RB20DET 31 or 32?

[Passage31]

I was wondering if anyone can help?

I have an RB20ET in my Passage GT which is absolutely gutless and i wish to upgrade to a twincam. I have a choice of a HR31 ECCS twincam turbo from an auto for $1000 with all accessories needed or a HR32 front cut for just over $2K. Both have about 105km on each.

Now i know that the 31 has 153kW and the 32 has 160kw, I wanted to know what other mechanical differences (head design, turbos,easy mods, etc...) which would help me make up my mind and if there is any major disadvantage using the 31 other than power?

Thanks

[lowlux]

theres not much difference id buy the red top eccs and spend the extra 1000 that your saving on a new turbo and cooler

[meggala]

I agree with low lux although the r32 rb 20 is better its not 1 k better

you might need a gear box as well

[Guest Boxhead]

you should be able to get just a motor kit for cheaper then 2grand..

[Passage31]

Thanks for your help guys.

Ive already got the manual so thats not a major problem (damn synchros).

The 32 is a front cut so i get everything including another stronger box but minus the brakes. The 31 is the engine, loom, cooler and plumbing hence the price difference.

[Guest Works Auto]

The are a few more differences. The 32 has 6port head as opposed to 12 port on the r31 so the 32motor flows alot better.

The r32 computer can be remapped whereas the r31 motor cant.

Also all of the plugs and wiring is alot better on the r32 motor.

The gearbox on the 32 motor have double syncro's instead of single on the r31 5spd.

umm what else.

OH yeh thats a pesky cold start retard system on the r31 motor which is ***ing annoying.

Ive had both the r31 and r32 rb20det. Pick the 32 motor everytime.

[blind_elk]

The NICS engine (R31, red-top) has the variable runners. These are prone to failure (jam open), and make the engine even more gutless than it already is. Some of them can take the R32 head. The R32 has a better turbo, I think (BB, ceramic).

2k for a half cut dosen't sound too bad. Go with the R32 for overall better value.

VL / R31 gearbox in the worst case to bolt up behind.

[Passage31]

The 31 engine is the ECCS not NICS. The NICS wouldnt be a great improvement on the single cam.

I forgot about the port difference between the the two, and the BB turbo is only on the late 32, the one with the BOV.

Thanks for the tip with the double synchros in the 32 box. Oh and someone has managed tune the 31 with the use of a chip.

I take it things that fit the 32 RB20 like adj. cam gears, aftermarket dump pipes etc...... dont fit the 31?

Thanks for the input.

[lowlux]

if its the red top eccs theres like 6kws difference from the r32 rb20det and red top rb20det,also the red tops CAN!!!!! be remapped Dr Drift can do it for a small fee, and ive worked my eccs red top a fair bit and its putting out a fair bit of power without and probs,soooo ill stick with the redtop and spend the extra money on turbo and cooler

[Guest nismogtsx]

OK....

I have read all the posts and there is a fair bit of BS....

OK... The difference between the 4 RB20DET motors

R31 NICS RB20det has;

12 port intake

cer turbo

butterfly shaped intake ports on head

R31 ECCS RB20det has;

6 port intake

cer turbo

round shaped intake ports on head

R32 ECCS RB20det (pre 10/92)

6 port intake

cer turbo

round shaped intake ports on head

R32 ECCS RB20det (after 10/92)

6 port intake

bb turbo

round shaped intake ports on head

OK, I have used all of these motors... In stock form the R32 motor with bb turbo is the best for $$$... However i have turfed out my R32 motor and have bought an R31 NICS motor due to 3 main reasons...

1. In top end tuning in Japan they use this motor due to its thicker cylinder walls this is great for stroking and with standing high (and i mean very high boost) as its also a cast iron block (however is 60kgs heavier than and R32 motor)

2. Very reliable..... very reliable they have simple electronics and the spark/injection system is the same as a R32 but the cold start and auto timing is a god send (i have fitted HKS gears to my cams also with no worries)

3. JUN has more parts on their list for R31 NICS motors than R32 ECCS motors... And they have stated many times that they used an R31 NICS motor stroked to 2.4 in their very famious R32 GTS-T

As for power i run a constant 227rwkw everyday and have done now for over 2 and a half years..... Just service it every 6 months or 5000kms and it will keep running this way....

So to put it all in english the R32 motor is better bang for ya buck

R31 motor (NICS) has more potential in the long run....

Thanks again.....

[Guest nismogtsx]

"Works auto"

Sorry to rain on the parade but i know these motor like the back of my hand... If you are around the Gold Coast one day give ua a call and ill show ya... I have a couple of RB20's in the garage....

1. You can re-map the ECU

2. The 12 port head has a higher volume of air flow per minute

3. The parts are cheaper

4. The mods are endless........

I have still got some standard internalls in my motor and it is very reliable... I drive it every day... I also spin the wheels allot....

If you can get ya hands on an R31 GTS/GTSX (not GTS-R cause they were all manual) diff then grab it and put that in as they have traction control and have a higher ratio for fast acc... but lower top speed (whos wants top speed anyway - 1/4 mile is all ya need)

[Guest nismogtsx]

Oh i meant to say "AUTO" diff..

OK not one out of a manual....

GET ONE OUT OF AN AUTO....

[slip]

get the half cut, and do the brake upgrade while you are at it.

[lowlux]

i agree 100% with what nismogtsx has said, hes very knowledgable when it comes to these motors so listen to him ppls,and stop bagging red top rb20's

lol

[MrMayhem]

NismoGts-x you said.........

R31 ECCS RB20det has;

6 port intake

cer turbo Both the HR31 RB20 have 12 port head

round shaped intake ports on head

R32 ECCS RB20det (pre 10/92)

6 port intake

cer turbo

round shaped intake ports on head

Both the HR31 RB20 have 12 port heads!!!!!!

And they carry over teh butterfly system of teh NICs

Also from the 20 odd R32 front cuts and engines Ive had all have been BB the only 6 port ones Ive seen non bb have been cefiros

as for diff ratios whats the autos ? cos every manual HR31 RB20det Ive had is 4.3 did they realease an even higher one?

also traction control?

The Extra block weight is a surprise that I didnt know

Also in reference to tune I thinks Works is refering to WA where nobody I know can chip and dyno the older ecu...

Tell me more about this 12 port being better than 6 port

Ive retained my 12 port head instead of going to a spare 6 port

can you post something for me to look at

[Guest Works Auto]

yes both r31 motors have the 12 port head even though the manifold looks like the r32 motor. We have had these heads off and know 100%.

So as far as knowing them like the back of your hand, maybe u should stop batting off so much.

[Guest nismogtsx]

Here a pic of a red top RB20det motor with a 6 porter....

This is an ECCS Red top....

[Guest nismogtsx]

Sorry maby this time ill remember to insert the photo

[Guest nismogtsx]

OK i have done up a heap of RB20det motors...

Ive owned skyline for over 7 years now...

There is a big difference between the NICS & ECCS heads on the red top RB20det....

Heres a pic of a 12 port on a NICS red top...

(NOTE: Its is very difficult to fit an R32 ECCS intake to a red top NICS)

[Guest nismogtsx]

Here is a more clear pic of the NICS 12 port on a red top....

This is my set-up

Well this pic is over 18 months old now and i have done much more... But you get the picture...

The NICS red top has a butterfly shapped intake port on the head and the ECCS red top has a round intake hole...

All in all my point is that the 12 port head flow's more air in a minute than the ECCS 6 port head....