Targa Tasmania GTR's

[SHUTO-BOY]

I was just watching this motorworld show rerun and they showed

a black r33 gtr and a white r34 gtr ripping the road during targa tasmania.The drivers displayed so much purple control in their gtr's it was so insane.Just wondering if anyone has any info,specs about these 2 cars. Ultimate porsche killers.

rally fan

[Silver-Arrowz]

I think the 34 was a N1. Don't know about specs.

Steve from justjap is on the forums. He takes his 32 gtr and goes nuts on the roads down there too.

[SHUTO-BOY]

http://www.importdriver.com.au/News1.htm

some tas pics there, and scrolling down further, an interesting "new gtr?" news

Yep the numberplate said GTR N1,had a nice carbon fibre bonnet too.I guess Steve must trust his navigator alot and must be lots of mental pressure, or is he just having fun?

[gtrken]

Just announced that Jason and John White are running a new R34VSpec for Targa which is a good thing seeing they came 3rd last year in a evo7

When I was there on 01 he said the GTR was his weapon of choice and they wre going to build a kickass one.

Cheers

( wished I was there again)

Ken

[2rismo]

New HPI has a story on the Black R33 GTR non V-Spec that was running 2nd for a lot of the way last year.

Good read. The same guy's campaigning an R34 GTR N1 this year.

[fatz]

is that black one owned by the guys who own the seafood place at five dock

they have a poster inside the shop showing the car

i wondered how they could afford that then i dawned on me

1 barrumundi burger (average)

6 callimari rings

and a small chips

cost

25 dollars

ended up getting maccas casue i was so hungry after that meal

they have a line out the door so maybe they just did me over

we r all in the wrong industry

[2rismo]

It's owned by a guy named Steve Glenney.

"...an unnassuming horse trainer from the South Australian country town of Wistow..."

kinda begs for the, '...enjoys long walks on the beach and dancing in the rain..." treatment.

Above courtesy of M.Donnon HPI.

[CaStLe]

Nissan Skyline GT-R V-SPEC II N1

The white GTR is in the April 2002 edition of WHEELS Magazine, in which they put it up against a 300kw HSV Monaro GTS. Quite an interesting article to read actually. Spose i could quote some parts of it and post some of the results if anybody is interested.

[MattR]

Steve is running a gtr n1, Number plates GTR N1. Jim richards may have something to worry bout this year. Steves car looks very clean and tidy.

[SHUTO-BOY]

Please do Castle,

Did he buy the car new from nissan or something?Yea if he he wins,itll be a big boost for the import community.They should bring back the new GTR and race againts v8 supercars(far fetched)imagine what a nice sunday we could have watching motorsports on tv.

Rally fan

[CaStLe]

Nah, the guy imported the car himself, had nothing to do with Nissan. After frieght costs, compliance, and registration etc, it cost him AU$170,000.

Back in this article, the car was pretty much stock. they got it down the 1/4 mile in 12.7seconds @ 178km/h, which beat the Monaros 13.9seconds @ 168km/h.

On paper, the GTR was claimed to have 206kw, when they put it on the dyno it came up with 214rwkw. Funny that the Monaro is claimed to have 300kw, and when they put it on the dyno it only produced 230kw.

And yeah, i would love to see the GTR's racing against the supercars again, but somehow i dont think that its gonna happen

[Xeron]

HP in cars is measured at the flywheel by manufactures, actually i believe its behind the transmission now days, but either way its not at the wheels. A car getting only 70% of its rated HP on a wheel dyno test is quite acceptable.

[ultim8DTM5]

Originally posted by Xeron

HP in cars is measured at the flywheel by manufactures, actually i believe its behind the transmission now days, but either way its not at the wheels. A car getting only 70% of its rated HP on a wheel dyno test is quite acceptable.

Some interesting reading for you.

Seriously, one thing your all forgetting is that the GTR is not a 4WD car. It is never completely 4WD, so you are always going to get a variation when running the car on a dyno and on the track.  

You have less driveline loss when the car is 100% RWD. As traction and G's dictate how much power is sent to the fronts, you incurr a greater loss through the transfer case, fron diff and front tyres, in proportion to the amount of power sent to the front wheels.  

So, all these calculations of acceleration over time, which take the vehicle weight and power at the wheels, require you to factor in the amount of torque split that the GTR will be at any single moment in time during the run.  

Easy to do on a RWD car, and if you locked your GTR into RWD and did the complete run, you'd find that you would be pretty close to the mark with your HP to ET/Trap Speed estimates.  

On the subject of power loss through the drivetrain. A lot of power is "lost" through the drivetrain. There is a common misconception that all of the "loss" is just converted into heat energy, it is not. A majority is, but there is also the conversion to sound (noise) and slipping of clutch surfaces (the clutch and clutch packs).  

Take into consideration that from the flywheel, there is the clutch (which has some slip, no matter how strong it is), then there is the gearbox with all of its rotating shafts and fluids, then there is the transfer case (which is a clutch pack and has a parasitic drive to the front prop shaft) then onto the rear prop shafts (joined with a CV joint) then onto the rear differential, which has to split the drive 90 degrees through whatever clutch/split mechanism your diff is constructed from, then through the rear drive shafts, via two sets of flex joins to the hubs, then the hubs and brake rotors, then the wheel rims, which contain tyres, which then mate to the road surface.  

Now back to the front prop shaft, it goes into the front differential, which splits the drive 90 degrees, much akin to the rear differential, through to the front drive shafts which have the same layout as the rears, through the the tyres.  

When on a dyno (or the track) all of these interface points will combine to create a parasitic loss, not just from friction events, but also from the acceleration of the weight of the assemblies (have you any idea how much power it takes to accelerate just a 10 Kg brake disc rotor? Keep in mind that on disc brakes, there is always some touching of the pads to the disc surface as well...)  

The majority of the "loss" (I should say energy conversion, but you get the idea) is actually from the wheel and tyre interface, this is why all of those "hub dynos" are a waste of time and provide figures that are not a real indication - as I don't know of anyone who drives their car on the street without wheels and tyres, so any power figure that they produce is missing these vital components - especially the tyres...  

They tyres are responsible for the greatest portion of lost energy smply because they are the main interface that provides traction - feel your tyres (and check the differences in tyre pressures and internal temperature) between dyno runs for an indication of how much power they are able to sap and dissipate into the air.  

Basically, a hell of a lot of energy is lost through the drivetrain, and whilst not in direct linear proportion to the power output of the motor, the "losses" are greater with higher output. I find that a majority of the "losses" are attributable to the speed of rotating assemblies (with shafts, tyres, etc all have friction points that occur more frequently with greater speed, be it engine shaft speed, gearbox output shaft speeds or wheel speed) the faster these items move, the greater the number of friction events in the same time frame, hence the greater the power lost to these events.  

Torque also plays a major part in power lost - as an increase in torque (at the same speed) will induce a greater load onto items like shaft bearings, wheel bearings, mated gear tooth surfaces, torsional diff mounts, engine and drive train mounts, axial loads on drive and prop shafts, are all increased, and as a result, they have a profound effect upon the previously mentioned friction events, and provide a magnification of the same said events, hence that the occurance of those same events now incurr a much greater loss per event.  

In short, there is no hard and fast rule to calculate drive train losses, infact, I'd go so far to say that it is virtually impossible to calculate to any reliable degree how much loss a particular vehicle will incurr. It can't be done, there are simply too many variables to consider - and which change based upon other variables, which in turn are affected by others... and it just goes on.  

As to the comment that someone made about "boiling oil" they are actually close to the mark - there is a reason why the underside of any car has the gearbox and majority of the driveline open to the air - it makes more sense for economy to enclose the entire underside of a car with aero deflector plates and/or undertrays, as fuel economy and Cd would be greatly reduced - the reasons it isn't done is to allow the drivetain to cool - it does require the ability to dissipate the accumulated heat, else the oil would boil and in some exreme cases, the metals (of the shafts and bell housings, etc) could reach temperatures where they would melt.  

I have a great many sensors on my GTR - every component of the driveline (save shafts, because I couldn't work out how to do it...  has both fluid temperature and pressure. Every casing has a temperature sensor sender that is also logged. I can tell you without a doubt, that on the dyno, on a DynoDynamics certified 1,000 HP at the wheels run (~745 kW, probably about 1500 DynoJet HP.... Using the aforementioned smaller Amercian horses... Hehe  the amount of heat put through various components is as follows, for a 10 second run:  

Gearbox was +70 degrees Celcius.  

Front diff was +87 degrees Celcius (affected by being in engine bay and attached to the block).  

Rear diff was +79 degrees Celcius.  

*: These are deltas, as in the additional heat that was added during the run (Ie: Post.Temp - Pre.Temp = Delta.Temp).  

Tyre temps were not checked, but they were spinning enough to leave melted rubber onto the underside of the wheel arches. Interesting to note that tyre pressures were 30 psi and after the run, they were 39psi - in 10 seconds... work it out.  

Sorry for the rant, one day I'll write up something more scientific, but the bottom line is that a hell of a lot of power is used to drive the drivetrain - and especially the tyres - not the mention the acceleration of shafts and rotating assemblies.

[targa]

Just read your post about Targa

My R33 finished 4th last year

only 5 sec off 3rd

6th in 2001 (gearbox fell out)

3rd in 2000 the hardest year of all

If you want to know about it let me know

[Targa Tom]

Think you ran a Jag years ago too??? You seem to appear on the Vids often, probably could have called yourself Targa Vet... LOL

How is the Porsche coming along? Are they as easy to drive as "some people" make them look? Garwood is also rumoured to have a big "P" in his garage

My partner and I will be on the grid #832 this year.

See you there 807 or 9??

Ciao

[SHUTO-BOY]

i hope theres more coverage of targa in tv

[Targa Tom]

Because of the nature of trhe event and Tassie's limited OBU's you will only see a little on the Box.

Southern Cross TV hold the rights and copyright to any footage from the event. They do a good highlights vid which usually has added footage...ie 2002 has the whole of the sidling from onboard with Steven Glenny (SA) Gt-R

The best way to enjoy it is do what I am doing SHUTO-BOY throw a cage in your car, con your girlfriend into sitting in the Jesus seat and going to see why "Targa" has done this rally heaps and some others as well.... I'm tipping it will be a hoot.

The other way is pop on the spirit of Tassie and follow the event for a couple of days...

I've been away from Tas for 20 years, but the roads still amaze me

C-YA

[Silver-Arrowz]

Don't it cost a pretty penny to enter?

I had the funny thought of getting a mini and slapping in a roll cage and go bonkers down there.

[Targa Tom]

ONLY WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT.....

I decided I wanted to do the event 10 years ago... or maybe even at the first one I thought "this is cool...

It has become more expensive every year since...

Our Budget for 03 is $AUD30k. But includes one off purchases like the car and seats etc.

We intend to do it for three years. and I would suggest it will become about $15k/year.

I raced international sprint karts in Oz 20 years ago and they were costing that....

So I think for a 500 k race per day for 5 days plus a prolog it is cheap!!!!

Dont just talk about it... do it!!! You're a long time dead and the last time I looked they dont bury money or realestate... only memories

Ciao

[targa]

Garwood has bought Jim Richards 996 turbo porsche and Mark Saxby 993 turbo

My new porsche is a little bit quicker than the GTR but nowhere near as easy or nice to drive as the GTR

"Time will tell"

We did 93,94,95,96 in the Jag

"The Two Ton *****"

97, 200sx

skipped 98

99,2000,01,02 in the GTR

It's a great event, best drive you can ever do What ever you do Targa Tom don't crash it in the first couple of days A lot of first timers do.

I did the first year

both the quick GTRs crashed last year its a long event so you need to take it easy to finish