Top 5 Gtr Times-what Ecu Are Bieng Used

[exXU1]

My ECU is MINE's Tuned

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What HP ATTW < what performance and times?

I am anticipating with my build + or - 800 .

[Duncan]

I understand that using a MAP sensor with multiple throttle bodies like on the GTR is a problem due to fluctuations in the manifold pressure as different butterflys open, and so thats another reason to stick with AFMs.

One ECU function I can see being helpful though is the launch control/flat shift feature

[NXTIME]

Power FC Pro has a two step, but the D-Jetro (MAP) version doesn't. Work that one out.

[BBGTR]

I understand that using a MAP sensor with multiple throttle bodies like on the GTR is a problem due to fluctuations in the manifold pressure as different butterflys open, and so thats another reason to stick with AFMs.

One ECU function I can see being helpful though is the launch control/flat shift feature

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're right there, the Autronic get's around that by mapping on TPS up to zero vacuum and then switches to MAP. Pretty cool I reckon.

Regards

Andrew

[exXU1]

most japanese rh9 cars these days run either power fc or hks fcon v pro

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who in Perth can tune a HKS F con V PRO ??

What cars in OZ run this , do you know at all please?

[Sydneykid]

They only reason a MAP based system is better in my opinion is if the air flow meters are a restriction (either by volume or resolution).

Precisely, 2 X Q45 AFM's will handle well over 1100 bhp, so I have yet to see any need to give up the AFM's superior precision in transient throttle applications.

the Autronic get's around that by mapping on TPS up to zero vacuum and then switches to MAP. Pretty cool I reckon.

I like the "Autronic gets around it", that means it GUESSES the airflow based on an rpm versus throttle position map ie; 2 dimensional tuning. That's not "cool", it's a band aid to make up for the fact that an AFM would tell you exactly how much air the turbo is ingesting.

Personally I prefer an AFM sensor driven ECU, at least I know it will inject the amount of fuel to match the measured airflow according to my mapping.

cheers

Edited September 15, 2005 by Sydneykid

[BBGTR]

I like the "Autronic gets around it", that means it GUESSES the airflow based on an rpm versus throttle position map ie; 2 dimensional tuning.  That's not "cool", it's a band aid to make up for the fact that an AFM would tell you exactly how much air the turbo is ingesting.

Personally I prefer an AFM sensor driven ECU, at least I know it will inject the amount of fuel to match the measured airflow according to my mapping.

cheers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sydneykid,

Have you ever driven a GT-R with an Autronic fitted?

Regards

Andrew

Edited September 15, 2005 by STI113

[RPMGTR]

Actually, the Motec/autronic can use TPS/Map for fuel.......so it looks at rpm, throttle position and manifold pressure which makes it 3D...

but its still hard to beat the good, old PFC on a RB....just so easy to tune well.

cheers.

[sav man]

exXU1...power fc pro is what you need....but APEXi stopped making them....ive been looking for one for two months now....with no success. If you can find a reputable supplier then please let me know.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nengun have them, $1413 delivered (with hand controller).

[exXU1]

Mate , you can buy from numerous outlets .

greenline has one on special right now, 1 x pro version left or buy from Nengun.

exXU1...power fc pro is what you need....but APEXi stopped making them....ive been looking for one for two months now....with no success. If you can find a reputable supplier then please let me know.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Guest DIRTgarage]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

if you dont want it ill take it

[Guest DIRTgarage]

just checked the website....its for an s13

r32 gtr says discontinued

[saliya]

FWIW, I had a Haltech E6K (runs on MAP + TPS + other std sensors) in my old

R32 before I put in the PowerFC.

This Haltech was tuned by a Haltech-recommended tuner who had done many

of these before and apparently knew what he was doing (no, not naming names).

I ditched it in favour of a PowerFC because I wasn't happy with the performance

of the car - large increases in throttle opening always resulted in a split-second

of hesitation (at which time my mixture meter showed a momentary lean-out).

For a drag car, this doesn't matter; for a road car, it was sufficiently annoying

for me to have to try 'something else'. No other changes except replacing E6K

with PFC; but the problem is gone.

_I_ think the momentary lean out can be explained by the time that it takes

the MAP sensor to "see" the change and respond. Yes, you can compensate

with a throttle-pump function; but it couldn't delete the hesitation.

So to the original poster - a Haltech (I think the new one is the E11, if you use

an E6K you need waste-spark) will certainly allow you to start/run/drag the

car. Mine certainly never had trouble on power runs. Can't speak for the others

you list. But if you want to drive it on the road or the circuit, you might still

want to look at how to attach an AFM

Regards,

Saliya

Edited September 15, 2005 by saliya

[bfi.inc]

What HP ATTW < what performance and times?

I am anticipating with my build + or -  800 .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

mines tune? So japanese petrol,athmospheric conditions etc are the same in Aust?

[Leewah]

Just means you can pump more through huh??

Actually, the Motec/autronic can use TPS/Map for fuel.......so it looks at rpm, throttle position and manifold pressure which makes it 3D...

but its still hard to beat the good, old PFC on a RB....just so easy to tune well.

cheers.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Sydneykid]

Sydneykid,

Have you ever driven a GT-R with an Autronic fitted?

Regards

Andrew

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi Andrew, yes, it was fantastic, but it took over a month to get the road tune right. That's cold start & run, hot idle, air con, electrical load and power steering compensation etc etc. That's the problem, no AFM to sense the REAL engine load, so you have to tune it in minute steps. And our tuner has had over 10 years experience on Perkins customer V8's, which all came with Autronics. Time is money, and it cost a boat load to tune that one.

Actually, the Motec/autronic can use TPS/Map for fuel.......so it looks at rpm, throttle position and manifold pressure which makes it 3D...

Since the MAP sensor shows constant pressure, the truth is you are only tuning against 2 dimensions at best. You can't use the MAP sensor output and the TPS is at a constant 100% at WOT. So in reality it's 1 dimensional tuning, RPM.

cheers

Edited September 16, 2005 by Sydneykid

[djhatton]

its a shame more people aren't fluent with the hks computers here in aus. the trend i'm noticing is practically all the big jap tuners are using the fconVpro. 64bit architecture machine and stupidly configueable. spec for spec, its way ahead of your average motec/autronic setup apart from the datalogging and expansion options (adl/cdi/telemetry etc etc) so i'm surprised more people aren't using it here!

d

[BBGTR]

Another view on the MAF v MAP debate, from Ben Strader - one of the better Autronic tuners in the U.S. and founder of www.efi101.com

Regards

Andrew

==============================

The Autronic unit differs slightly in the way it calculates fuel and ignition from the stock unit and most other aftermarket systems in that it uses "speed/density" to calibrate with.

Basically it uses a "map sensor" to indicate the pressure inside the manifold {negative or positive} and then references that value against the engine speed.

Then, using a complex mathematical sequence based on the

PV=NrT theory it calculates the actual amount of air in the engine for one cycle.........multiplies that time RPM {number of cycles} and then looks that value up in a "Base Fuel Table" which the user can modify to add or subtract fuel to obtain a desired A/F ratio.

The factory and some aftermarket systems use a MASS FLOW system which directly measures the air entering the engine {corrected for temperature} and then uses the same style of tables to look up user entered values. This sytems works well, but does have some drawbacks.

First, beacuse all of the air going into the engine must be actually measured, it must pass through a calibrated orifice called the Mass Air Flow Sensor. This sensor poses a restriction to airflow and can be a horsepower robber at elevated power levels.

Second, any air leaks after the sensor, but before the throttle body will cause a lean condition because there is no means of measuring that "sneaky" air.

The Speed/Density method only cares about the air inside the manifold at any given time and is therefore a bit more flexible.

Plus, you can eliminate the stock mass air meter to gain additional power, or leave it in place to maintain the stock appearance.

Plus the Autronic comes with the Auto-tune option and Anti-Lag functions plus unlimited options for data logging as STANDARD options........all inculded in the price.

Again I think the UTEC is a great system and I have NO complaints about it. The Autronic is just another good option for everyone.

======================

[C_DawG]

I'm intruiged, why all the big $$ ECUs in a car that runs WOT for 9 seconds?  Honest question, is the tuning really that difficult? Surely the PFC has enough load points for this use? I mean, the quickest drag cars use carbies?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Carbies? Top Fuelers use mechanical injection.

I'd go MoTeC if you can.

[Sydneykid]

its a shame more people aren't fluent with the hks computers here in aus. the trend i'm noticing is practically all the big jap tuners are using the fconVpro. 64bit architecture machine and stupidly configueable. spec for spec, its way ahead of your average motec/autronic setup apart from the datalogging and expansion options (adl/cdi/telemetry etc etc) so i'm surprised more people aren't using it here!

d

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Fluency has NOTHING to do with it. HKS don't release the software, acreditied workshops have to buy it and pay a licence fee and pay a royalty and pay an annual renewal fee. It's simply too damn expensive and there is not enough demand for it. Compared to Motec/Autronic where you get the tuning software with the ECU when you buy it.

Blaim HKS, it is no one else's fault.

cheers