Bosch Coil Pack Conversion - Help Needed

[RB30-POWER]

I fully understand, the importance of charge times, recovery times, dwell etc

However,

The proof is in the pudding.

So many people are doing this conversion now with great sucess.

So meh....

The trouble people have with the standard coils as it is, its preety hard to downgrade

I will certainly be giving it a go when my coils shit themself. (However i leave the coil cover off to let the heat escape, so hopefully the standard coils last a while)

There is probally no reason why the RB30 ignitor won't work with this conversion either. (You will need 6 of course) But i have seen an RB30 ignitor used when one of the transistors failed on the RB20 6 ignitor pack. (The RB30 ignitor was used to bypass the faulty transistor in the ignitor pack, as a temp fix)

It worked 100% as well.

Know one has done it yet, but might be another way of going if you can get 6 RB30 ignitors cheaper then RB20 item.

[Lazy-Bastard]

OK, after having a closer look at that guys site ( http://gdz1la.kol.co.nz/prod01.htm ) it all *seems* pretty straight-forward.

I have edited a couple of the pics as well a bad one I took of my igniter/loom.

Can anyone confirm whether my understanding is correct or not.

These are the instructions as posted on his site:

1. Start buy trimming all insulation off the igniter - to- coils loom,

2. Study the wiring, note the cyl 1 loop (for timing lights) and the earth wire ring, these are both black, the rest are all colored, from picture left to right is GND, cly6 cly5 cly4 cly3 cly2 cly1

3. The coil is non polarized, meaning if you get this back to front you will NOT Damage the coil. Each segment (there are 3) is a individual coil they are totally isolated from each other,

4. To Power the coil run the fat white wire from the 3 pin plug, this supplies the power to coil, run this wire to either the top 3 or the bottom 3 pins (remember its non polarized)

5. Now join cyl 6 & 1 wires then connect to  coil on a left or right side (depends on where you want leads mounted) opposing a power wire, these are the gnd pulse signals that fire the plugs,

6. join cyl 5 & 2, connect to  coil on a un-used tab, I usually use the centre one, opposing a power wire,

join cyl 3 & 4, connect to  coil on a un-used tab (the last one left), I u, opposing a power wire,

7. all tabs are now filled, 3 power feeds top or bottom, and the 6 gnd trigger feeds (which you have bridged into 3) insolate them so nothing can touch them, I usually bend them over, solder then use a liquid electrical tape, inso spade terminals are good 4 people without irons,

8. label the individual coils with there correct cyl on front somewhere they are obliviously in pairs of cyl 1&6,  2&5, 3&4

9. check everything twice especially the cyl 1 black wire is NOT the gnd, and you have the igniter gnd wire ready with ring to earth,

10. mount coil pack, somewhere away from heat (not above exhaust)

11. measure you ign lead length from a coil post to the plug, this will vary on where you install pack, purchase your leads - there is a falcon 6cy model that has a similar set, but I always have just brought them individually as its always been cheaper,

12. plug in leads, label the ends with correct cyl and plug them all in,

13. crank and then your away, DONE!

should take between 1-2 hours,

My Understanding is as follows:

This is the Igniter to coils loom mentioned in step 1 and 2. Haven’t had a close look yet due to fading light, but I think the GND wire connects to the back of the head, so nothing really needs to be done with this one except maybe extend it to meet the new coil pack location. The other wires are obviously the ground pulse triggers for each cylinder.

This is the 3 pin plug mentioned in step 4. Initially I thought he was talking about the fat white wire on the 3 pin connector at each of the factory coil pack, but I'm pretty certain he means this one.

The way I read the instructions, you just loop this across the 3 positive terminals on the wasted spark type coil pack, or if you are running 6 individual coils like the Bosch MEC717, do the same across the 6 + terminals.

This is the coil pack that the guy is using. I imagine the AU one would be pretty similar. Obviously if you were using the 6 coil setup there would be no grouping of the wires coming from the loom.

That’s my understanding of the instructions given.

Anyone want to comment or offer suggestions?

[Lazy-Bastard]

BUT!!!!

after reading this thread ( http://forums.skylinesdownunder.co.nz/showthread.php?t=44280 ) I think RB30-POWER might be right about the RB20 igniter.

I have been in contact with GunMetalR33 who has done the Bosch 6 coil conversion to see which igniter he used.

I can't see any reason why the RB25 igniter wouldn't work with a 6 coil setup. Perhaps you would have to earth each of the coils with the 'E' wire off the factory loom. As I have said before I am dangerous when it comes to auto electrics so this is all very much guesstimation.

[xr8eater]

how did you get on warwick

[Let Me Drive]

also would like to know?

[Lazy-Bastard]

Haven't done the conversion yet. Hopefully some time in January.

I will report back with the results

how did you get on warwick

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[JamesUK]

Also very interested in this. Does anyone know if this conversion can be done with the standard ECU and what seperate igniter pack if any I should be looking for if I have a seriesII RB25DET?

cheers,

James

[R31Heaven]

This is a bit of a dig up of an old thread, but I have, well my Auto Elec done this conversion on my RB20DET NICS, here is a link to the thread on R31 Skyline club, seems to working fine so far, you may be able to adapt it for the RB25. The only reason I went this way is that the old nics engines connectors to the coil packs were getting old and heat affected and gone brittle, and you cant buy the plugs anymore. The whole conversion cost me around the $250 mark. but i would of prefered going the splitfire path costing around $650

Follow th link below to see how members on th R31 club webisite have been doing them, both the single coil pack and the AU Falcon method are on here, might shed some light.

AU Falcon coil pack converson

Edited March 17, 2006 by R31Heaven

[Lazy-Bastard]

OK, I finally bit the bullet and did it.

The wiring was actually the easy part. The hardest part was fabricating the mounting bracket and finding somewhere to mount it.

I currently have a few teething problems though. The car idles a drives fine (possibly smoother than before) and also boosts fine UNTIL I hit ANYTHING over 11psi and then it starts to misss REALLY badly, like on all cylinders.

I had the boost set to 14psi initially. Boost would build nice and quick (turbotech BC) and then as soon as it went over 11psi it would start to stutter and then at 14psi it hits what feels like boost cut (like hitting a brick wall) and then start to miss really badly after that.

I wound the boost down to 12psi and same story, boosts fine and pulls hard up to 10psi but as soon as you hit 11 or anything over it misses on all cylinders.

I am beginning to suspect that it is the ECU going R&R but I don't really want to spend ~$1000 on a PFC to find out.

I have an SAFC2 at the moment. Does anyone know if I should be able to tune *around* the ECU's R&R with this?

Here are a few pics. I still need to tidy up the wiring and mounting bracket as it's not too aesthetically pleasing atm.

[xr8eater]

i couldent help but notice the wires to your throtle sensor are missing

isn't that imput ment to go from the throtle sensor into your safc?????

[RB30-POWER]

That ignition cut is the ecu, wind the boost down to standard or buy a PowerFc.

Performance always comes at a cost.

[Lazy-Bastard]

That ignition cut is the ecu, wind the boost down to standard or buy a PowerFc.

Performance always comes at a cost.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But it was running 14psi fine with the factory coils......

I thought it might have been the plugs (bcpr6es gapped at .7) so I changed them for new ones (gapped at 1.1) and it is exactly the same, so there goes that theory.

How about the safc2....will this help help with the ignition cut issue?

[Lazy-Bastard]

i couldent help but notice the wires to your throtle sensor are missing

isn't that imput ment to go from the throtle sensor into your safc?????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think the TPS plug you are talking about is only used for autos. I have seen other manual 33's with nothing connected.

[noise]

splitfires are so cheap these days and just plug straight in dont they?

[R31Heaven]

Ive never looked at a RB25 but I am asure the plug at the front should be connected. Does it have one on the base as well by the looks?

[Lazy-Bastard]

I think that plug just below and to the left (of the plug you are talking about) connects to the same sensor

[GunMetalR33]

How are you coils going lazy-bastard?

I noticed that your mounting bracket might be bolted to the block and the engine bay, remember that the engine needs to move...

Also have you earthed the mounting bracket with the E wire? Is so then using the supplied + and - from the earth should work fine.

Also the rb25det ignitor is also fine with this conversion. I have had it running 19psi now with very small ign cuts from time to time but overall I am very happy with it.

I will take pics of my setup if anyone wants to see it.

[Lazy-Bastard]

How are you coils going lazy-bastard?

I noticed that your mounting bracket might be bolted to the block and the engine bay, remember that the engine needs to move...

Also have you earthed the mounting bracket with the E wire? Is so then using the supplied + and - from the earth should work fine.

Also the rb25det ignitor is also fine with this conversion. I have had it running 19psi now with very small ign cuts from time to time but overall I am very happy with it.

I will take pics of my setup if anyone wants to see it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi Mate,

No, the bracket is only mounted to the firewall.

At first I didn't have the bracket earthed with the E wire (wqs running fine though) but after the miss started I did connect it to the bracket (just at 1 point though as I assumed this would earth the entire bracket) even though it *should* be earthed by the screws to the firewall.

I was a bit hurried when I did the wiring so just used the factory loom and crimped the connectors onto the end. Maybe the crimped connections aren't up to the task so I have made up a new loom with all the connections soldered and an earth lead for each coil. I will install it tomorrow and see if that helps.

When you say you are getting small ignition cuts, what does it feel like? Is it like a miss or a complete engine cut type feeling?

Yes, please post pics of your install.

Edited February 6, 2006 by Lazy-Bastard

[GunMetalR33]

When you say you are getting small ignition cuts, what does it feel like? Is it like a miss or a complete engine cut type feeling?

Yes, please post pics of your install.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I get small (misses) but only for the first boost or so, once the plugs warm up she's fine. I am running cold plugs (Irraway 7 NGK's from memory). The misses might also be caused by a air leak after the AFM which closes when the pipes are hot???

I will get pics up so, they will be from a mobile though :{

Edited February 6, 2006 by GunMetalR33

[xr8eater]

it may be your intake pipe collapsing