Buy, Build & Use A Tech Edge A/f Ratio Meter

[PHaT MR30]

any news SydneyKid?

[mokompri]

whatever happened to this ?

[CruiseLiner]

i want to buy one, but wanna hear how good it is b4 i spend the cash instead of buying a lm1. update please whats the going cost for the whole kit as sydneykid has now?

cheers

[Sydneykid]

Well, I finally had enough quiet time to complete the Tech Edge Test Procedures, all 16 pages of them. Thankfully it passed all tests first time through, so either my kit building skills are improving or I was just plain lucky.

This is what the finished product looks like.

The power cable has a cigarette lighter socket on the end for easy and quick temporary installation. The lambda sensor cable is long enough to reach to the tail pipe, but for this tuning I have removed the standard (slow and narrow) lambda sensor and replaced it with the Tech Edge supplied fast and wide Bosch sensor. I want to tune the low rpm, idle and cruise A/F ratios, so not having the standard lambda sensor (no closed loop running) is an advantage.

I have also made up a wiring harness to enable connection from the WB02 to the Power FC. This will facilitate the data logging of;

Throttle angle

Engine RPM

AFM voltage

Exhaust gas temperature

Engine water temperature

MAP sensor output

More details later………

cheers

PS; if you have considerable experience building electronics kits, have some rudimentary circuit reading skills and enjoy the challenge, this kit is one for you to consider. If you have never built a kit before this is NOT the kit for you.

Edited June 20, 2006 by Sydneykid

[Sydneykid]

Now that it is tested it, is time to actually use it. I did a quick fit to the project R33GTST, as it has a few of the usual mods, is running the default maps and consequently needs a little tuning.

The LD02 is on the dash above the Commander (reading 14.12 at idle, no closed loop). The WB02 itself is on the ash tray, you can see the running and lambda temp sesnor lights.

Mods to date on the R33GTST are;

Standard R32GTR intercooler

Alloy intercooler pipework with my preferred 120 degree bend at the throttle body

Turbosmart BOV

Power FC with Boost Control Kit

3” Kakimoto cat back

Magic 4” cat

NGK copper spark plugs

Boost is set at a ceramic safe 10 psi

R32GTR fuel pump

Nismo fuel pressure regulator

What I am looking at doing is tuning it using only the WB02 and the knock senor read out on the Power FC. Then sticking it on the dyno and comparing what I achieved with what our race team tuner can achieve with the Dyno Dynamics and the Motec lambda sensor as per a common dyno tune.

At a later date we will be fitting a GCG ball bearing high flow turbo with a Performance Metalcraft split dump, an injector upgrade and most likely a set of Tomei Poncams. The power target is to reach similar output to the R34GTT which was 265 rwkw. Once again I will tune it using the WB02 and then compare it with the dyno tuned results.

We are using the Tewblog logging program written by Justin Luton (downloadable from the Tech Edge web site. I have also registered the software as I feel Justin has done a great job and deserves his $US20. This also frees up some of the otherwise locked features, such as the ability to read large logged files. Which is important considering the 1MB logging upgrade I included with the WB02 build.

Over the next couple of days I will post up the Tewblog logs showing the out of the box (default) settings from the Power FC. Then I will tune it (maybe over the weekend) and post up the finished logs for a quick comparison.

cheers

Edited June 20, 2006 by Sydneykid

[Sydneykid]

A few of the guys have asked me about removing the standard lambda sensor. Following is a picture of the Bosch F&W lambda sensor plugged into the fitting on the standard dump.

Lambda sensors are usually very hard to remove and get to with a spanner. So I take the turbo heat shielding off and unplug the wiring pins from the standard plug. Then I can get a 22 mm ring spanner onto the lambda sensor hex and unscrew it.

More tuning progress shortly.

cheers

Edited June 20, 2006 by Sydneykid

[Sydneykid]

Did an hour of fuel economy tuning yesterday, leaning out the idle plus the 80 90, 100 and 110 kph cruise mapping for 4th and 5th gear. I changed 87 of the 100 load points between 1/1 and 10/10. It was running as rich as 12.5 to 1, so I leaned it out to 15.2 at idle and 15.0 at cruise.

This will improve the fuel consumption noticeably as the closed loop running takes some seconds of constant load before it kicks in. Plus only slight touches on the throttle drop it out of closed loop cruise. With the mapping tight around those load points it won't matter if it drops in and out of closed loop running.

When the gallery upload is working I will post up the relevant cells from the injection maps via Datalogit.

cheers

[paulr33]

so you've left 02 feedback on after this was done ?

[sav man]

can you hook a wideband sensor into datalogit, and get it to fill in the afr for each cell in the 20x20? Or is it better to use a separate afr reader?

[paulr33]

Yep datalogit supports that functionality out of the box with a few wideband sensors, the NGK wideband sensor seems to be the common one.

If you have an uncommon one you simply need to load the voltage scale for it so it maps it out correctly, ie 2.21volts = 16.45lambda and then it will work on the map.

[sav man]

so you can just get a common wideband sensor, plug it into the datalogit box, and it will fill the map with the afr numbers (like it can do with knock and what not)? That would make tuning easy as.

Edited April 25, 2006 by sav man

[paulr33]

Click for Screen Capture {Setup Auxiliary}

?AN inputs must be between 0~5 volts

• Set up Auxiliaries

o There are 4 Auxiliary channels and each has it’s own calibration depending on what you connect to it.

?AN1, AN2, AN3 and AN4

o If the output of the item you are logging is linear then you only need to enter two voltages to define the slope.

• For example; if you want to connect a particular Wideband o2 sensor controller which has a linear output. You need to define two voltages and their relative A/F values.

• Perhaps at 0 volts the A/F is 10 and at 5 volts the A/F is 20.

?Name the output units, in this case A/F.

?Name the item so you can find it in your log.

?Fill in the two voltages an A/Fs like so;

o More complex outputs, where the output can be defined with a curve, require a formula (a polynomial) Click the Poly button on the AN window and enter the values for a, b and c. {1-3-2-1 Polynomial}

o There is a separate scale factor box for each AN channel

Name Wide band

Volts Value Unit

0 10 A/F

5 20

• In this case a voltage of 2.5V will display an A/F value of 15 (:1).

?You need to find the correct scale factor for the sensor you are using.

1-3-2-1 Polynomial (Setup) ^

• Click for Screen Capture {Setup Polynomial}

?AN inputs must be between 0~5 volts

• Pop up window where you can input the values of a, b and c to define a curve to calibrate an AN input to be logged.

o More complex inputs, ones that can be defined by a curve, require a formula (a polynomial).

?Click the Poly button on the AN window and enter the values for a, b and c.

?For example. DIY Wideband set up. The graph of A/F vs. Output voltage is not a straight line.

?The easiest way to create the polynomial is to plot the values from the graph in to excel then use the “trend line” function. The “trend line” function will create a “best fit” curve by using a polynomial formula.

?Above is a picture of an xy graph on the values from the DIY A/F vs. Voltage graph.

?Un fortunately the curve of this graph doesn’t allow for a very nice polynomial.

?Above is a picture of the same values from the DIY A/F vs. Voltage and the resulting polynomial. The values for a, b and c are unusable because the curve they describe is not close enough to the actual curve of the plotted values.

?Luckily we are really only interested in the values that represent the A/F ratio between 10:1 ~15:1. If we limit the graph to that range and create the polynomial we get the following graph;

?This graph gave us the values we use for our DIY wideband.

?A=1.6344 b=2.1693 and C= 9.9414

?You can follow the same procedure to create a polynomial for other sensors.

[Sydneykid]

Recently we took the R33GTST out to WSID for a bit of a run. The mods so far are;

Power FC with Boost Control kit

Standard R32GTR FMIC with 120 degree intercooler pipework

Turbosmart BOV

NGK copper plugs plugs at 0.65 mm

Kakimoto 3" cat back

Magic 4" cat

Boost at 0.7 bar (10 psi)

Standard turbo, dump engine pipe, injectors, AFM

POD and ambient air feed

Full Group buy suspension kit

The Group Buy 255/50/16 MT ET radials on the rear

Unfortunately the unknown clutch died after 2 runs, but I did mange to log some A/F ratios with the Tech Edge WB02A. Using the TEWBLOG software this is a screen grab of one of the logged points;

Firstly ignore the EGT numbers, I didn't have the EGT sensor in the car.

1. The Green trace. The A/F ratio at this particualr point was 11.9, my target for tuning was 12.0. so not too bad. It sits between 11.8 and 12.0 for the whole run.

2. The Light Blue trace. Engine RPM, this reading was at 5,244 rpm in 3rd gear. I know it was in third gear because I counted the gearchanges (throttle opening drops to 0 volts) during the run.

3. The Red trace. AFM voltage is at 4.7 volts, so we have some more to go till we get to the RB25DET AFM 5.12 volt limit. The 4.7 volts agrees with the Commander readout.

4. The Dark Blue trace. Throtttle position was 3.9 volts, 100% throttle opening as you would expect. I do see slight drift in the reading between 3.9 and 4.0 volts, what the book says is 100% throttle opening voltage. I am not too concerned as 0.1 volt may just be the quality of my push in connections.

5. The Yellow trace. Boost (PFC Boost Control Kit MAP sensor) voltage is 2.9 volts, that is equal to 0.7 bar (10 psi). I haven't gotten around to writing a conversion table, boost versus volts. When I do, this window will display the boost in bar.

6. The Orange trace. Water temp 12 millivolts (82 degrees C), I haven't gotten around to writing a conversion table, temp versus volts. When I do, this window will display the water temp in degrees C.

Looking at the trace map, you can see lots of idling at zero or low throttle openings in the que. Then a burst of high throttle opening, the burn out (not really a true burn out). Then a little bit of idling, the 1/4 run itself and then plenty more idling and driving back to the pits. The high Red trace (throttle opening) tells you where the action was.

That's what you can learn out of the Tech Edge in one run. I have no idea what power the R33GTST is making, it has never been on the dyno. Using the AFM voltage of 4.7 volts and the TS of 100 mph I would reckon soemwhere in the 170 to 180 rwkw range. Until we stick the GCG ball bearing high flow turbo on it I probably won't bother puting it on the dyno. I will tune it with the WB02A as we go along, then I will check the readings with the Motec A/F ratio meter we have with the dyno.

cheers

Edited June 12, 2006 by Sydneykid

[T-u-R-b-O]

yup, u got PM ... maybe it'll be interesting for other wbo2 users here to know the pin outputs that you had send me... values contain RPM, AFM, TPS, Water Temp and few others...

would be good to have the pin layout from factory ECU on here for logging information...

Nico

[T-u-R-b-O]

here are some of the ECU plug pin layouts (thanks to Sydneykid)

Tacho signal = Pin 5

MAP sensor signal = Boost Control Kit MAP sensor plug

AFM voltage = Pin 54

Throtle position = Pin 23

Water Temp = Pin 56

RPM = Pin 7

hope that this can help people...

Nico

[Sydneykid]

A few guys have asked my (via PM’s) for a quick rundown on the tuning methodology. This is what I do;

I tune the (up to temperature) idle first in the driveway with closed loop off (unplug the slow and narrow lamba sensor), I aim for 15 to 1 at all idle rpms (aircon, power steer, electric load).

Once that is done I then drive to my favourite test road, it has a long hill with good visibility and a freeway bit at the end. I punch the logging button as soon as it is making some boost in 3rd gear on the way up the hill. Then I stop, upload and look at the TEBLOG data on the laptop, make some changes, then back up the hill again. My target is 12 to 1 at full boost and I have enough experience with the Power FC to guess the changes needed. Once or twice up the hill with quick adjustments in between, that’s about all I need to get a good base tune. At all times I watch the Commander knock readings to make sure I am not getting any knock readings above 20.

Then I do the cruise tuning, down the freeway. Log it at 80 kph, then 90 kph then 100 kph then 110 kph in 4th gear then repeat in 5th gear. Get to the end of the 6 k stretch, stop and adjust to achieve 15 to 1. Then drive back home, checking the A/F ratios as I go.

The trickiest bit to tune is the boost build load/rpm range. I don’t know whether the following is right or not, but I do know it is safe. Remember the off boost load/rpm is tuned for 15 to 1 and the on full boost is tuned for 12 to 1. As soon as I see any boost I tune for 11 to 1 A/F ratios, that’s about as safe as I like to make it. You could probably get away with ramping it straight to 12 as the boost builds, but I like it safe in that area.

I then take the lap top inside and take a long look at the load points I have adjusted. I then fill in the load points in between, it’s pretty logical/simple stuff. The basic shape of the Power FC default maps are truly excellent.

I then stick the lap top back in the car with the Datalogit plugged in and tune the ignition timing, the no knock over 20 rule applies. If I do that in one night it takes me from 8 pm till around 10.30 pm to get a satisfactory tune. I then drive it around for a few days, watching the knock and punching the logging on and off when I fee like it (that’s where the 2mb comes in handy). After a few days of mixed conditions I upload the log into TEWBLOG and make any fine tuning adjustments that I see are necessary.

When we go to the drags, I plug the WB02 in and log each run. I also have the A/F ratio display up on the dash (that’s where the small size comes in handy). The drivers (both of us) know that any long readings (ignoring the leanness on gearchanges of course) at above 12 to 1 means a problem and he will abort the run. The driver also punches the start log button before each run, sometimes one of the drivers forgets to turn it off though. I have a look at the log afterwards just to make sure all is well and maybe do a little bit of fine tuning at the same time.

Having had the WB02 for a couple of months now I don’t see how I could live with out it. I used to go to the dyno 3 or 4 times to tune a car after any serious parts upgrades and it’s an hour’s drive from my home. Plus I was never 100% happy with the off boost tuning, you just never seem to have enough time on the dyno to get it right. Now it is beautiful, the cars run nice at all loads and rpms and get good fuel economy, which I never ever got around to tuning on the dyno.

The only missing bit is I don’t know the power output, plus I would like to compare the accuracy of the WB02 to the Motec A/F ratio meter we use in the dyno room. I check the free air calibration of the WB02 regularly and it is very stable. I will pop over to the dyno one day soon and give the R33GTST a quick power run, logging everything. Then I can compare it to the WB02 A/F ratios.

When the new RB31DET goes in the R32GTST I will tune it on the track as I run it in, as it is not registered. I reckon in one day I can run the engine in and tune it, then I will pop it on the dyno and let Dyno Dave tell me how good or bad I am. I do know that I am crap on the dyno as I am too slow, what takes me an hour to do Dyno Dave does in 20 minutes. That’s why he is the race team tuner and I am the race team manager.

Hopefully that answered a few questions

cheers

Edited June 20, 2006 by Sydneykid

[png godzilla]

Hey Guys only new here, 2nd post i think.

i looked at building a kit, but i'm not real electronically minded.

so i got a ready to go kit from the US from a company called Innovative Motorsports.

Check it out here,

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lm1.php

i got the LM-1 with the LMA-2 RPM converter. we don't have any dyno shops up here, nor do we have any diagnostic equipped workshops, so adding mods can be real dicey if you don't know what your A/F is doing.

i have the A/F, RPM & TPS being data logged at present & soon to add Boost & Hopefully some sort of signal from the rear knock sensor.

i was just starting to do some logging/testing out on the highway but unfortunately i shat 3rd gear, so i've been bussy installing my new PAR Gear Set.

hopefully back up & running this week end.

i have a couple of test logs that i could post once i work out how?

[Sydneykid]

Hey Guys only new here, 2nd post i think.

i looked at building a kit, but i'm not real electronically minded.

so i got a ready to go kit from the US from a company called Innovative Motorsports.

Check it out here,

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lm1.php

i got the LM-1 with the LMA-2 RPM converter. we don't have any dyno shops up here, nor do we have any diagnostic equipped workshops, so adding mods can be real dicey if you don't know what your A/F is doing.

i have the A/F, RPM & TPS being data logged at present & soon to add Boost & Hopefully some sort of signal from the rear knock sensor.

i was just starting to do some logging/testing out on the highway but unfortunately i shat 3rd gear, so i've been bussy installing my new PAR Gear Set.

hopefully back up & running this week end.

i have a couple of test logs that i could post once i work out how?

Had an LM1 before (good unit), it got sold with one of the team race cars.

Please post up your tuning experiences, every little bit of knowledge helps.

Cheers

[png godzilla]

SK,

cool, love this thread & i'm gonna print it out & study carefully.

my experience is very limited, but the main reason for purchasing the LM1 is that the only fuel we get here is 91 pump gas, nothing else, NO other option. (except i can get my hads on unleaded Avgas, but too expensive to run day to day) so along with my new Garrett GT2860R turbos & other mods & installed a Water / Methanol Injection system & the A/F Meter.

my theory is that the Water / Methanol will cool the intake charge & avoid the pinking caused by Low octane fuels.

i'll have a go at posting a couple of Graphs. you will notice that the A/F ratio richens up around 75% of the RPM range in each gear, this i believe coincides with the Water / Methanol injection which cuts in at 0.95 bar on a pressure switch. so from that i guess i can say it works. now i just need to play with the figures & reports & build some fuel maps to smaten up the problem areas. Main thing is, it doesn't appear to be leaning out too much under power & cruise is good at about 14.

i haven't put the AFC & the 700cc Sard injectors in yet. but once i get some good datalogging recorded i will do the install & then do the same Logging runs again & compair.

the first one is from cruise at 100kph, back to second gear & hard accelleration through to 4th gear

then the second recording is from a rolling start in 1st gear, then WOT from approx 4000rpm through to 4th gear redline

the last one i have done to date is, a cruise at 100kph

how do the figures look to you guys?

all these runs done on Pump Gas 91, Water & Methanol set to kick in at 0.95 bar & running 1.1 bar boost.

i can't wait to get the boost, Duty Cycle & Knock sensors hooked up so i can log it all together!

should make my onboard "Seat of the Pants Dyno" fairly accurate as i wind in more boost on S H I t E fuel!!

[Sydneykid]

SK,

cool, love this thread & i'm gonna print it out & study carefully.

my experience is very limited, but the main reason for purchasing the LM1 is that the only fuel we get here is 91 pump gas, nothing else, NO other option. (except i can get my hads on unleaded Avgas, but too expensive to run day to day) so along with my new Garrett GT2860R turbos & other mods & installed a Water / Methanol Injection system & the A/F Meter.

my theory is that the Water / Methanol will cool the intake charge & avoid the pinking caused by Low octane fuels.

i'll have a go at posting a couple of Graphs. you will notice that the A/F ratio richens up around 75% of the RPM range in each gear, this i believe coincides with the Water / Methanol injection which cuts in at 0.95 bar on a pressure switch. so from that i guess i can say it works. now i just need to play with the figures & reports & build some fuel maps to smaten up the problem areas. Main thing is, it doesn't appear to be leaning out too much under power & cruise is good at about 14.

i haven't put the AFC & the 700cc Sard injectors in yet. but once i get some good datalogging recorded i will do the install & then do the same Logging runs again & compair.

the first one is from cruise at 100kph, back to second gear & hard accelleration through to 4th gear

then the second recording is from a rolling start in 1st gear, then WOT from approx 4000rpm through to 4th gear redline

the last one i have done to date is, a cruise at 100kph

how do the figures look to you guys?

all these runs done on Pump Gas 91, Water & Methanol set to kick in at 0.95 bar & running 1.1 bar boost.

i can't wait to get the boost, Duty Cycle & Knock sensors hooked up so i can log it all together!

should make my onboard "Seat of the Pants Dyno" fairly accurate as i wind in more boost on S H I t E fuel!!

Running 91 ron really kills the performance. Maybe try some toluene, it works well, slip about 23% in with the fuel , that’s 15 litres in with 50 litre of 91 ron petrol in a 65 litre tank. Toluene is 122 ron, so that mix ratio will get you a bit over 98 ron. You should be able to buy toluene in PNG, a 160 or 200 litre drum would be the go. Then decant it into a 20 litre drum for filling at the servo when get petrol.

Don’t spill it on the paintwork, toluene is paint stripper.

Try this thread for some useful tips;

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...3059&hl=Toluene

Some random thoughts;

1. The A/F ratios are a fair bit rich at around 10.5 to 1, what tuning have you done so far?

2. What ECU does it have?

3. The cruise A/F is usually closer to 15 to 1, not the 14’s you are seeing, have you adjusted the aim table?

4. Actually, are you running closed loop for idle and cruise?

Cheers