Police Powers And Your Rights

[Johnny Cash]

READ THIS FIRST!!!

DISCLAIMER:

Seeing as I had to open my big mouth, I'm going to try and compile a list of police powers and drivers rights. Will try to keep it as up-to-date and accurate as possible, but am not holding this information out as being reliable, and will not be liable for anything that results from using this information. I don't want to leave myself open to being sued for trying to help someone out (as I'm sure you can all understand).

I studied police power and procedure a couple years ago, and hopefully still have something lying around that may come in useful...

I will also have to find out if different States operate differently, and will try to start with my own State (S.A.) and work my way out. Will start with the basics, e.g. what you are entitled to tell police and do for them, what to look out for, and when to ask for a lawyer (which really puts the ***** up em!)

Bear in mind, I'm not trying to train you all up to give police a hard time, just let you all know what your rights are, and put an end to the abuse of police power that occurs all too often.

If you have any questions, or have interactions with a police officer that you want to explore with me, feel free to post in here.

Will try to get something down in the next few days. Thanks for looking...

[noise]

good idea.

Do WA

[m&m]

Thankyou.

[Johnny Cash]

QLD MEMBERS:

"Police Powers and Responsibilities Act 2000" seems to be a good place to look if you're in QLD: Link to the file should be attached to this posting.

Section 29 - Searching vehicles without warrant

Section 30 - Prescribed circumstances for searching vehicle without warrant

(When they refer to "reasonable suspicion", it doesn't just mean the officer says so, there has to be something of substance to make that suspicion reasonable. He can't just have a hunch).

Section 32 - Required to give Name and Address

Section 33 - Prescribed circumstances for requiring Name and Address

(Very important for officers that like to harass motorists!)

Part 6, Division 1 - Worth a read.

Section 51 - When Police Officers can stop you when you're driving your car.

Sections 54 and 55 - Powers to search vehicles, and when.

Part 6, Division 2 - When Police can tow your vehicle.

Section 228 - Right to Remain Silent (worth a read)

There's more to it, but thats a good hit up for QLD'ers!

PolicePowResA00.pdf

[Johnny Cash]

As a more basic and general introduction to the law, here's a basic rundown of your expectations and obligations as a motorist:

1) You HAVE to tell the officer your name and address.

2) You HAVE the right to request a lawyer at any point where YOU feel you require one.

3) You can ask and WILL receive the officers name and badge number where you request it, in furtherance of making a formal complaint.

4) You do NOT have to get out of the car if you do not want to (pretty sure this is still the case).

5) If an officer asks you for anything or to do anything, you can ask if you are legally required to, or if you must volunteer. This is especially important where an officer asks if he might enter your premises or examine your vehicle. It doesn't hurt to ask...

6) As a general rule, officers need 'reasonable suspicion' to do most anything. They cannot start harassing you out of the blue, it has to arise as a result of something that precedes your being pulled over.

7) Once you ask for a lawyer, you're entitled to one. If your request is denied, anything that follows on from here is inadmissible in court, as an improper police procedure has been executed at that point.

8) If in doubt, ask if you are required to do what is being asked of you. And if the answer is 'yes', refer that to a lawyer skilled in civil and criminal procedures...

The above is only a guide. Again, it is NOT gospel, and may have been repealed by laws enacted from the time of their inception. But it's better than nothing!

[GTR R35]

I found This for the NSW Police Act

Edited December 21, 2005 by 4DoorGTR

[Johnny Cash]

Yep, looks good. What we basically need to do is find one of these for each State, and then somehow compile a short list of rules and rights for people in each State.

I've never attempted something like this before, so bear with me. But remember, knowledge is power, and wouldn't it be nice to know your rights and entitlements next time you see a pair of flashing lights behind you...

[LO_R33]

Is it possible if anyone can answer this question?

The other day my mate got pulled over after a copper had been tailgating him for sometime (around 5 minutes or so) anyway my mate didn't know it was a policemen, and just hacked it for a while, then we attempted to run away (very stupid idea) anyway as soon as we did that the copper turned his lights on and pulled us over. He ended up coming up and saying 'your a stupid dickhead' as soon as he got to the window. We just looked at him, and he goes 'I'm going to book you for 100 in a 60 along such n such avenue' (which was when my friend probably was doing that speed, so yes he deserved it. Though this was somewhat 5minutes before hand.

IS the copper allowed to pull you over such an amount of time after you break the law?

As the copper grabbed his details and returned back to his car, i asked my mate if he could provide us with a speed reading that he got, and the policemen simply came back and said i 'estimated it'. Which i didnt think they were allowed to do?

Anyway, we both went out seperate ways.. and he never got the fine in the mail (months ago now).

So - are cops allowed to book you ages after you do something wrong? Specially if its speeding, and secondly, can they guess speeds?

Located in Canberra.

Dayne

[CEF11E]

I had an experience like that recently.

I was driving. I was sitting at a set of red lights and waiting to turn left. when the light went green I accelerated quickly to the speed limit. I did break traction for about 1 metre, just a bit. no huge burnout or anything silly just breaking traction.

there was an unmarked police car behind me as soon as I looked in the mirror. It followed me for 5 Min all the way across a suburb.

then I was flashed and I pulled over.

The officer asked me what I had done wrong, I said that I noticed they had been following me since the red light and admitted to accelerating quickly to the speed limit.

they took my licence and went back to the patrol car for 5 min and then came back and said they hadn't decded wether they were going to fine me or not untill they looked at my driving record

I was told I may get a fine in the mail

Now how the hell can you decide if an incident warrants a fine from previous history.

Either fine the person on the spot or not...

The way the officer said it was as if they "might" not fine me if they were in a good mood.

There demeaner was arrogant.

I must admit I used to really respect the police. but with the treatment I have been given with my last few incounters I have only contempt for them.

[SKY031]

Victoria

......covers what info you need to give to police, vehicle searches etc.

[writeoff]

Great thread Adrian.

I look forward to reading the rights and obligations of SA motorists.

[Johnny Cash]

To LO R33:

"So - are cops allowed to book you ages after you do something wrong? Specially if its speeding, and secondly, can they guess speeds?"

Yes, unfortunately he is, so long as it is a reasonable amount of time after. In this case, it would be. Sorry.

They can also estimate speeds, and although you can put this up to question, an officer will normally be believed in the court unless there is something by which you can cast doubt. But 100 in a 60 is something that an officer would be able to judge.

As I said earlier, this is not definite, but most probably the case. Sorry to ruin your day. Your only hope is that he was too slack to do the paperwork, or was just trying to incite the fear of God into you...

Either way, there's no use stressing about it now. If it turns up, it turns up. If you receive a notice, feel free to mention something about its contents on here and I'll give it a browse.

[Johnny Cash]

To CEF11E:

Yeah, police have whats known as 'discretionary power', which means it's basically up to them whether or not they decide to issue a fine, warning, or whatever.

Judging by what you've told me, the fine, if any, would be for making 'unnecessary noise or smoke', which carries a fine of around $100 last time I checked. That said, they could try for something like 'dangerous driving', but it would be a pretty shallow charge, considering you really haven't done anything wrong as far as motoring offences go.

As for your previous motoring history, you're right - they shouldn't determine whether or not to book you based on your driving record. The reason they wanted to check your driving history is to see if you often commit motoring offences, or if you're relatively clean. (And also to check if you're a mass-murderer wanted in several States )

Odds on, if your record is clean, they wouldn't issue a fine, but you never know if their quota is down. Again, these are not hard-and-fast rules, just opinion. I'll say this much, discretionary power is a *****.

[Nismo_Boy]

QLD MEMBERS:

"Police Powers and Responsibilities Act 2000" seems to be a good place to look if you're in QLD: Link to the file should be attached to this posting.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

VERY VERY interesting, I wish I had that when I sued Queensland Transport and had the officers in question taken to task, won anyway, but would have made it a lot easier.

The powers to search a car will come in handy with my mobile phone court case soon, and how an officer searched my car for a phone he had a "hunch" was in there!

Awesome find Jonny.

Edited December 22, 2005 by Nismo_Boy

[Johnny Cash]

Glad to help - Knowledge is power. B)

[benm]

3) You can ask and WILL receive the officers name and badge number where you request it, in furtherance of making a formal complaint.

About 5-6mths ago I was pulled over and after being annoyed by them I requested their badge numbers (a male and female cop) and was refused on more than 10 requests that I asked. A further 200m up the road where I was pulled over again by the same 2 officers (long stupid story, won't go into it) they called for backup including some head cop guy that was on duty and some other officers that came bounding over gutters and front lawns

Even he refused to give me their badge numbers and names etc etc and after another 15mins of bullshit he gave me a business card with his name and office phone number on it.

So whilst they may 'have' to give you certain details, their really isn't much you can do if they refuse to give the details to you. All it will do is add fuel to the fire and put you deeper in the shit.

I've pretty much learnt now that cops can and will do whatever they want and we really have no say in the matter even if the law is on our side so instead just smile

[croat]

JOHNNY CASH as far as i know (NSW) police are not allowed to guess speeds. If you are doing some crazy speed they may be able to get you on some other grounds but for speeding they cant. When pulled over speeding always ask for a radar/lidar reading (they must show you this). Otherwise dont accept a ticket.

[Johnny Cash]

I've pretty much learnt now that cops can and will do whatever they want and we really have no say in the matter even if the law is on our side so instead just smile

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thats true to a certain extent, but what you have to realize is, at the point where you ask for their names and badge numbers, they have to tell you. If they don't, they are not following proper police procedure, and as such, can face penalties and various disciplinary action.

What's best to do in such a case where police refuse to give such information is record the licence plates on the police vehicle, and record the date and time. The station should be able to track down who was the officer you were talking to, although they may (understandably) be reluctant to give this information.

But it does put them on notice that you're not to be taken lightly, and reminding them that they are obliged to do something and will face disciplinary action if they do not can strike the fear of God back into them

[Johnny Cash]

JOHNNY CASH as far as i know (NSW) police are not allowed to guess speeds. If you are doing some crazy speed they may be able to get you on some other grounds but for speeding they cant. When pulled over speeding always ask for a radar/lidar reading (they must show you this). Otherwise dont accept a ticket.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK, well I'm not an expert on all of this, though it seems I might have to become one! This post is doing better than I thought it would. I'll look into it, maybe even contact some solicitors in NSW, and see what the word is. One way they get around things is to say they were doing 60km/h and you were pulling away, or something like that.

Also, senior officers will attest to their years of experience and ability to estimate speeds, and judges normally aren't too eager to stop them. That said, I will get into the NSW legislation and procedure rulebook, and see if I can't nut anything out.

[SKY031]

The station should be able to track down who was the officer you were talking to, although they may (understandably) be reluctant to give this information.

I once asked for an officers badge number.

It was refused.

I called the station to try to get details of the officer.

I gave details of the incident to the call taker, (including the number on the car, the location and time of incident) and I was told the officer would "be dealt with", but I was still denied the reqiured information.

For all I know, the person who took the call could have been the same officer who refused to give his details to me in the first place.