and lasted for months.

In the weekend that just past, I thought I would take another look around and found what the problem really was.

I have a Blitz LM intercooler, and the pipes that come with it are larger than the stock pipes. They also have smaller sections of pipe where they connect to the factory piping (where the airbox is).

Anyhow, it was here the larger section of pipe that cannot fit through the factory cut holes cut for the intercooler pipes would rattle up against the rim of the hole.

All I did temporarily was duct tape some padding around the section of pipe that rattles against the rim of that hole, and that stupid noise has finally gone.

So if any one else has a Blitz intercooler with the return piping, and gets the same noise, it may be worth having a look at.

[Taso84]

I just got a heavy duty clutch installed on my 33 and its started to make that barra barra noice. Sounds like its coming from the gear box and only occures in 2nd and 3rd gears at low rev ranges. It is really annoying and noticeable but if it doesnt do any damage i guess its nothing to worry about. Have u guys who have had experience in this noticed if the noice goes away or even gets softer after time?