Sub Frame Movement

[R32 TT]

I think Nismo make "hardness up" rubber bushes:cheers:

Yep, they sure do. I just fitted the Nismo ones about 4 weeks ago.

My existing bushes had split and leaked the silicon(?) fluid out of them.

Putting the Nismo's in really has turned it into a go-kart.. but of course since the stock ones were shot - you would expect that.

I got them straight from a Nissan dealer here in Perth. Watch out though, they are a little over $100 each (and you need 4) They are a solid black rubber material. I don't know if they are stiffer or not that Poly bushes, but I think Poly is a third of the price. (I learned that after I had bought the Nismo's)

Also, NVH has definitely increased for me. In fact I even feel a bit of a vibration through the seat between 80-100km/hr. This may be "something else" vibrating that needs looking at - and perhaps the bushes have just brought it to my attention. Below 80km/hr, they feel fine. Point is, the vibration wasn't felt prior to them being fitted.

[Cubes]

Drop it back a gear and let me know if it still vibrates.

My g/box has done that in 5th around 95-100km/h since day 1.

[Trust33]

Hi Trust33;

1. The weakest link is always the weakest link, but there is no doubt that more contact patch from less roll will help any tyre.

2. When you lower them they end up at 1 to 1.5 degrees negative anyway, then add the Whiteline adjusters and you usually get 2.5 degrees negative.  Which is not a bad place to start 

3. Nope

Ah-so Confusius.

Ive been reading a little about handeling and suspension for cars.Allot of the posts made by yourself and others.

It's not that confusing when it's understood better like anything really,one thing affects another though thats what has to be considered when seting up the car.

The handelling pack sounds good for the 33.

[R32 TT]

Drop it back a gear and let me know if it still vibrates.

My g/box has done that in 5th around 95-100km/h since day 1.

I'll do that!

Gimme a few days - she's in the workshop having Motec fitted (yay!)

(hmm.. wonder if I can 'tune out' the vibration...)

But yeah I'll let you know,

[Steve]

Bl4cK32, just to clear up a couple of things, aluminium pineapples will increase the NVH, as will poly.

Poly bushes will allow you to change the geometry of the cradle, BUT, as so commonly believed, DO NOT set up for slip - this makes absolutely no sense, and will make your car handle like a pig. For drift, you NEED traction - otherwise you just spin out all the time.

There are a few ways you can go with pineapples - using both alluminium and poly or just poly or just aluminium. If you are concerned about NVH, use poly upper and aluminium lower pineapples. Running a mech diff, this is probably the way to go if you dont want largely increased NVH.

I have used poly only, poly and alluminium and alluminium only. I only noticed a major increase in nvh with all alluminium, as you would expect.

If you are changing the sub frame bushes, it would be worth fitting pineapples for grip (needed in your case ) at the same time, as you have to drop the cradle to do them - save dropping the cradle twice. (for grip, you need to put pineapples at the front between the body and the cradle, tilting the front down.)

If you want grip, also consider traction rods (D1 Garage do a modified OEM traction arm for around $40, works well). Also, if you are going the drift way, run around 3 to 4 mm total toe in on the rear, or more, as it will help keep the back end tight when you are sideways, ie, it wont just swing around all over the place. With the amount of torque you are putting down it wont hurt at all. A well set up drift car has MASSIVE grip, its a common myth that they dont.

Also, I hope you have pissed off the hicas by now

[Cubes]

Thanks Steve, some good info there.

I'll be replacing my subframe buses with the Noltec jobbies and also slap a set of pinapples in there for good measure.

I'm also going to drop in a tightened up S13 3.9:1 diff as the 4.363:1 tends to feel as if you don't get to use the torque of the 3ltr.

I'm bolting a VG30DET turbo that should see me slightly over 200rwkw. It will do for now until I sort out the traction issues. As Darren is all too aware it really sucks the way it is setup now.

I literally cannot bring it up on boost in first, second axle tramps like all bugger leaving you all the way through second trying to play with the accelerator to get some power down.

[Steve]

I found with the 3037, for traction I had to go larger exhaust housing, made it easier to control with the right foot instead of being on/off, boost ramped so hard there is no way to control it apart from not use it - might be worht having a look in that direction too, especially with the extra cc and torque.

good luck

[Cubes]

It is still running the little rb20det turbo that makes its peak power around 4400rpm so no doubt that is causing the lack of traction, hopefully the larger exhaust a/r vg30 turbo will smooth it out a little.

I've been talking to GCG, they have said 260rwkw from their rb25 highflow is around the mark so they seem to think the vg30 turbo with its larger exhaust a/r will allow the turbo to make close to 280rwkw.

I would be happy enough with that. Especially considering it won't be laggy and still get up and move from 3000-3500rpm onwards.

[Bl4cK32]

Bl4cK32, just to clear up a couple of things, aluminium pineapples will increase the NVH, as will poly.

Poly bushes will allow you to change the geometry of the cradle, BUT, as so commonly believed, DO NOT set up for slip - this makes absolutely no sense, and will make your car handle like a pig. For drift, you NEED traction - otherwise you just spin out all the time.

There are a few ways you can go with pineapples - using both alluminium and poly or just poly or just aluminium. If you are concerned about NVH, use poly upper and aluminium lower pineapples. Running a mech diff, this is probably the way to go if you dont want largely increased NVH.

I have used poly only, poly and alluminium and alluminium only. I only noticed a major increase in nvh with all alluminium, as you would expect.

If you are changing the sub frame bushes, it would be worth fitting pineapples for grip (needed in your case ) at the same time, as you have to drop the cradle to do them - save dropping the cradle twice. (for grip, you need to put pineapples at the front between the body and the cradle, tilting the front down.)

If you want grip, also consider traction rods (D1 Garage do a modified OEM traction arm for around $40, works well). Also, if you are going the drift way, run around 3 to 4 mm total toe in on the rear, or more, as it will help keep the back end tight when you are sideways, ie, it wont just swing around all over the place. With the amount of torque you are putting down it wont hurt at all. A well set up drift car has MASSIVE grip, its a common myth that they dont.

Also, I hope you have pissed off the hicas by now

Cheers Steve. Im doing the rear cradle over christmas, and i think ill go for new sub frame bushes, combined with poly upper and aluminium lower pineapples...thanks for the help I did remember you told me drifters need the grip..

Oh yer...got a hicas lock kit here waiting to go on as well...will do that after doing the cradle, then get a wheel alignment shortly after

Dont really want to set the car up for drift...more grip to help with the torque:uh-huh:

[mist]

hey Darren, how's the GT Pro going? what setting (soft-med-hard) is it on? hope you're luving it hehe.

Just to add to the discussion, I had whiteline's pineapple kit on my old 32. The 'drift' setting was stupid, the tail would just snap out. The advice you're getting is good I have aluminium upper and lower spacers on my present car - they give a very direct feel, but are a bit harsh on bumpy sydney roads. I think the poly upper + aluminium lower route is a good idea.

[Bl4cK32]

Hey, hows it goin mate

Diff is going great. One of the best things ive bought for my car actually. Was very easy to get used to, and helps the car out heaps.

Its still set on soft, the way i got it from you

Roads are bumpy here in Adelaide too, so id like to keep NVH down as low as i can get it...its mainly my daily driver, so more traction is always good

[Bl4cK32]

If you want grip, also consider traction rods (D1 Garage do a modified OEM traction arm for around $40, works well).

With these Steve, i havent heard much about them. I havent looked at the rear suspension too close, and dont know where they are situated on the rear...

Care to shed some light for me on what they do / and what they adjust.....*I need to use the search button more i think*

[Steve]

No worries at all.

They are the rods that run forward from the rear axle, attaching to the uprights. The modified ones are shorter, and give more traction. The ones James do are as shown to him by Bai - sort of an old school Jap trick that apparently works as well as aftermarket for a fraction of the price. James car definately has gobs of traction, its amazing.

Aftermarket do the same thing for around $300.