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Water Methanol Injection (for 95 Ron Fuel Users)

The Mafia

By The Mafia,
in Engines & Forced Induction

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The Mafia Grand Master

The Mafia

Posted
Posted

Hi guys, as you see in this thread - http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...showtopic=89613

I didn't make my goal power target. I missed it by quite a bit. We've narrowed it down to poor fuel. Up in north QLD here, mackay doesn't have anything better than 95 octane.

Now to battle this, I am going to look at some sort of Water methanol injection setup. Its seems to be the cheapest option in the long run. I mean I could ship drums of 98ron up, but when my car burns a tank in 200kms..that would be painful.

Also, constantly adding toluene would be expensive and a pain in the ass. The shit is getting expensive.

I've worked out - water methanol injection once set up would cost rougly $3 - $5 a tank extra. (200l Drum of Methanol costs around $200) and 5l of distilled water is about $4

Talking ot my friend that has a 375rwkw supra here that had to switch to this system, he uses 3l of methanol and 3l of water per tank of fuel. He gained 100hp (or 65rwkw) out of it. Now I know that I am not going to make this kind of power extra, but I'm gonig to be able to reach my target safely, and increase the life of my engine.

ok...theres all of my justification. Now the good part - The setup. These kits are a piece of piss - pump, wiring, jet, sensors etc.

The kit my mate has, has got a maf sensor, and increases nozzle pressure as the boost increases. This would be the best type of setup imo. here is the site where he got it from - http://www.full-throttle.com.au/Engine/stage2_MAF.htm

I really would like some input here guys, as I really need some help here, I'm one of the few that isn't as lucky as you guys to get 98ron fuel :P

SK, you better drop some info if you have any here....or I'll blow up your mailbox..hehe jokes..

so yeah.... Discuss!

paulr33 Grand Master

paulr33

Posted
Posted

i know of a 200sx in melb that uses it, they were able to dial in 1 or 2 extra psi with no extra detonation or knocking. i feel there is more to your power being less than we currently know, ie: exhaust, fuel pump, afr's etc so water/methanol might not be the be-all endall solution. again great idea, hope you sort it out

68charger Apprentice

68charger

Posted
Posted

There is heaps of information here>> http://snowperformance.net/ Their kits although expensive are very highly regarded especially amongst the big horse power turbo diesel crowd. Hope it can help you somewhat.

Hi guys, as you see in this thread - http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...showtopic=89613

I didn't make my goal power target. I missed it by quite a bit. We've narrowed it down to poor fuel. Up in north QLD here, mackay doesn't have anything better than 95 octane.

Now to battle this, I am going to look at some sort of Water methanol injection setup. Its seems to be the cheapest option in the long run. I mean I could ship drums of 98ron up, but when my car burns a tank in 200kms..that would be painful.

Also, constantly adding toluene would be expensive and a pain in the ass. The shit is getting expensive.

I've worked out - water methanol injection once set up would cost rougly $3 - $5 a tank extra. (200l Drum of Methanol costs around $200) and 5l of distilled water is about $4

Talking ot my friend that has a 375rwkw supra here that had to switch to this system, he uses 3l of methanol and 3l of water per tank of fuel. He gained 100hp (or 65rwkw) out of it. Now I know that I am not going to make this kind of power extra, but I'm gonig to be able to reach my target safely, and increase the life of my engine.

ok...theres all of my justification. Now the good part - The setup. These kits are a piece of piss - pump, wiring, jet, sensors etc.

The kit my mate has, has got a maf sensor, and increases nozzle pressure as the boost increases. This would be the best type of setup imo. here is the site where he got it from - http://www.full-throttle.com.au/Engine/stage2_MAF.htm

I really would like some input here guys, as I really need some help here, I'm one of the few that isn't as lucky as you guys to get 98ron fuel  :P

SK, you better drop some info if you have any here....or I'll blow up your mailbox..hehe jokes..

so yeah.... Discuss!

The Mafia Grand Master

The Mafia

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

the 200kms per tank id the first 10 load points on the maps, which haven't been tuned yet. Its only been given a full throttle tune.

Thanks for your input 68charger, the link I provided is the exact same kit I have linked. Must be pretty popular unit by the looks.

And I do think the problem is fuel, as I've had about 5 people tell me now that the switch from our dirty 95 to 98 run gave them up to 30rwkw in some areas.

Just remember guys that its very hot and humidup here. Today is close to 35 degrees.

Paul, its not the exhaust........ its huge, there are no restrictions. Its detonation. Detonation caused by bad fuel and hot weather. I wish we had better fuel...

Edited by The Mafia
benl1981 Grand Master

benl1981

Posted
Posted

200kms a tank - you sure your injectors and everything in your fuel system is up to spec. My R33 running on an untuned PFC (so should be rich) gives about 400km to a tank at least. Slightly more than standard ECU but not much.

Is 200km when you are on the hammer?

Injectors not giving out a nice fine spray or a clogged fuel filter could contribute to the pinging.

justin911 Grand Master

justin911

Posted
Posted

my pfc also gives me about 220km because its not tuned for fuel eco either...

you might also want to checkout http://www.coolingperformance.com.

Theres a guy on NS.com whos a distributor for them.. its about $400 and comes with a pressure switch to active at a certain psi, and also an alarm for when the water/methanol etc is running low.

benl1981 Grand Master

benl1981

Posted
Posted

Yeah what about just a spray nozzle and a water cooling setup for the intercooler. Cheap to setup and may bring the inlet temps down slightly. All you need is a washer bottle and a spray nozzle and a switch.

Sounds like you may need the extra octane though...

The Mafia Grand Master

The Mafia

Posted
  • Author
Posted

nah, that method does like 2% difference.. Hardly worth it I reckon. And having it running all the time? I'd need to fill it up every second drive..

The one I am looking at has its own maf sensor, and will start th nozzle at a specified boost, and slowly increase the pressure as the boost increases. Its probably the smartest unit I have seen.

Cubes Grand Master

Cubes

Posted
Posted (edited)

200km's per tank is way way too low.

I'm still running the rb25det base map with my 3ltr, I use up to load point 13-14 for general driving before boost is made, once on boost its on to load point 16-17. The last tank of local driving (mostly 60km/h in to town etc) I managed 451km's. That was on ULP (due to lack of bp and mobil 98 fuel in SA + it helps me keep of it as its not tuned).

If I'm stuck in to it with 98 fuel then I see around 380-430km's per 50-53litres.

Rip the injectors out, get them flowed. It may be why you are unable to run any decent ign. timing. One may be stuffed causing only one cyl to ping.

Edited by Cubes
benl1981 Grand Master

benl1981

Posted
Posted

Yeah 200km is woeful. On base map mine will do about 450km to a tank. Check your load points, 02 sensor, maybe you have a leaky injector.

Cubes - do you think ULP is fine if you don't hit the accelerator hard ever. Just thinking if you knew you werent goign to hammer it for a week or 2 and jjust driving round town off boost most of the time would it be ok...

Cubes Grand Master

Cubes

Posted
Posted (edited)

ULP is fine in mine providing I dont run over 6psi.

So basically I keep it off more than that boost.

Mines not tuned so I really don't like giving it a bootfull as at around 5600rpm its going lean, sometimes I can't help myself in first and second if its running 98.. So I fill it with ULP and it forces me not to boot it or load it up excessively at low rpm (1500rpm in say 5th gear trying to climb a hill) :D

The 3ltr its quite good in traffic, I can take off quite quickly and be well ahead of the traffic changing gears at ~2500-3000rpm with light throttle and no boost.

I obviously run a PFC so I can keep an eye on detonation.

This is heading off topic.. .Sorry Mafia. :P

Edited by Cubes
benl1981 Grand Master

benl1981

Posted
Posted

Oh yeah - sorry Mafia. Yeah I try not to give mine too much either as Im not sure on the AFRs etc. Set rev limit to 5500rpm and try not to give it too much.

There's just no way you should be only getting 200km to a tank!! That must be so expensive to run. I'm annoyed when I only get 400km to the tank. Last car was a corolla 4AGE so I was spending literally half on petrol compared to now (Used about 7L/100km of regular vs. 12L/100km of premium). Hopefully after the tune I will average close to 10L/100km.

The tuner reckons these cars (R33s) should get 10L/100km

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